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El Al Pilot Reported Missile Explosion..

TMMT

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06:27 Jul-05-02

El Al Pilot Reported Missile Explosion Next to Plane (IsraelNN.com)

An El Al pilot reported what appeared to be a surface-to-air missile exploding next to a flight. The plane was heading from Tel Aviv to Russia. The flight landed without incident in Moscow.

El Al officials reported with certainty the plane was not in military airspace, but in a regular international commercial lane.



Holy Sheet! The world has gone nucking futs...
:eek:
 

atpcliff

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Hi!

I know a LtCol in an F-16 reserve unit. One of their pilots also flies for Condor (cargo) out of Germany. He told the LtCol he has been shot at with missles a number of time flying in Africa. He said the A-320 has a good roll rate, and it's easy to avoid the missles. He has been shot at more times in the A-320 than in his F-16!

El Al aircraft have electronics to help defeat missle attacks. I have a friend at Gulfstream, and he said most of the new Gulfstreams have anti-missile technology on them also.

I hope I don't get shot at!!!

Cliff
 

avbug

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"He said the A-320 has a good roll rate, and it's easy to avoid the missles. "

Garbage.

Shooting goes on in Africa as well as many other places, but recognize a line of manure when you hear it. Nice roll rate? Easy to avoid missles? Uh-huh.
 

ATRCA

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Gulfstreams with "anti-missle" technology.

Come on dude, get out of the house once in a while. Take a quiet walk, everything will be ok.

Trust me.


I really dont know wether or not they have that technology just sounds a little fishy to me. Who knows.
 

EagleRJ

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The anti-missile option for Gulfstreams exists. I saw one at a trade show several years ago. The unit replaces the tailcone on the airplane, and has three gold-tinted windows facing aft. I don't know exactly how it works, but it will interfere with the tracking system on IR missiles and cause them to miss or detonate prematurely.

This is a bigger threat than you may think. Besides missile events in Europe and the US, there is a major threat to planes flying in Africa. Many of the countries like Ethiopia and Angola that are in political turmoil, will shoot at just about anything flying overhead. Several years ago, a US-registered Learjet was shot down in east Africa- I don't remember what country.

Don't worry about maneuvering to avoid a missile that's been fired on you. If it has a good lock on you, there's no point. Some surface to air missiles travel at more than Mach 3, and can make 20G turns!
 

Tim47SIP

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Roll Rate?

"He said the A-320 has a good roll rate, and it's easy to avoid the missles. He has been shot at more times in the A-320 than in his F-16! "

So just how does this guy know when a missle has been fired from behined him? There must be a rule there that states all missles must be fired so as the pilots of the aircraft can see the missle coming and take evasive action.

The only way a 320 could out maneuver a missle is the missle is not IR guided.

;)
 

TMMT

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The technology does indeed exist.

Although it is only available to a select few operators, mostly state operators or civilians who can show enough cause to receive authorization by the state the a/c is registered in.

I’ve flown in, over and around Africa enough to say it is indeed a dangerous place, but IMHO it is more dangerous on the ground (in most areas) than airborne.

When we operate to Africa we make a return trip the same day, drop our pax off and then continue on down line to safer locals or return to Europe. In the early 90’s before I began working for my present employer we had a film crew kidnapped and held hostage in Angola for several days. They were released with only minor injuries and the loss of a coupla hundred grand in film equipment.

Your best be on trip planning in Africa is to avoid **CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED** near all of central Africa, the west coast from Sudan down to South Africa and central north Africa.

Flying a November registered a/c in Africa is about as dangerous as walking the streets of Mecca selling Hustler.

TMMT
 

Delta3

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I heard Lear Jets can outmaneuver missles.

I also heard a story of a poor African or Middle East country that tried to strap missles on a Lear and use it as a fighter jet. Anyone know if its true?
 

justApilot

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I also heard a story of a poor African or Middle East country that tried to strap missles on a Lear and use it as a fighter jet. Anyone know if its true?


The Isreali's used to have a fleet of Westwinds with hardpoints on them.
 

Captain X

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ATRCA said:
Gulfstreams with "anti-missle" technology.

Come on dude, get out of the house once in a while. Take a quiet walk, everything will be ok.

Trust me.

I really dont know wether or not they have that technology just sounds a little fishy to me. Who knows.
Actually Gaylord, it's true.

It was in B/CA and Aerospace Week magazine a few months ago that they were adding chaff and IR flare dispensers. It's an option that Gulfstream adds if you have the $$$. For people who are going to E. Europe and Central/South America it's not such a bad idea.

As far as everything being okay........you just keep believing that.
Unpredicatibility and our own complacence are 2 or terrorist's greatest tools.......a little paranoia is good for everybody.
 

TurboS7

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Just remember if you get a lock-on and can get a visual on the track run at the missle head on then roll at the last instant. Next take evasive action like flying down a canyon. Remember the missle can move faster than you but due to your slow speed you can out manuever it. Just remember in all this don't pull over 2.5G's or spill the bosses coffee. Dream on.
 

avbug

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Open an emergency hatch and toss out the coffee. If it's McDonalds coffee, it's hot enough to redirect any SAM or AAM tha't IR guided. If it's a radar lock, then toss out the boss. His large cross section will confuse the missle.

Alternately, just stop. This isn't done much in the corporate or airline world today, but ample footage exists of this tactic and can be seen on most Roadrunner/Wylee Coyote documentaries. Just stop, and the missle will fly right by. This has fuel savings advantages, as everyone knows that power is only required to go. When stopped, shut down and wait it out. This will break any IR locks, and give you time to pour a new cup of coffee.

All of this could have been avoided by drinking ovaltine.
 

ms6073

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EagleRJ said:
Don't worry about maneuvering to avoid a missile that's been fired on you. If it has a good lock on you, there's no point. Some surface to air missiles travel at more than Mach 3, and can make 20G turns!
Yes, but a shoulder fired AA missile only has enough solid fuel propellant for about 20-30 seconds of burn during which time the missile is accelerating, after the fuel is spent, it becomes a high velocity glider that is constantly decelerating. That is the purpose for manuevering, so that maybe you can cause the missile to use up all of its 'energy' before it has a chance to get close enough to cause any damage to your aircraft.
 
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