Drift Down Routes

[Nevets]

Any controller ever have a pilot unable to accept a reroute due to being on a drift down or terrain clearance route? And what did and or the pilot do about it?

 

[ERJFO]

Not a controller, but last week I had to turn down 2 offers for direct because out enroute net ceiling was lower than the grid MORA. I use the ISA # and A/I factor that's on the release and go from there.

As far as terrain clearance and drift down go, as soon as you're "light" enough to drift down above the grid MORA for the conditions you can go off route.

The place I work also has generic TC/DD charts for certian areas of the country that can pretty much let you take any reroute as long as your an an airway.

I know this wasn't what you were looking for but I'm currious if you've seen stuff you couldn't take after looking at the MORA's and generic pink pages...

 

[Nevets]

Not a controller, but last week I had to turn down 2 offers for direct because out enroute net ceiling was lower than the grid MORA. I use the ISA # and A/I factor that's on the release and go from there.

As far as terrain clearance and drift down go, as soon as you're "light" enough to drift down above the grid MORA for the conditions you can go off route.

The place I work also has generic TC/DD charts for certian areas of the country that can pretty much let you take any reroute as long as your an an airway.

I know this wasn't what you were looking for but I'm currious if you've seen stuff you couldn't take after looking at the MORA's and generic pink pages...

I did calculate the enroute net ceiling. It was lower than the grid MORA. There are no specific or generic sector charts for the area I was in. I was simply unable to accept a reroute and the controller was extremely unhappy about it.

Im under the impression that controllers don't understand or don't care about the limitations of our aircraft and are unable to comply with their instructions because of it. Im hoping this was an isolated incident (although its happened twice to me in a certain center's airspace) and that other controllers in other facilities do in fact know about these rare situations and how they deal with it. Because I don't appreciate being bullied or threatened and having to call every time it happens to explain the situation and following it up with ASAP/ASRS.

 

[ERJFO]

I did calculate the enroute net ceiling. It was lower than the grid MORA. There are no specific or generic sector charts for the area I was in. I was simply unable to accept a reroute and the controller was extremely unhappy about it.

Im under the impression that controllers don't understand or don't care about the limitations of our aircraft and are unable to comply with their instructions because of it. Im hoping this was an isolated incident (although its happened twice to me in a certain center's airspace) and that other controllers in other facilities do in fact know about these rare situations and how they deal with it. Because I don't appreciate being bullied or threatened and having to call every time it happens to explain the situation and following it up with ASAP/ASRS.

Where were you at? What did they want you to do?

 

[Nevets]

Where were you at? What did they want you to do?

I was in California. I wanted to stay on my route until I was past the 16800 Grid MORA.

 

[CRJCptn]

just out of curiosity, the E145 (based on your profile) will not hold 17000 on one engine? (16800 MEA)

 

[Booker]

just out of curiosity, the E145 (based on your profile) will not hold 17000 on one engine? (16800 MEA)

Not at ISA and MATOW. You'd need to be down to about 43,000 pounds (EP/LR) to make 16,800.

 

[CRJCptn]

thanks for the response.

 

[ERJFO]

just out of curiosity, the E145 (based on your profile) will not hold 17000 on one engine? (16800 MEA)

It depends largly on if we use anti-ice on or off charts. In most of the airplanes if we use icing off we can go anywhere in North America, right now I'd imagine we're all using the A/I on charts.

 

[Hold West]

Im under the impression that controllers don't understand

You're exactly correct. Say MORA, enroute net ceiling, or drift-down to 99% of US controllers and they won't have even a glimmer of an idea what you're talking about.

In 23 years, I've never received any training from FAA on any of these topics.