DOT votes against modified Delta-USAirways swap agreement - socialism???

[johnsonrod]

Maybe you should spend less time posting dumb comments to internet message boards?

We just finished 8 years with an administration that thought regulators had no business regulating anything. How did that work out?

No one thinks the government should regulate everything, but proper regulation is essential. I want MY GOVERNMENT to properly regulate. You can't have a football game without rules and referees. The same applies to any venture or system.

The Delta/US swap is collusion of the highest order. 'We'll not compete with you at LGA if you don't compete with us at DCA.' They're splitting up the market to the detriment of the consumer. The DOT is acting in the best interest of the consumer by requiring access for other carriers to these slot controlled airport. Airports owned by THE PEOPLE.

POWER TO THE PEOPLE! DOWN WITH SUCCESS! LET'S ALL BE AVERAGE OR MEDIOCRE TO BE "FAIR" TO EVERYONE. VIVA LA FRANCE!!!! Whatever dude. You miss the point. Did you ever see the modified agreement or are you just talking out of your a$$? These slots belong to Delta and USAirways. Not SWA. This modified deal would have introduced two new competitors to the markets - JB at DCA and Westjet at LGA. I guess that wouldn't have been helpful - right???? Thank Goodness Roy "the hood" Lahood blocked all of that potential public benefit...

 

[MILF Hunter]

How about too much Government control? I thought this industry was deregulated at one point? Not if Obama and Lahood (who looks like a Mafia gangster) have their way.

The biggest problem I have with this is that Lahood disagreed with the modified agreement. I can see how the Feds would want to stop the original agreement just between Delta and USAirways. But DL and US had modified the agreement and brought in many other airlines - including two entrants to the markets (JB and Westjet). This is just too much Government intervention.

I guess you Obama lovers get what you paid for...

This didn't start under Obama



A battle for the decades
The airlines clearly have a stake in the outcome, as slot trades, swaps and sales have been common through the years.
The airlines have battled with the FAA over slot-enforcement issues for decades. The agency tried to force a slot divestiture and auction at Newark Liberty in 2008, but it faced legal battles from airline and airport lobbying groups. The FAA retreated from its plan after the Obama administration took over.

Obama placed Randy Babbitt (ALPA) at the head of the FAA.

 

[Hair-on-Fire]

POWER TO THE PEOPLE! DOWN WITH SUCCESS! LET'S ALL BE AVERAGE OR MEDIOCRE TO BE "FAIR" TO EVERYONE. VIVA LA FRANCE!!!! Whatever dude. You miss the point. Did you ever see the modified agreement or are you just talking out of your a$$? These slots belong to Delta and USAirways. Not SWA. This modified deal would have introduced two new competitors to the markets - JB at DCA and Westjet at LGA. I guess that wouldn't have been helpful - right???? Thank Goodness Roy "the hood" Lahood blocked all of that potential public benefit...

I read it and I'm still can't understand why you have your panties in such a wad. Beck's appendage must be blocking your oxygen supply. They want to trade 167 slots. The DOT says they have to sell 34 of them, big deal.

 

[Jetjockey]

I read it and I'm still can't understand why you have your panties in such a wad. Beck's appendage must be blocking your oxygen supply. They want to trade 167 slots. The DOT says they have to sell 34 of them, big deal.

Yeah, I'm still scratching my head how an anti-trust issue equals socialism.

Pass my gubment cheese this way comrade, won't you? Time to go collect my welfare check. This how the Faux News fans view moderates, or anyone who doesn't think like them.

 

[johnsonrod]

I read it and I'm still can't understand why you have your panties in such a wad. Beck's appendage must be blocking your oxygen supply. They want to trade 167 slots. The DOT says they have to sell 34 of them, big deal.

If this scuttles the deal, how will the public benefit from the status quo? What other requirements should the Government IMPOSE on these deals? The deal had already been modified to the extent that completely new entrants were added to DCA and LGA. That's already a big stretch but the Feds want more and more... But if the deal is scuttled because of last-minute, onerous demands, the public does not win. Get it?

How much more should Obama's people intrude? What's next? DAL won't get Haneda slots in Japan if they don't hire more Comanche Indians? Too much intervention and meddling = socialism in my book.

 

[General Lee]

I read it and I'm still can't understand why you have your panties in such a wad. Beck's appendage must be blocking your oxygen supply. They want to trade 167 slots. The DOT says they have to sell 34 of them, big deal.

I don't think you get it. These assets are owned by the airline. SWA could have tried to get slots years ago but chose not to. Now, they want them when it is convienent for THEM. The only time the GOV'T tells YOU who to sell your house to is when it is up for auction at a forclosure. Again, DL and US don't have to do anything, and that means more people in smaller towns in Upstate NY won't get any service to LGA when USAir pulls out entirely. They want out. Most of the slots were going to be used by DL to fly larger planes (RJs versus current Saab 340s) to places like Ithaca, NY. I don't think SWA wants to go there, yet. Oh well, people in those towns will lose the most I guess.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[bmpilot]

It appears to me Delta doesn't want the slots to go out on the freemarket. They want Government protection on what they do with them. If you want a freemarket, let them go to the highest bidder, period. That's capitalism.

Don't be surprised if SWA wanted part of that and Delta didn't want them playing.

 

[UALRATT]

Some good points on both sides of the argument. Understand completely why DAL/LCC want to control who they wish to compete against. Other low cost carriers that control less than 5% of pax traffic vs one (SWA) that has 15% is a solid reason to limit the exposure.

Every airline would like to choose who it can compete against. What should the gov. do in such situations?

The DOT has spoken and DAL/LCC always has the option to nix the entire deal and stay with status quo. If that is better than the alternative and not good for the shareholders, then go for it.

Lets recall the US Gov gave out $15B to the airlines in 2002 after 9/11....some would argue that capitalism wouldn't have allowed that to happen.

"The measure gives the nation's airlines $5 billion in immediate cash assistance and $10 billion in loan guarantees in an effort to keep several major carriers from collapsing. Sen. Peter Fitzgerald, R-Ill., was the only senator to vote against the bill." http://archives.cnn.com/2001/US/09/21/rec.congress.airline.deal/

The two airlinles involved have both gone through bankruptcy.

Some would argue that true capitalism would have had the companies dissolve since they were unsuccessful in the competitive market place. Bankruptcy laws, most would agree I believe, have some very anti-captialistic elements to it (making businesses repay money to bankrupt companies up to 90 days after being paid is just one example that led many other companies into bankruptcy...I'm just saying...)

It is obvious what DAL/LCC want to do....increase profits and improve their efficiency while at the same time limiting their exposure to more competition. Is that the free market system?

It is not black and white and the courts, as is often the case, will make the call and with SWA (Herb) arguing on the side of more competition, that is a side that most people can understand and get behind. I'm not saying SWA should get all of the slots but the DOT obviously feels a blind auction is better than what was proposed as an alternative by DAL/LCC.

No offense directed toward others at DAL, LCC or others who have different opinions.

Good post! Just to clarify the government only approved $15B including $5B in cash reimbursement for the airspace shut down, most of which was distributed to 427 U.S. air carriers but the ATSB approved loan guarantees to six airlines totaled a mere fraction of the remaining $10B+; approximately $1.6 billion. Hence the wave of bankruptcy. It should be noted that government not only recoup the $1.6B but profited $339 million from the interest and fees associated with $10b loan guarantees.

 

[General Lee]

Don't be surprised if SWA wanted part of that and Delta didn't want them playing.

There is no doubt there, and if you owned something, you can also decide who buys it if you want to sell it. The key here is that DL and USAir bought those assets, while SWA had a chance to also. At the time, SWA didn't want to go into larger airports, opting for Manchester, NH, Providence, RI, and BWI, for pax "convienence." Well, now they want more.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Cometman]

There is no doubt there, and if you owned something, you can also decide who buys it if you want to sell it. The key here is that DL and USAir bought those assets, while SWA had a chance to also. At the time, SWA didn't want to go into larger airports, opting for Manchester, NH, Providence, RI, and BWI, for pax "convienence." Well, now they want more.


Bye Bye--General Lee

If Delta goes with this plan then SWA will probably get to buy them. When you sell your house you cannot eliminate a buyer because of his race religion etc. Just like you cananot pick who you want to compete with.