ERJ and the Wind

[MJG]

Anyone else flying in the Northeast today? Holly sh1t it was windy. Just curious what other 145 drivers think about the elevator and the gust lock on days like this. You know when the a/c is pointed downwind while on the ground and the elevator is slamming back and forth against the gust lock which translates through to the yoke which is making noises that "you're not supposed to be hearing".

Honestly it can't be good for the control cables. I'm afraid this will end up killing a bunch of innocent people one day and we'll all look back and say "told you so".

 

[KingAirer]

DO you guys have the Mechanical or Electric Gust Lock?

 

[MJG]

We have both at XJET. Originally the a/c came with purely mechanical locks but they are slowly modifying the fleet to use an electro-mechanical lock. It's supposed to work better.

 

[TSA Pilot]

Believe it or not when your back is to the wind the best thing you can do for the elevator on the EMB is to release the gust lock watch your "unit"! and try to let it ease all the way back towards you and this stops the slamming of the elevator into the gust lock and works quite well. It will stay there by itself just from the wind alone, of course when the airplane turns back around into the wind you can put the gustlock back on.

I flew in to DCA this afternoon and I have to say that it was one of the roughest approaches I have ever shot, impossible to maintain airspeed and getting slammed against the seatbelts with the amber "WINDSHEAR" alert going off. On a positive note we had a 612 Knot groundspeed going there

TSA Pilot

 

[amaineiac]

Try setting the pitch trim as far down as it goes.

Just remember to reset it before takeoff.

 

[MJG]

Interesting, I'll have to give these suggestions a try sometime.

 

[erj-145mech]

Honestly it can't be good for the control cables.

There is a unit under the cockpit floor called the temperature compensator in the elevator control system that are essentially adjustable springs, and will take up the cable "slack". The elevator cable tensions on the EMB-135/145 are between 45 and 63 lbs, whereas the cables on the ailerons and rudder are in the neighborhood of 120 lbs. When the cables are originally installed, they are tensioned to 150% of the tension to "pre-tension" them.

All this goes to show you that gust loads will not harm the cables.

And at XJT, we have discontinued the retrofit of the electro mechanical gust locks, due to an FAA AD note that is issued against them. Seems, that they are creating more problems than they are worth.

 

[Mr Hat]

Hmm, Thanks Emb Mech, That was informative. I'll feel a little better about the slamming now.
On a side note, I had that tentioner fail one day which created one hell of a tail buffet in flight a few years ago. Did an emergency landing in Baltimore. That one scared the crap out of me, all I could think of was that story of the E120 crew who had the tail come off in flight due to a maintainence error.
While they were looking at the tail, I got to see the assembly, did you guys know that stab is held on by ONE bolt. Its a big bolt but theres only one.

 

[nfkealey]

Watch your boys! (or girls!)

Winds at PIT on Thursday were so strong (gusts to 50kts), they BROKE the gust locks of two ERJ-145s while on the ground! One while parked at the gate, the one I was in, the other while waiting in line for departure. Seems the older ERJs with the Mechanical locks are a little more susceptible than newer ones with the Electro-mechanical locks. Watch your goods. After pinning the yoke with our feet, both CPT and FO, we were able to temporarily hold off the flailing yoke with some seat belt extensions. Reminded me of gust locking a smaller aircraft. Needless to say, yesterday in Boston we were a little more attentive to the gust lock situation with our ass in the breeze!

 

[328dude]

One of our Dorks got broke in HPN as well that day. Same thing, gust lock.

 

[captjim]

I was in Pit on Thursday and indeed it was not to fun below 10,000.

In CLE I beleave, CAL had a 737-800 weather vain 90 degrees and hit it's tail on a jetway! Now thats windy.

 

[ASH]

We had a 73 get slammed into the jetway Thurs, BUF.
Nasty

 

[w4mch]

The CRJ doesn't have gust locks, but I thought you guys would like to hear my Thursday wind sob story anyway.

Got a call on Tuesday from (s)crew scheduling. "A check airman wants your day trip on Thursday, would you allow it?" Sure I said as I looked at the weather channel. Our contract requires us to either take it as a drop or sit last call reserve for the original duty period. I chose resv and commuted in to base (IAD) wed nite for a lazy day at the crash pad. Woke up late Thurs morning to the sound of howling winds and trees crashing in the neighborhood. Logged on to the company computer system from the pad and didn't see any scheduling notifications. Watched TV, read magazines, took a nap and retreived pieces of vinyl siding that were peeling off the house. Duty period expired, a nice dinner was had (hic, burp) and 7:50 pay was earned for my generosity.

On Friday I checked in for the same trip and asked my FO "so, how'ed it go yesterday with the check pilot? Did she get current?" My FO gave me the finger and threatened me with bodily harm if I ever did that to him again while relating 3 wind shear go arounds on the last leg home.

As the old saying goes: Flying in weather is 90% timing, 10% luck & 0% skill.

 

[FightTheFuture]

...Duty period expired, a nice dinner was had (hic, burp) and 7:50 pay was earned for my generosity....

You guys get 7 hours 50 minutes of flight pay for reserve at ACA?

 

[w4mch]

As I am a line holder and "allowed" an instructor to take my trip, I got the trip value (7:50) for the day in exchange for being placed on what we call RT(reserve for the original duty on/off period). I don't "do reserve" in the usual sense, but I think a reserve line is 75 hours for 11 days off. I think that works out to 3:45 per day, but there are ways to bump this up and make over 80 hrs/month if one is flexable. FWIW, my line this month is 19 off, 91 hrs guarantee with 8 days off for turkey day (not vacation). It is good to be single digit seniority. So far, I've had two days of self imposed RT (ResT?) this month and hope some instructor will pick up another one. They love high block day trips.

BTW, we do not have junior manning at ACA, but one can be extended (rarely happens) 4 hrs block/5 hours duty at the end of a trip, up to 14 hours scheduled duty.

 

[FightTheFuture]

ahh, thx for the reply.

 

[MJG]

Re: Re: ERJ and the Wind

All this goes to show you that gust loads will not harm the cables.

And at XJT, we have discontinued the retrofit of the electro mechanical gust locks, due to an FAA AD note that is issued against them. Seems, that they are creating more problems than they are worth.

All good to know, thanks for the reply.

 

[philcohen]

ERJ and the wind

As someone already pointed out, if you release the gustlock and let the yoke all the way back when downwind it will stay there and not get buffetted around and make scary noises.

In addition to this, I also put my lapbelt around the yoke (careful of the little plastic tube of wires and the shaker cables) and tighten it just to make sure it stays there.

 

[sabreliner]

Where do the controls lock on the BrasiliaJet?? On the BrasiliaProp we didn't have this problem, and we had a mechanical lock that held the controls full left and I think full forward. Worked pretty well but you couldn't taxi around with the controls locked.

On the CRJ, we don't need it with the hydraulic controls. Yet another reason I like it better than that Brasilia with 2 jet engines some TV screens and a new wing!!