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Delta Will Report Huge 3Q Loss Wednesday

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Flying Freddie

Bitchin' Blue
Joined
Dec 30, 2002
Posts
345
Associated Press
Delta Will Report Huge 3Q Loss Wednesday
Tuesday October 19, 6:01 pm ET
By Harry R. Weber, AP Business Writer Delta Airlines Will Report Huge Loss for Third Quarter Amid Fears of Bankruptcy Filing

ATLANTA (AP) -- Delta Air Lines Inc. will report another huge quarterly loss on Wednesday and plans to skip its routine of speaking to investors -- a sign to some observers a bankruptcy filing is near. One analyst said in a research note that a Chapter 11 filing is highly likely soon.

[size=-2][/size]Delta was mum Tuesday on its intentions, except to repeat a prior statement that it will have to seek court protection if it fails to restructure its heavy debt and win deep concessions from its pilots in the next several weeks.

Company shares fell 12 cents, or 3.9 percent, to close at $2.99 Tuesday on the New York Stock Exchange. The shares have fallen more than 90 percent since the 2001 terrorist attacks, but remain slightly above the 52-week low of $2.94 posted on Sept. 27.

In a Securities and Exchange Commission filing on Friday, Delta revealed that it expects its net loss for the third quarter to be $625 million to $675 million, or $4.99 to $5.39 a share. The loss, to be reported Wednesday before the market opens, would be significantly higher than the $3.79 a share analysts had expected.

In a statement accompanying the filing, Delta said it would not conduct a conference call with investors Wednesday to answer questions about the earnings release. It cited in part as a reason its efforts to avoid bankruptcy.

"It's highly unusual, but what are they going to say, because everyone is going to be wondering about the pilots," said Ray Neidl, an analyst with Calyon Securities Inc. in New York. "I see that as a sign that the end is near."

UBS analyst Robert Ashcroft said in a research note Tuesday that the likelihood of a Chapter 11 filing by the nation's third-largest airline has increased since the SEC filing because of how little cash it has left to repay debt. Delta says it had $1.45 billion in unrestricted cash as of Sept. 30, below the $1.5 billion threshold many analysts believe is tantamount to a bankruptcy filing.

"It would take a brave person to approach a credit committee with a proposal to loan Delta more money right now," Ashcroft said. He added that bankruptcy is "not a foregone conclusion, but highly likely" within a month or two.

Atlanta-based Delta has $20.6 billion in total debt. It has been trying to restructure the terms of some of its debt commitments to help avoid bankruptcy. A recent debt exchange offer is part of that effort.

Asked for further comment Tuesday on the reason for not holding the conference call, Delta spokeswoman Benet Wilson repeated Friday's statement. She added that meetings between the company and the pilots union remain intense, though she and a union spokeswoman would not say if the sides are near an agreement.

Delta is seeking $1 billion in concessions from its pilots, who have publicly offered up to $705 million. Delta warned recently that even with the concessions it is seeking, it still may need bankruptcy.

Meanwhile, Delta has been trying to transform itself to drive more customers onto its planes.

Its latest effort announced this week is that its low-fare subsidiary, Song, plans to sell organic baby food on all its flights to encourage parents to travel with infants and small children. Song has been targeting the leisure crowd to fill its flights from the Northeast to Florida.

Delta has used Song to experiment with different initiatives to see if they might work in the mainline airline -- Song also tried to woo passengers with martini bars on flights and free tickets for being nice.

Analysts see Song as potentially worthwhile to Delta as an incubator for change. Delta said last month that it planned to add a dozen more planes to Song's 36-jet fleet next spring.

In the long run, however, some observers remain skeptical about Song's success, in turn, Delta's transformation.

"Is Song going to be the new Delta?" said Terry Trippler, an airline industry expert in Minneapolis. "It is hard to tell. It hasn't worked for anybody else, and Delta hasn't been too successful at anything else they've tried lately." He added, "It's going to take a whole lot more than premium baby food. It's going to have to mean premium prices to turn that airline around."
 
Hmmmm. As skies look gloomier and gloomier for Delta, negotiations with creditors and labor unions increase. Coincidence? Does DAL management have an incentive to make the situation look as bleak as possible? How much of that loss involves right-offs and one-time charges (paper shuffling)?

Certainly the situation is bad, but the "degree" of bad can be manipulated a bit to serve certain purposes...
 
yup..

$2.99/share - down more than 90%...

its all a ploy to screw the pilots.
 
One analyst says we will be bankrupt next week, then a week later---he says it will be the NEXT week. In reality, Delta will decide when and if we go to court. I still think that the pilot deal is done, and that right now we are pressuring the creditors to sign up. Why wouldn't we actually file now when we are supposedly below the comfort cusion of $1.5 billion? I would think we would have filed already, unless something is being worked out..... I don't know....



Bye Bye--General Lee
 
On Your Six said:
And profit can't be manipulated? Grow up.
grow up?......how about wake up!!!
 
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Gulfstream,


You really don't know (and neither do I) what is happening in the board room. Everything else is speculation, but to say that their isn't a little brinksmanship going on----is ridiculous. I bet they are throwing every possible one time charge in there----depreciation etc. How could Continental have a $16 million loss (yes, their pilots are paid less and they have 40% hedges at $40 a barrel) and we have a $625 million loss? I would have to say that some of that is pure paper loss.(depreciation of aircraft, etc) Regardless though, a loss is a loss these days....But there sure is a big difference between the two companies---and I could see a $300 million difference etc(due to fuel and salary differences)---but $613 million? I don't know, again....



Bye Bye--General Lee
 
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oh you are 100% right, and I truly hope DAL pulls it all together with minimal effect on the pilots. I ,for one, certainly dont think you are overpaid one bit...I personally think LCCs have turned the airlines into a very mediocre job - and that $ucks! -- but thats what the market demanded, so be it. I guess its free enterprise, survival of the fittest...and in the end the little guys (the pilots etc) get screwed. But still, nothing turns my stomach more than to hear LCC pilots tell you that you are "overpaid"....sad.

but for some fool to say that a 90% stock value loss is another "darn management ploy to screw the pilots" -- thats downright laughable and exposes the ignorance of many pilots to the value of thier companies.

Dear God,....$2.99 is not a number faked by your management you dumb $hit!!! == thats all my point was.
 
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Gulfstream,


I don't think he meant that. I think he meant that a lot of the losses are designed to look horrible (with one time charges etc) and that can affect negotiations and also affect stock price....


Bye Bye--General Lee
 
Gulfstream 200 said:
oh you are 100% right, and I truly hope DAL pulls it all together with minimal effect on the pilots. I ,for one, certainly dont think you are overpaid one bit...I personally think LCCs have turned the airlines into a very mediocre job - and that $ucks! -- but thats what the market demanded, so be it. I guess its free enterprise, survival of the fittest...and in the end the little guys (the pilots etc) get screwed. But still, nothing turns my stomach more than to hear LCC pilots tell you that you are "overpaid"....sad.
I read your post and wasn't going to bother responding, then I thought to myself... hey this guy is and always has been an arrogant idiot... so I think I will respond.

The LCC's have turned airlines into a mediocre job? Did you send out a survey to come up with that grand proclamation. I find airline flying to be quite enjoyable. Since I know you wouldn't dare make an unbased, unfounded, outsider opinion about flying for an airline, so I guess you are currently flying for an airline........right? Which one?

Second... I won't say anyone is overpaid. I would love to make $1,000,000.00 a year doing my job. I can't, so I take what we negotioate and what the market will bear. That is the price that we ALL pay for living in the good ole' USA. And guess what, it is a cycle we cannot control, and we all deal with.

As far as "implying" that LCC's and LCC pilots are responsible, I ask this:
This year as a 4th year Captain on a 117 seat Aircraft, I will gross $120,000.00. What should I be making? $200,000.00? Please direct me to a profitable company that will pay that and off I go...

Since you have all the comments, then how about some answers that noboby seems to ever answer.

How long has Southwest Airlines been in business?

Why was it that in the late 90's, all the Majors (most anyway) were banking Billions, while Southwest Airlines was still undercutting them? With your flawed reasoning, they should have taken down the majors with no problem. SWA didn't even have the higher salaries thay have now.

Why didn't Legend, Vanguard, Sun Country, Access Air, etc. (all paying their pilots far less than the majors.. cents on the dollar actually) survive? After all, with your logic, they should have been responsible for the demise of the industry during that time.

Your thinking is incredibly short sighted, and more in line with a newspaper reporter reporting a crash.

What airline did you say you work for?

And again, how many airline pilots view their job as mediocre?
 
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General Lee said:
Gulfstream,


You really don't know (and neither do I) what is happening in the board room. Everything else is speculation, but to say that their isn't a little brinksmanship going on----is ridiculous. I bet they are throwing every possible one time charge in there----depreciation etc. How could Continental have a $16 million loss (yes, their pilots are paid less and they have 40% hedges at $40 a barrel) and we have a $625 million loss? I would have to say that some of that is pure paper loss.(depreciation of aircraft, etc) Regardless though, a loss is a loss these days....But there sure is a big difference between the two companies---and I could see a $300 million difference etc(due to fuel and salary differences)---but $613 million? I don't know, again....



Bye Bye--General Lee
Give me a freakin break General.....

I know your a d a m n koolaid drinker and all, but lets face facts here. Bethune is a straight up guy and way more trustworthy the our pathetic, excuse me, Delta's pathetic excuse for a management team. I think all these worthless management types need to be lined up and stoned.... as if they won the "lottery". The press release said nothing about one time charges..... as the 2nd Q filing did. That was known and this time its just absolutely ridiculous. 16 million loss to 625-675 million loss..... give me a break..... I think your opinion and positive attitude would disappear in a heartbeat, if you were on this side of the fence. Don't get me wrong, you and I have butted heades before about this, but its really getting to the point that Im actually getting neausious (sp?) when I read some of your posts. I said SOME not all. But then again.... I think I'd be a little more positive as well if I were making 170 an hour. So I can see why your a koolaid drinker. I prefer to assume the worse and hope for the best..... MotherF....ING Delta has let the junior guys down once too many times and I'm willing to bet with this new agreement that it'll happen again..... I hope Im wrong.....

Fly Safe General and even though I don't use the Cobra....thanks for the generosity.... I know some guys that are using it and could'nt do without.

Hey... its WEDNESDAY...... I guess we'll find out today how DEEP in the SH!T mother D is really in today......... think Positive..... wwooooo ssssaaaaaaa ;)
 
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Delta Reports Loss Despite Revenue Gain
Wednesday October 20, 9:39 am ET
By Harry R. Weber, AP Business Writer
Delta's 3Q Loss Nearly Quadruples Despite Revenue Gain, Warns on Financial Situation



ATLANTA (AP) -- Delta Air Lines Inc. said its third-quarter loss nearly quadrupled compared to a year ago despite a rise in revenue and warned that its financial situation has worsened to the point where it needs to significantly reduce its costs quickly to turn things around.





The results, announced Wednesday, missed Wall Street's reduced expectations.

The nation's third-largest airline said it lost $651 million, or $5.16 a share, for the three months ending Sept. 30, compared to a loss of $168 million, or $1.36 a share, in the same period a year ago. The current loss includes $5 million Delta paid out in dividends to preferred stockholders.

Excluding one-time items, Delta said it lost $592 million, or $4.73 a share, in the July-September period. On that basis, analysts surveyed by Thomson First Call were expecting a loss of $4.38 a share, an estimate that had been reduced after Delta warned of its loss on Friday.

Revenue in the this quarter was $3.87 billion, a 5.9 percent increase from the $3.66 billion Delta recorded a year ago.

"Last month we outlined the key elements of Delta's transformation plan which targets $1 billion in annual pilot cost savings, as well as participation from Delta's other stakeholders," said Gerald Grinstein, Delta's chief executive officer. "As Delta's financial situation continues to deteriorate, time is of the essence." Analysts believe the airline has only a few weeks left to win $1 billion in concessions from pilots and restructure its heavy debt to avoid a Chapter 11 filing. Delta did not plan to hold a conference call Wednesday to answer investor questions, suggesting to some analysts that a bankruptcy filing is near. Delta had $1.45 billion in unrestricted cash as of Sept. 30.
 
I am just LOST on how Delta cold lose $592 million in three months---and NW lose $46 million. It must be the pilot salary difference-----wait----it isn't much difference between NW and DL. It baffles the mind......




Networ-King,

You really need to get a grip. Dalpa did you a FAVOR by passing this TA---the senior guys will HAVE TO GO by Feb 1st or risk losing half of their pension (lump sum). Had Dalpa not passed that TA, more of the pilots would stay--because they wouldn't risk quitting and then also losing their lump sum if it wasn't guaranteed. Everything else that will happen was gonna happen---but now there is also a steady stream of retirements---which will help you eventually.

As far as Chap 11 goes---I would have thought that we would have done it by now---since we are below the "comfort cushion" on $1.5 billion. Why haven't we pulled the trigger yet? Maybe there is something else going on back there in the boardroom.......I don't know....?


Bye Bye--General Lee
 
For years pilots have been trying to figure out the airline business. For the most part we are not business people.

Years ago I stopped trying to figure it out and just accept I am a pawn in this game and try to work for the one with the most stable history.

Thank God we have had good players. I have worked for plenty of bad ones.

With the exception (for now) of CA and NWA, it looks like the entire legacy side of the business will be bankrupt. Now the next question is who is going to be around in five years.

Best of luck to all of us.

SWAdude :cool:
 
General Lee said:
I am just LOST on how Delta cold lose $592 million in three months---and NW lose $46 million. . . .<snip>. . .

Bye Bye--General Lee
Obviously you've never been married before. . . .
 
Good one. No, my wife is only allowed to spend half of that---unitl I get my pay cut....then 1/1500th of that!



Bye Bye--General Lee
 
General Lee said:
I am just LOST on how Delta cold lose $592 million in three months---and NW lose $46 million. It must be the pilot salary difference-----wait----it isn't much difference between NW and DL. It baffles the mind......

Bye Bye--General Lee
It's not hard to figure out. DL has a higher cost structure than NW and an extremely low-yield network (heavily centered around Florida). If you adjust for stage-length, DL has the lowest yield network among the six legacy carriers. Then throw in the hurricanes (which would affect DL more than NW) and the fact that DL is larger than NW and voila you have a $592 million dollar loss.

As for CH11, I think the only holdups are that DL is waiting to see how the debt holders respond to their latest offer and DL is probably trying to line up DIP financing. However, I wouldn't be surprised if DL is having a hard time getting DIP financing.
 
Medflyer,


Can't get DIP financing? What? Where do you come up with this crap? How do you know any of that? We still own more than United did prior to their filing. Leave the outlandish financial revelations to Lowecur please.



Bye Bye--General Lee
 
General Lee said:
Medflyer,

Can't get DIP financing? What? Where do you come up with this crap? How do you know any of that? We still own more than United did prior to their filing. Leave the outlandish financial revelations to Lowecur please.


Bye Bye--General Lee
It has nothing to do with how much DL owns...it has to do with history. After seeing the disasters going on at US and UA, how many financiers do you think are rushing out to give DL money? There are only so many gullible investors around.

I'm sure DL can get DIP financing...the hard part (and what takes time) is negotiating a package that both parties find attractive. Most likely any financier is probably going to demand a whole lot from DL, in order to cough up any cash.
 

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