Does the instructor have to be a CFII?

[UND84]

Scenario: A private instrument rated pilot is working on their commercial. They need to get the 10 hours of complex time and come to an FBO to fly those 10 hours. They fly with a CFI. The weather becomes IFR. Can that CFI give dual in IMC in the complex plane if he is giving instruction on the complex and not giving instrument instruction? I have had mixed answers with this question and wonder if the instructor needs to be a CFII. I read 61.193 and 61.195 paragraph c and am asking for some clarification. Thank you.

 

[Ralgha]

No, technically they don't need to be a CFII, but it would look odd.

 

[liv'n_on_credit]

CFII question

No CFII is needed, just a normal CFI. CFI's take student pilot's in the clouds all the time without a CFII, and the same works for commercial students. As long as the CFI is not giving any instruction required towards the completion of an instrument rating.

If the CFI is still uncertain about this, just get the CFII rating. It can be added on in less than a week and it's the best investment a CFI can get.

 

[TEXAN AVIATOR]

If the CFI is still uncertain about this, just get the CFII rating. It can be added on in less than a week and it's the best investment a CFI can get.

I couldn't agree more.

 

[guido411]

These responses are MOSTLY right. Livin-on-credit, you're a little off on the statement about giving dual for the completion of an instrument rating though. A CFI may give dual for an instrument rating so long as 15 hours of the student's instruction is received from a CFII. I might be a bit off on the hours, I don't have a FAR in front of me but I know I'm close. The CFII must also be the one making the reccomendation for checkride.

 

[liv'n_on_credit]

These responses are MOSTLY right. Livin-on-credit, you're a little off on the statement about giving dual for the completion of an instrument rating though. A CFI may give dual for an instrument rating so long as 15 hours of the student's instruction is received from a CFII. I might be a bit off on the hours, I don't have a FAR in front of me but I know I'm close. The CFII must also be the one making the reccomendation for checkride.

Yeah, that's a better way of putting it I guess. The 15 hours falls into the "authorized[instrument]instructor", which is the only part a CFI cannot supply, besides the endorsement.

I encourage all CFI's who don't have their CFII yet to not be afraid to take a student pilot into the soup. Just because you don't have a CFII doesn't mean your students should be neglected the experience of actual IFR. Just don't start signing off IFR students without the big I.

 

[guido411]

Now I agree with ya there, liv'n. Both the student AND the CFI can greatly benefit by flying in the muck and mire. Even if only a private student climbing to VFR or top for some stalls and steep turns. I also agree with yours and texan's comments to just go get the CFII rating. The second easiest checkride I ever took next to my ATP.

 

[JediNein]

The hours for the commercial must be given by a CFII. While a CFI, can instruct in IMC, those hours only count towards the private certificate and instrument experience. That is not considered instrument training" from an "authorized instructor". Ref: Part 61 FAQ

Fly safe!
Jedi Nein

 

[Lil Jon]

The hours for the commercial must be given by a CFII.

you lost me on this??

 

[liv'n_on_credit]

The hours for the commercial must be given by a CFII.

You lost me too...