ExAvantair People

[fastflyer15]

Part of life

Note the quiet board...

Is everybody happy???

 

[myrealnameis]

I can hardly wait for see that card in the mail again. The last one I recieved looked like some 5 year old made it on construction paper. It actually looked like it was cut out with plastic safety scissors. Perhaps there is a kindergarden connection............this may need futher investigation.

Relax my fellow Avaitors, the cards will be mailed once again.

Can you, we, go the distance.

The question is not how far. The question is, do you possess the constitution, the depth of faith, to go as far as is needed?

 

[B19 Flyer]

I don't know who started this post, or what his cause is, but this much is true: The list of good, hardworking people who are no longer with this company because of backstabbing, knowing too much information, personal vendettas, and speaking out for what is fair and right, etc., is long. Maybe this stuff does happen elsewhere as someone else noted, but that doesnt make it right. And to those people who are moving up the chain of command rather quickly who think " Oh, they would never do that to me," to those people I say beware. Any employee here is a scapegoat waiting for their time. Smart people here work the line and keep their head below the radar.

One would think that an unhappy work group would be all over this post in agreement. The silence is deafening! This clearly indicates to me that the change in DO has obviously had a calming effect on the company.

It also seems that the quote above comes from a disgruntled employee that spends far too much time being paranoid about micromanaging their surroundings and the people around them than doing what it takes to be part of the team and getting the job done.

 

[angryoneincher]

One would think that an unhappy work group would be all over this post in agreement. The silence is deafening! This clearly indicates to me that the change in DO has obviously had a calming effect on the company.

Maybe most people are happy, and that's fine. It doesnt make what's happened in the past up till not long ago not true. And leopards don't change their spots- they lay and wait. This company has screwed alot of people over- just because they havent in the last 3 weeks is no reason to stand on a chair and sing their praises. But maybe you're right- things are now hunky dory- unlikely though. Usually calm waters just precede the next storm.

It also seems that the quote above comes from a disgruntled employee that spends far too much time being paranoid about micromanaging their surroundings and the people around them than doing what it takes to be part of the team and getting the job done.

How does having an opinion automatically translate to micromanaging anything? Such a comment makes you look stupid when you dont know a thing about how I've formed my opinion. My opinion was and is being formed by knowing a lot about unscrupulous things I've seen happen and good people treated like crap by management that doesnt care about anyone but themselves. If they have fooled you into thinking they care about you, that makes you fairly pathetic. Wait until something goes down where you need backup- you'll find out quickly how things change. And I'm not disgruntled at all- I just call it the way I see it. If that is different from how you see it, so be it. YOU are not going to change my mind. I could maybe change yours with the information I have, but not the other way around.

 

[fastflyer15]

Most of us understand that any employer/employee situation lends itself only to what we can produce today. When we can not or will not (or slam the company continually) produce today the employer has no other option than to terminate the relationship. After all we are taking their money. Business, strickly business. Some employers are better than others in the "taking care of" business. The employer/ employee relationship is a business transaction. Maybe you did not protect yourself in the beginning as you should have. Don't let personal vendettas or feelings get in the way of your future business plans. Let there be no doubt...Business is business...Avantair will protect itself, it is their fudiciary duty, and you need to as well...
After all some of us really enjoy it here...

 

[Noodles]

I don't think the change in DO has had any impact yet. It's more of a wait and see kind of thing.

Also, people that work for Avantair have to be very careful giving an honest opinion. It'll get you fired.

 

[flyboy'sfriend]

Shhhh!

I agree with these guys, it's all slight of hand at AVair, I hear that the Mx is really atrocious!

 

[myrealnameis]

I agree with these guys, it's all slight of hand at AVair, I hear that the Mx is really atrocious!

WTF, who the hell are you to make that kind of remark against those hard working mechanics, its bad enough that they get treated like second class citizens, but to get bashed by some jacka*s like you is crossing the line. Sure the airplane is a maintenance whore, but what can you expect from an airplane that was designed to fly 10 hours a month. You cant blame the mechanics for that? I could make the statement that flyboys friend cant fly worth a sh*t, and that your a*s is planted in the right seat with no hope of upgrade in sight because of it. Would that be a fair rumor to spread? Or would that be atrocious?!

 

[myrealnameis]

I don't think the change in DO has had any impact yet. It's more of a wait and see kind of thing.

Also, people that work for Avantair have to be very careful giving an honest opinion. It'll get you fired.

Only if you personally attack the Big Mans wife on the internet.

 

[hangarrat]

I heard the grass is greener on the other side. I heard the sky is falling and I heard that i dont have to pay taxes because its unconstitutional.

i believe everything i hear

 

[avbug]

Sure the airplane is a maintenance whore, but what can you expect from an airplane that was designed to fly 10 hours a month.

Setting aside the liklihood that merely posting in this thread may risk lowering one's intelligence quotient by several points...I've long been a proponent of the concept that a poor carpenter blames his tools.

I've had a look at the TCDS for the avanti, as well as the aircraft and component life limitations section of the maintenance manual, and I haven't found any place where that, or any other airplane, has been designed to operate 10 hours a month. If someone can back up that assertion (that gets bantied around a lot, for a number of different airplanes), I'd surely like to hear of it.

Fact is, an airplane is designed to perform to a given standard, and it's provided the continued airworthiness instructions to make that happen...w(h)eather it's used ten hours a month or several hundred...the condition of the aircraft is strictly the responsibility of the owner/operator. PERIOD.

I really hate hearing excuses such as the idea that the aircraft was designed to fly less, therefore acceptance of lesser maintenance is okay. A wise soul once opined that justification is the narcotic of the soul...the industry is awash with addicts.

The airworthiness issues are dear to my heart, as I've spent a lot of time close to airworthiness issues. Either the aircraft meets approved data and it's safe, or not. If not, then it's not airworthy, and no amount of justification will make it so.

If it meets approved data, and is safe, then you have no issues. Don't try to color the issue; it's fairly black and white.

 

[Autoparts2]

The new DO

Word on the street is that MYREALNAME is the new DO C.M lurking on this board. You might want to watch what is said because it may bite you in the end.

My 2 cents

 

[Takeoffroll]

The P180 needs no more or no less shop time than any other aircraft I have flown. My experience with the maintenance of this aircraft is no different than with other aircraft that I have flown. It doesn’t matter if its a C172 or a Learjet. Things break from time to time. Some times they fix themselves, some times they stay broken. It is always easier for maintenance to fix what stays broken. What professional pilot hasn't experienced these conditions. I back our maintenance guys on this. They do their best to get things done the right way. Pilots whining about maintenance is not new. And neither are disgruntled employees. I would say this thread has its share of both.

This thread reads like a bad conspiracy story. Personally, I think the DaVinci Code is a better story than this one. And it is more believable.

 

[avbug]

I couldn't care less were it the CEO, DO, DoM, Chief Bottle Washer, Head Lineboy, or King of Siam. I've never been particularly careful here or elsewhere in political matters; leave that to curtain climbing brass and yuppies. Call a spade a spade.

I have yet to see an airplane so poorly designed that it's meant only to fly ten hours a month. I have yet to see an aircraft that's limited to ten hours a month. I've yet to see an aircraft for which the manufacturer ever designed or intended only a ten hour a month useage.

I've heard from a number of your personnel this same excuse; "what can you expect from an aircraft that was only designed to fly a few hours a month?" Well, I'll tell you what you can expect. You can expect full airworthiness and performance, period, bar nothing. End of story.

If any of YOU expect anything LESS, then you're doing something very, very wrong. It either works, or it doesn't, period. If you are flying an aircraft which is not airworthy, if it isn't legal and safe, then you're in violation, and you're an idiot. Not to mention criminal.

If you're flying an aircraft that's legal and safe, then you have nothing about which to complain.

Either way, this isn't the forum to do it. Your company has channels within which to handle these issues. I don't believe for a minute that this is the place to whine, any more than a man should cry to those outside his marriage that his wife doesn't love him. What he should do is find a way to make himself a little more loveable, and if you're having internal problems in your company, then find a way to fix them internally. Coming here will do exactly squat for you.

Now this thread has been formed from sheer idiocy; it's made up of the bitter, the uninformed, the angry, and those who represent what at best is a fringe element to any operation. Most likely a number of the players aren't even employed there...some admit as much. Possibly one or more that have been fired or quit. If any of you fit in that category, then shut up already; you're free, you're out of there, let it go. You're going to have health problems if you keep up that level of consternation.

Regardless of your category, don't try to justify your acts by suggesting for one second that the aircraft is overutilized, and therefore one cannot expect or one can accept a lesser level of maintenance. If the aircraft flies more, then it will require more attention...however, it should never be in less than a fully airworthy condition. For those of you who are flying the line and crying about this, consider that both the first and last line of defense against flying an aircraft with issues is the PIC. If there's a problem in the cockpit or with the aircraft, then the person responsible for addressing this, and for refusing to fly it, is the PIC.

Don't blame the mechanic. Don't blame the company. If the aircraft is broken and you decide to fly it, then you have one person to blame. It's not the director of operations for your company, nor the CEO of the airframe manufacturer, nor the inspector who approved the fittings attached to your fuel controller. It's you. Don't justify, don't throw blame. If you accept it, it's all yours. If you can't accept it, then don't...but don't throw a fit about it. State the facts, handle it like a professional adult, and move on.

 

[B19 Flyer]

Word on the street is that MYREALNAME is the new DO C.M lurking on this board. You might want to watch what is said because it may bite you in the end.

My 2 cents

To my understanding, this new DO doesn't manage by fear, paranoia and micro-management as the former one did. Even if it is him, (which I doubt) he doesn't appear to subscribe to the same methods as before which means a new chapter is being written and the other one is gone. I've heard that this new DO is fair to crewmembers and is very approachable. This thread was started by mistruths and halftruths told as stories that have never been specifically stated or proven with fact. This tells me that they were B.S. from the start. All the positive threads to support Avantair prove that employees there are on the whole happy and enjoy working for the company. Those that bash the company are either bitter and misguided, after drinking koolaide that leaves them with a sour taste in their mouth. They've got the right to move on into an organization that is more in line with what they believe is right, and to leave the rest of the Avantair employees alone. The airplane appears to serve the company well, and the pilots appear to be happy and very defensive of the company. Those that post bitterly apparently don't really know what they are talking about, and should just GET OVER IT and move on!

 

[Mr. Pebbles]

To my understanding, this new DO doesn't manage by fear, paranoia and micro-management as the former one did. Even if it is him, (which I doubt) he doesn't appear to subscribe to the same methods as before which means a new chapter is being written and the other one is gone. I've heard that this new DO is fair to crewmembers and is very approachable. This thread was started by mistruths and halftruths told as stories that have never been specifically stated or proven with fact. This tells me that they were B.S. from the start. All the positive threads to support Avantair prove that employees there are on the whole happy and enjoy working for the company. Those that bash the company are either bitter and misguided, after drinking koolaide that leaves them with a sour taste in their mouth. They've got the right to move on into an organization that is more in line with what they believe is right, and to leave the rest of the Avantair employees alone. The airplane appears to serve the company well, and the pilots appear to be happy and very defensive of the company. Those that post bitterly apparently don't really know what they are talking about, and should just GET OVER IT and move on!

Interesting. I run into quite a few crews from Avantair and they all sing a different tune than you are. They are all very close mouthed, but they do mangage to convey the idea that they are just killing time until something better comes along. Mangagement that can't be trusted is a theme that keeps popping up....... maybe you're the one on the koolaid????

 

[hangarrat]

Mr. Pebbles is a reliable source - I would believe anything he says. yes I would, uh huh, sure nuf. He knows what he's talkin 'bout.

 

[Mr. Pebbles]

Mr. Pebbles is a reliable source - I would believe anything he says. yes I would, uh huh, sure nuf. He knows what he's talkin 'bout.

Were you drunk when you wrote this? Either that or you are a major hick.

 

[Syncit]

I think Mr Pebbles is Mr DO.

 

[Mr. Pebbles]

I think Mr Pebbles is Mr DO.

Not quite. Did make me smile though to read that. No, if I were the DO, I wouldnt sleep at night for fear of losing my job as anyone who takes that job has 6-12 months left and I sleep fine.