Ever aborted a takoff for a faulty airspeed indicator?

[RideTheWind]

"Faulty airspeed" high speed abort

Wonder how often this happens? Towed to the gate with hot brakes, wonder how fast they were going when they decided to abort?


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** Report created 3/22/2005 Record 1 **
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IDENTIFICATION
Regis#: SWA619 Make/Model: B737 Description: 737
Date: 03/18/2005 Time: 1451

Event Type: Incident Highest Injury: Minor Mid Air: N Missing: N
Damage: Unknown

LOCATION
City: ONTARIO State: CA Country: US

DESCRIPTION
ACFT, SWA619, FROM ONTARIO, CA TO SACRAMENTO, CA, ABORTED TAKEOFF DUE TO A
FAULTY AIRSPEED INDICATOR. ACFT WAS TOWED TO THE GATE WITH HOT BRAKES. 3
PASSENGERS WERE TREATED AND RELEASED AND ONE WAS TRANSPORTED WITH NECK
INJURIES. ALL PASSENGERS WERE DEPLANED NORMALLY. ONTARIO, CA

INJURY DATA Total Fatal: 0
# Crew: 4 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0 Unk:
# Pass: 0 Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 4 Unk: Y
# Grnd: Fat: 0 Ser: 0 Min: 0 Unk:

WEATHER: NOT REPORTED

OTHER DATA
Activity: Business Phase: Take-off Operation: Air Carrier

Departed: ONTARIO, CA Dep Date: Dep. Time:
Destination: SACRAMENTO, CA Flt Plan: UNK Wx Briefing: U
Last Radio Cont: UNKN
Last Clearance: UNKN

FAA FSDO: RIVERSIDE, CA (WP21) Entry date: 03/21/2005

 

[avbug]

Yes, I have.

Lessee...they didn't over-run at the end, so it couldn't have been SWA...

 

[Long Time Gone]

Watched a 747-200 abort once in Sanford, FL with the same problem (later found out, of course). A very interesting specticle at the time.

LTG

 

[Immelman]

3rd solo flight as a student. Pitot tube hits bee as i'm leaving the ground. Figured it would be better, since already airborne, to take it around the pattern. The airspeed bounced between 0 and 40 knots or so for a few seconds before going kaput. Landed a bit hot but did okay.

Pitch + power = performance.

 

[Flying Illini]

I wonder if the pax that were injured had their seatbelts fastened tight enough or not.
I notice that most of our pax (corporate) don't wear their seatbelts (when straightening the cabin after a flight and few to none of the seatbelts need to be straightened). I'm just waiting for something like this to happen on our aircraft and have multiple injuries. It doesn't seem to matter how much you brief the turbulence or flash the seatbelt sign, for some reason they feel that they are immune from problems on their private jet.

 

[HMR]

I notice that most of our pax (corporate) don't wear their seatbelts (when straightening the cabin after a flight and few to none of the seatbelts need to be straightened). I'm just waiting for something like this to happen on our aircraft and have multiple injuries.

You guys don't check to see that everyone's buckled in? If there's an accident you might have some 'splainin' to do.

 

[FlyingBuckI]

I rented a 150 back in '00...took off and the a/s went dead. It was a small grass strip with a nice big hill across the road. Needless to say I was skimming the trees in a shallow bank trying to get turned around. Pulled out the gps after I was airborne and had my buddy read speeds off to me as I was landing. When I told the renter about it he said "oh yeah, I forgot about that. I couldn't get the bee out so I just left it in there."

 

[Flying Illini]

You guys don't check to see that everyone's buckled in? If there's an accident you might have some 'splainin' to do.

We do on all charters...but yet the still seem to be coming up front for coffee or catering while the seatbelt sign is still illuminated.
On all flights we ensure that everyone is "familiar with the use of the seat belts" but no, we don't walk the isle and chide them if the belts aren't on. We do flash the seatbelt sign as part of our Line-Up checklist.

 

[HMR]

We do on all charters...but yet the still seem to be coming up front for coffee or catering while the seatbelt sign is still illuminated.

I know that drill. When I flew 135 I kept sqwaking the gear handle because I thought it was connected to the "We're 10' off the ground, better go get some cofee" sign.

 

[Immelman]

On a note to the spam can drivers & CFIs (not sure how this affects jets so much): I think its a good, nay, excellent exercise for CFIs to make students practice with the entire panel covered to assist in learning to control the airplane by pitch+power+seat of pants reference. If my primary CFI hadn't done this pre-solo, prior to my 'bee' incident, I wouldn't have felt nearly as well about it.

He had me practice slow flight and turns in a Traumahawk (at safe altitude) with the panel covered up this way... great exercise.

 

[MTpilot]

I aborted a takeoff in a 182, the airspeed was lagging, We taxied to the big runway (9000ft) and took off with the airpeed indicating 20 kts, flew along a little bit and set her back down. Pitot was all crudded up.

 

[RideTheWind]

Anyone can fly a single engine plane without an airspeed indicator, the post was aimed at high speed aborts because of a faulty airspeed indicator like the FAA report above.

 

[MTpilot]

Well EXCUSE ME!

 

[b82rez]

Anyone can fly a single engine plane without an airspeed indicator, the post was aimed at high speed aborts because of a faulty airspeed indicator like the FAA report above.

With the cross check @ 80 kts, there should rarely be a high speed abort for an A/S indicator. I've done a few in a 1900 after the aircraft was sitting out all night, but that's a far cry from a 73 or bigger.

It looks like everything went great, except some people just weren't strapped in tight enough. Passengers are too complacent with flying anyway.

 

[filejw]

High speed aborts are a hard call.Above 80 kts its eng fail, fire or loss of control for me other wise I'm flying .

 

[Weasil]

Part 25 aircraft have more than one airspeed indicator. I certainly wouldn't reject above 80kts for the failure of one of them. I wonder what the rest of this story is going to be.

 

[LR25]

Took off in a banner tow plane, turned and lined up with the poles and saw that the airspeed was at 0. I guess I dont look at the airspeed until I go to pick up banners to fine tune the speed.

 

[slowto250]

Performed an RTO years back in my ultralight. The Rotax coughed at @ 14 kts, and I called abort (to myself). My Converse Allstars were still smoking when I taxied back in. Consulted the POH, but couldn't find any brake energy charts, or cooldown times, so I re-launched. Don't know WTF this has to do with the orig. post, but thought I'd add my considerable aviation knowledge to the mix

 

[KeroseneSnorter]

Performed an RTO years back in my ultralight. The Rotax coughed at @ 14 kts, and I called abort (to myself). My Converse Allstars were still smoking when I taxied back in. Consulted the POH, but couldn't find any brake energy charts, or cooldown times, so I re-launched. Don't know WTF this has to do with the orig. post, but thought I'd add my considerable aviation knowledge to the mix

Dude.....you are in BIG trouble!!!!!!!!

The Converse Allstars were never rated for a high speed RTO.....they required tear down and inspection prior to any further flights. The feds are going to be quite peeved with you!!!!!

You obviously mistook your allstars with the more modern Converse Jimmy Conners model.....unlike the Allstars, the Conners were fully tested and came with a brake energy chart, as well as cooldown times. I cannot believe that you were operating Allstars and were ignorant of the massive emergency AD's that were associated with them concerning high temperature seperation of structural glues and rubber breakdown!!!!!!!!!!!!

Shame on you for operating in such an unsafe manner!!!!!

 

[UnAnswerd]

Flight school owner told a funny story. Lifted off with some passengers in the airplane. While climbing, noticed zero indicated airspeed. Airplane had a PA system, and he informed passengers that he had to land and "secure a door". With PA still activated, co-pilot starts yelling, "you left your pitot cover on"!!!

 

[slowto250]

Dude.....you are in BIG trouble!!!!!!!!

The Converse Allstars were never rated for a high speed RTO.....they required tear down and inspection prior to any further flights. The feds are going to be quite peeved with you!!!!!

You obviously mistook your allstars with the more modern Converse Jimmy Conners model.....unlike the Allstars, the Conners were fully tested and came with a brake energy chart, as well as cooldown times. I cannot believe that you were operating Allstars and were ignorant of the massive emergency AD's that were associated with them concerning high temperature seperation of structural glues and rubber breakdown!!!!!!!!!!!!

Shame on you for operating in such an unsafe manner!!!!!

Truth be told, I am an FAA designated examiner, with check airman status on the aforementioned equipment. Due to pressure from my own field office, and subsequent to this incident, I was forced to violate myself and issued a 30 day suspension to the offending airman (me).

You were correct in your assessment of my infraction, as I am now painfully aware. I can only hope that I have learned my lesson.

Sure hope this does not hurt my chances, when I finally get that Gulfstream Int'l interview. Only time will tell.

 

[dmspilot00]

I rented a 150 back in '00...took off and the a/s went dead. It was a small grass strip with a nice big hill across the road. Needless to say I was skimming the trees in a shallow bank trying to get turned around. Pulled out the gps after I was airborne and had my buddy read speeds off to me as I was landing. When I told the renter about it he said "oh yeah, I forgot about that. I couldn't get the bee out so I just left it in there."

Is anyone else confused?

As a sidebar, I glanced at the groundspeed on the GPS the other day while I was on final... 20 kt difference in calm wind.

 

[Lead Sled]

Part 25 aircraft have more than one airspeed indicator. I certainly wouldn't reject above 80kts for the failure of one of them. I wonder what the rest of this story is going to be.

The problems arise when the PNF is busy puttzing around with the power levers and misses the 80 knot cross check (and often V1 and rotate...). At that point it becomes a high speed abort - not something to be taken lightly. Once you're in the air, it becomes a non-issue - most jets have an angle of attack indicator as well. With one of those, who needs an ASI for landing?

'Sled

 

[KeroseneSnorter]

Truth be told, I am an FAA designated examiner, with check airman status on the aforementioned equipment. Due to pressure from my own field office, and subsequent to this incident, I was forced to violate myself and issued a 30 day suspension to the offending airman (me).

You were correct in your assessment of my infraction, as I am now painfully aware. I can only hope that I have learned my lesson.

Sure hope this does not hurt my chances, when I finally get that Gulfstream Int'l interview. Only time will tell.

I think you can kiss that career at GIA goodbye! Considering the competitive nature of todays PFT operations, I doubt that they would consider anyone that wears Allstars. From what I hear, unless it is top of the line Nike's, or special edition Puma's.....you are out of luck!

 

[b82rez]

The problems arise when the PNF is busy puttzing around with the power levers and misses the 80 knot cross check (and often V1 and rotate...). At that point it becomes a high speed abort - not something to be taken lightly. Once you're in the air, it becomes a non-issue - most jets have an angle of attack indicator as well. With one of those, who needs an ASI for landing?

'Sled

The problem is the equipment you're flying. Get a FADEC...GOSH!!

 

[slowto250]

I think you can kiss that career at GIA goodbye! Considering the competitive nature of todays PFT operations, I doubt that they would consider anyone that wears Allstars. From what I hear, unless it is top of the line Nike's, or special edition Puma's.....you are out of luck!

Great news ! Just spoke to the recruiter, er.....director of operations, down at GIA.
He informs me that for only about 25 grand, they can overlook this incident. Further, he just about guaranteed me an interview !
As soon as the check clears.

 

[typhoonpilot]

Part 25 aircraft have more than one airspeed indicator. I certainly wouldn't reject above 80kts for the failure of one of them. I wonder what the rest of this story is going to be.

I've handed over control over 80 knots. On the takeoff roll we took a bird in the left pitot tube and my airspeed stagnated, I quickly looked over to the F.O.'s airspeed and saw that his was good as well as the standby and said, "you have control". It worked out well because we both heard the bird hit and were looking at the same things and he figured it out as quickly as me that it would be better for him to take control and continue the takeoff. This was in an MD-80.

One time I was on the jumpseat of a Northwest 747 from Taipei to Tokyo. The F.O was flying and right after rotation he noticed that his airspeed was not accelerating as it should. The Captain took over and then said that his airspeed was not reading correct. I could see the F.O.s airspeed and it indeed had frozen just under 200 KIAS. I couldn't see the Captain's as I was seated right behind him. I quickly said a prayer that they not screw this up like the Northwest 727 crew did many years ago. They were on top of it though and had the engineer reading the loss of airspeed checklist and started flying with attitude and known power settings. They also referenced the inertial for groundspeed and queried ATC for a groundspeed readout. They came around in a large pattern to a 20 mile final and made a good landing without much trouble. It was relly impressive to see their teamwork and how well they managed the problem. About 1.5 hours later the mechanics in Taipei had fixed the aircraft. There was indeed a problem with both airspeed indications, one from a CADC and the other from another problem.


TP

 

[FlyingBuckI]

Is anyone else confused?

not sure if you're confused about the situation or the idea that I was trying to use the GPS as a measure of speed. I knew it wouldn't be accurate, but at least I would have some idea of where I was at. I figured at slow speeds, close to the ground, GPS would be fairly accurate in 0kt conditions. Seemed to work pretty well in my situation, though I never tried it again with a working asi except when I was at altitude on a XC.

 

[Lead Sled]

The problem is the equipment you're flying. Get a FADEC...GOSH!!

You're right, besides girls like guys with FADEC skillz.

'Sled

 

[dmspilot00]

not sure if you're confused about the situation or the idea that I was trying to use the GPS as a measure of speed.

No, the entire thing doesn't make sense.