Delta Pilot Contract Comparison link

[densoo]

Stop using hourly rates alone! A DAL guy is only getting 65 hrs a month at those rates. You need to show rates based on productivity. Even monthly rates don't show the whole picture. Best of luck to everyone in their negotiations.

Exactly. Latest MIT data shows a DAL pilot costs $350 per block hour flown, AA $375, CAL $310. Pay and benefits. It's not just the W2.

Bases on hours flown, DAL works an astounding 20% less than the most "productive" group (CAL). Think five extra weeks off per year on average.

Workrules, workrules.

 

[densoo]

Exactly. Latest MIT data shows a DAL pilot costs $350 per block hour flown, AA $375, CAL $310. Pay and benefits. It's not just the W2.

Bases on hours flown, DAL works an astounding 20% less than the most "productive" group (CAL). Think five extra weeks off per year on average.

Workrules, workrules.

"Based" on hours flown. Also, to be clear, DAL is flying 20% less for an approximately equal pay and benefits package.

 

[becket]

12 year SW FO is $151. 12 year A330 CA at usapa is 159. Bwwaaaaaaahahahahahaha!!!! Freakin' dumb asses!

Yeah, the Eastholes are definitely OVER PAID!

 

[kwick]

For the flying they do, Delta's current pay rates are pathetic. Certainly not industry leading like a few years back (pre-bankruptcy). Why does a Delta 777 Captain earn less than a Southwest 737 Captain flying only domestic flying? Shouldn't Delta 737 pilots earn what Southwest 737 pilots earn? So, AirTran 737 pilots who keep the left seat will make more than current Delta 777 pilots in the near future after the merger is complete? Really? Good for the AirTran pilots, but the Delta guys clearly deserve much better - especially after their pensions were gutted (not the former NWA guys). Delta is in a far better finanicial position now vs. the bankruptcy days and the new contract better reflect that reality.

Southwest pilots do have an advantage in their negotiating in that the scope of flying is never in question - Southwest will not outsource any flying to regionals. So, there are fewer bargaining chips on the table and the pilots can focus more on pay. Scope is a big bargaining chip for Delta and the legacies and can be used again to offset pay increases for job security - that SUCKS and management knows it. Let's hope Lee Moak stays far away from any future Delta contract negotiations - MOAK CHOKED last time around...

HELLO. Did you sleep through the bankruptcy?

Ten years ago, Delta pilots made $100 more per hour than SW pilots,
and they had a real retirement plan.

 

[FO 4 Life]

Just a minor correction to the comparison. UPS has a 12% B fund. No C plan or 401k match.

 

[CesnaCaptn]

Exactly. Latest MIT data shows a DAL pilot costs $350 per block hour flown, AA $375, CAL $310. Pay and benefits. It's not just the W2.

Bases on hours flown, DAL works an astounding 20% less than the most "productive" group (CAL). Think five extra weeks off per year on average.

Workrules, workrules.

When you use the word "cost," does that include the cost of training a pilot? I know it's a small skewed sample, but I know a few junior DAL pilots who have spent more of the past few years in training than actually flying the line.

I don't think you can use a blanket statement like, "think five extra weeks off per year on average." DAL has much better rigs than CAL. Those costs are block hour costs. I'm willing to bet that DAL pilots earn much more soft time than their CAL counterparts. Unless you are considering layover time earning rig or deadheading as part of your five extra weeks off.

 

[guntrain11]

For the flying they do, Delta's current pay rates are pathetic. Certainly not industry leading like a few years back (pre-bankruptcy). Why does a Delta 777 Captain earn less than a Southwest 737 Captain flying only domestic flying?

The contract that paid Delta industry leading came after record profits. They fell behind Southwest during bankruptcy, and now Southwest is more profitable than Delta. It looks to me like profitable airlines pay more than ones that are less profitable.

 

[densoo]

When you use the word "cost," does that include the cost of training a pilot? I know it's a small skewed sample, but I know a few junior DAL pilots who have spent more of the past few years in training than actually flying the line.

I don't think you can use a blanket statement like, "think five extra weeks off per year on average." DAL has much better rigs than CAL. Those costs are block hour costs. I'm willing to bet that DAL pilots earn much more soft time than their CAL counterparts. Unless you are considering layover time earning rig or deadheading as part of your five extra weeks off.

That's a bet you would win. Most pay at CAL is strictly butt in the seat, and then some. All training is done on personal days off for example. That's why DAL pilots fly 10 hard hours less per month for the same pay.

Five weeks? Perhaps too high. The ten hour difference is about two days of work per month, 24 days per year. Still, as Adam Sandler said, not.too.shabby.

 

[JOPILOT]

Does anyone really think that the PBGC will really be around in a few years? It is 80 billion dollars under-water and counting

...I could see something come out like-- These over-privelaged high income citizens should not be allowed to collect both Pensions and Social Security and then subsequently they will bill be forced to pick their poison between two insolvent programs that are both likely to fail. Frankly I will take the DC fund and self-direct it from here, I hope there is something left for the Pilots at Delta in the future pension payments, but I would not bet on it.

Delta and all other parties that paid into the PBGC should work on trying to get a one time payment to those that have future entitlements so they would have at least something...maybe like $50,000? Sounds like a slap in the face, but I am guessing even that amount is unattainable.

JP

 

[1st Rate]

HELLO. Did you sleep through the bankruptcy?

Ten years ago, Delta pilots made $100 more per hour than SW pilots,
and they had a real retirement plan.

It's sad but now the industry is using SWA as a benchmark. Pathetic.