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Dismissed from previous employer, interesting scenario for you

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At least we can agree on something, Yip

pilotyip said:
As long as it is not a pattern of irresponsibility should not be a big deal. Everyone is allowed a mulligan in his or her career.
Of course they are. If you haven't misstepped at least once in your life you haven't really lived. The sad thing is there are so many saints out there and it's the path of least resistance to hire a saint. So, H.R. never really gives a person who has made mistakes who might turn out to be a better employee a chance to give his/her side of the story.
 
I was interviewed by the lead in a program in a particular agency. During the course of the the interview, he asked if I had any certificate revocations or FAA violations. I said no, but admitted that I had two letters of investigation at the time, from two different employers. I showed him the letters, as well as letters from the regional chief counsel dismissing the matter (as I was exhonerrated).

The individual doing the interview considered that for a moment, and then said he didn't think he could use me, as they seldom took people who had less than three FAA violations. I ended up taking the qualification and going to work anyway...but different strokes for different...strokes.

A particular company for whom I flew had experienced finance problems. The money was there, but they weren't always good about paying for things. I was flying, and serving as their director of maintenance. I had trouble on occasion obtaining everything I required to do my job. At length after one particular incident, I told the company that if this happened again, they could consider tonight my official notice of resignation. I told them I wouldn't provide another warning.

Two months later my paycheck bounced. I called the company accountant, who became beligerent and tried to deny that it bounced. In a forceful and direct manner, I communicated my displeasure at the situation to the accountant by telephone, and reminded her of my prior resignation. That evening, the general manager for the operation arrived with my final check. I did get my check, but we parted ways then and there.

Today, if you ask me if I was fired, I'll tell you no. If you ask the company, the company will probably tell you no, for legal reasons. My job ended that night with the arrival of the final paycheck, but I can honestly say I had quit two months before, as I had resigned. If someone asks me why I left, my answer is simple; my paycheck bounced. Error or no, didn't get the money in the bank on time, whatever, I don't care...the paycheck bounced. Other bigger issues certainly existed with respect to the way things were run, and it was those issues over which I resigned. However, depending on one's perspective, one could call it a termination...I didn't leave that night, the company told me I was leaving. Just two months after I resigned.

How you view prior separations plays a big part in how your employer will view the separation. Find out what your former employer will say about you. Many employers, even at termination, will write for you a good letter of recommendation. If you can secure a letter, you're in good shape regardless of the circumstances of separation. Here's an important secret...if your boss fired you, get someone else there to write the letter. Get it on company letter head.

I don't want this to be a novel, but...I went to work for a corporate department as a "co-captain" (a ridiculous term, in my opinion), and as Director of Maintenance. Prior to my arrival, a series of expensive events had occured that left doubt as to the future of the flight department in the minds of the board of directors. When the maintenance was outsourced and contract flying was done instead of a full time crew, I was let go. I was given an hour's notice, on the last day of the pay period, and told to have my tools out the next day.

Three weeks later I was hired to fly a learjet. However, during the ensuing background check, I was called into the chief pilot's office. He showed me a letter returned from the corporate department. It said I was let go and that I would not be hired again. Of course not, there was no position to hire into. I explained that, but he was dubious. However, I had in my posession a glowing letter of recommendation by the chief pilot, on company letterhead. I gave that to my new chief pilot, who put a copy in my file. I then called my former employer and told him where I was, and what I was doing, and asked if he could straighten the matter out. He asked me to hand the phone to my new chief pilot, which I did, right in his office. Matter resolved.

In this case, you weren't let go from a flying position, but a line position. You might see about getting a letter from someone else there. From your description, your boss might even sign it. It's a starting point. Remember that how you view your past and how you explain it, and I hate to say it because it sounds crass, but how you spin it, makes all the difference to your new employer. Don't lie, be honest, but remember that there's a big difference between telling a new employer that you left your last employer beause your "position was eliminated," vs. telling your new employer that you were kicked out because they didn't want you any more.

As for the flexjet issue...sorry to hear about it, but it's not far from some other things I've heard. I'd certainly still strive to obtain recommendations from those in the firm who are friendly to you, even though you have a good job now. Having good letters in your home file can't hurt.
 
Do not buy into the false notion that is acceptable to leave something like this off of the application thinking you can just explain it at a later point in time during the actual interview process. Writing down "to be explained at the interview" I don't think is going to produce overly positive results. It is much better to be straight forward, honest, and up front with them from the get go. If you hide something, keep required and/or requested information off of the application then you are just asking for problems. If they ask you to be specific and want questions answered then and there on the application then by all means do so, later at the interview should not be viewed as an option. It also shows human resources that you understand how to follow directions on properly filling out the application. Very good advice about the LOR's, try and obtain atleast a few from those who have flown with you at that company.

Good luck to you, I wouldn't lose too much sleep over this one.

3 5 0
 
Great replies and interesting discussion throughout!

Thank you to all who participated!

OS
 

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