Delta Orient????

[Deli Guy]

They are NOT suppositories??? So I've been walking around with an ass load of smart pills for the last 20 years? I just took one orally and I am beginning to see the error of my ways. Thank You. Great post!
Deli

 

[Cyclone]

people are funny. look at the general. he is a good DL employee and is basically a DL kool-aid drinker (if there is such a thing). he still believes in the company...he is a good boy scout...trustworthy, loyal, helpful, friendly...

wake up dude. DL management (fill in NWA, U, etc) has porked away decision after decision after decision...starting way before 9/11 and lcc pressures.

e.g. what planes should we fly? what cities should we serve? how should we treat our employees? how do our customers perceive us? hey i know we can paint some of our airplanes white and green...etc.

mistakes...failure after failure after failure.

now all of a sudden because DL is in BK we are supposed to think that these same incompetent turd-for-brains are going to start making good decisions and that your company is going to start making money again. ok...if you think that is the predictable outcome...good for you. whoa. i would be very worried.

 

[General Lee]

people are funny. look at the general. he is a good DL employee and is basically a DL kool-aid drinker (if there is such a thing). he still believes in the company...he is a good boy scout...trustworthy, loyal, helpful, friendly...

wake up dude. DL management (fill in NWA, U, etc) has porked away decision after decision after decision...starting way before 9/11 and lcc pressures.

e.g. what planes should we fly? what cities should we serve? how should we treat our employees? how do our customers perceive us? hey i know we can paint some of our airplanes white and green...etc.

mistakes...failure after failure after failure.

now all of a sudden because DL is in BK we are supposed to think that these same incompetent turd-for-brains are going to start making good decisions and that your company is going to start making money again. ok...if you think that is the predictable outcome...good for you. whoa. i would be very worried.

Well, you have some of it right. Management has made some major mistakes. But, we all know that we started too late in saving money at the same time, and a lot of that had to do with our old management headed by Leo Mullin. He put a bunch of money offshore for his senior executives (the SERP), and that didn't go well. As far as dealing with the new realities of flying in America after 9-11, we started off ok---we created Song and it has won some praise. But, we still bought more and more RJs thanks to Fred Greed, who is gone now and incharge of the new Virgin America. Then, Grinstein took over and took too long looking at the situation. After 8 months, he came up with a plan and started it---getting rid of DFW (a money pit), Simplifares, Operation Clockwork at ATL, and fleet simplification. All of that is good, but we were a tad bit late initiating it, and oil got too high for most. Also, the migration of 2500 Captains taking their lump sums didn't help with the cash flow.

So, we now have a plan, but we are low on cash. So, what do you do? Go to court, get rid of planes you don't want, lower lease rates if you can, dump pensions (2500 took half already), and move on, maybe with a dancing partner. No kool-aid here, except I really do enjoy my job.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Cyclone]

oh general

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclone
you can't pay the mortgage. credit card bills are overdue. last time you made a car payment was in june. electric and phone bills are late. creditors calling. time to file bankruptcy so all the troubles go away.

filed bankruptcy today. tomorrow you go shopping for a brand new M3 convertible? wtfo? i don't think so general. keep sniffing glue though it will help you maintain the positive outlook.

The General's response:

"Maybe you didn't hear about the AirCanada Chap 11 filing. (or whatever is it in Canada) Aftr being days from liquidation, they came out with a huge Boeing order for 20 787s and 35 777s. The reason it later went south was a pilot dispute over seniority on certain planes---CP Air pilots versus old Air Canada. I don't think that would happen here (?), but it shows you that anyone can get new planes after a bankruptcy."

so what you are saying general if i understand you correctly...

no man...you're wrong...one time there was an airline in bankruptcy...and they almost got new airplanes...they didn't get new airplanes...but they had it all lined up and it almost happened...but then it didn't...but it could have and it could happen again...so i think it probably will...and i know that we here at DL are confident...that we will be flying fuel-efficient money making airplanes in the near future...because our executives now know that is the way to go...etc etc etc

did i see a -200 in SLC this morning?

you guys are deep in the korean cabbage general...deep!

 

[DetoXJ]

Detroit NWA + Delta + Ghetto Delta



http://www.funnyjunk.com/pages/ghettodelta.htm

 

[skykid]

And to succinctly respond to your current post, please define "strong." Is $5 billion in debt "strong"? Please do enlighten us with your deep wisdom.

Could you please post where you get "$5 billion in debt" from? Since you insist on telling me to do some research, I'd like to hear it.

I could give you a couple explanations. Depending on what source you use, 5 billion is about 28% of NWA's total debt, or about 18% of Delta's total debt, or about 11% of their combined total debt. If you mean what they owe in pension payments, that makes even less sense, but 5 billion is still low. Since you want me to "enlighten" you, I'd say that if either of these airlines only had 5 billion in debt, they woudn't be within years of a Ch11 filing.

The point is, you have no idea what you are talking about. The dead giveaway is when you have to go to "smart pills" and "jamming in the wrong hole" instead of facts or debate.

 

[skykid]

...except I really do enjoy my job.

Bye Bye--General Lee

That's obvious, and I commend you for it. You've got to remember, Delta only only has one union to deal with - a major advantage when it comes to flexibility. They'll get through Ch11 quicker because of it. GL, I love the route structure match up with NWA and Delta. How do you integrate the fleets?

 

[sandman2122]

From Juvat: "You've been jamming them in the wrong hole, which may be what's really affecting your attitude and sense of well being."

Just like a "lawn dart" pilot to be talking about shoving things up his butt!!

hardy har, har

I couldn't help myself!

 

[skykid]

Just like a "lawn dart" pilot to be talking...

Sandman, I doubt he is a pilot at all. He also says Delta and Northwest are "Losing hundreds of millions of dollars a day (literally!)." Hmmmm, do the math on that one.

This guy is a high school student at best, or has been drunk all afternoon.

Is that avatar your squaw?

 

[General Lee]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclone
you can't pay the mortgage. credit card bills are overdue. last time you made a car payment was in june. electric and phone bills are late. creditors calling. time to file bankruptcy so all the troubles go away.

filed bankruptcy today. tomorrow you go shopping for a brand new M3 convertible? wtfo? i don't think so general. keep sniffing glue though it will help you maintain the positive outlook.

The General's response:

"Maybe you didn't hear about the AirCanada Chap 11 filing. (or whatever is it in Canada) Aftr being days from liquidation, they came out with a huge Boeing order for 20 787s and 35 777s. The reason it later went south was a pilot dispute over seniority on certain planes---CP Air pilots versus old Air Canada. I don't think that would happen here (?), but it shows you that anyone can get new planes after a bankruptcy."

so what you are saying general if i understand you correctly...

no man...you're wrong...one time there was an airline in bankruptcy...and they almost got new airplanes...they didn't get new airplanes...but they had it all lined up and it almost happened...but then it didn't...but it could have and it could happen again...so i think it probably will...and i know that we here at DL are confident...that we will be flying fuel-efficient money making airplanes in the near future...because our executives now know that is the way to go...etc etc etc

did i see a -200 in SLC this morning?

you guys are deep in the korean cabbage general...deep!

Did you see one? Was it a Casino Express bird? It probably was. You don't know what you are looking at, do you? You seem to be very cloudy on what you are saying, and when I bring up a specific example (ok, two examples---AC and US)--you fold like a deck of cards. You can't seem to understand or comprehend that some people out there may have a plan that we don't know about, and maybe this is all in the "plan." You are really out of it. And, thanks for your expert analysis. CNBC is next for you.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

That's obvious, and I commend you for it. You've got to remember, Delta only only has one union to deal with - a major advantage when it comes to flexibility. They'll get through Ch11 quicker because of it. GL, I love the route structure match up with NWA and Delta. How do you integrate the fleets?

Good question. That is the one area that is "nebulous". At first it might not matter because certain planes could be used on original routes I guess. But, the rest of our fleet is kinda old (except 738s, 764s, and 777s), so the newly formed airline could ask for low bids from Boeing and Airbus to fill in the "rest of the fleet". NW did switch to mostly Airbus, but also ordered 20 787s. That was kinda surprising--you would think they would have stuck with all Airbus--like the A350. Look at South African Airlines. They have switched their relatively small fleet from Boeing to Airbus a few times. So, it isn't beyond the realm(sp?) of possibility. We have older fleets, and someday they will need to be updated. A good old fashion showdown between Boeing and Airbus for a large order could yield some savings.... All speculation anyway. If you merge two large airlines you can get rid of one of the managements, one of the reservation groups (our large one is in India), half of the ground people at each airport they both serve, and integrate fleets slowly. We already will be getting rid of 4 fleet types initially, and NW will be getting rid of DC9s, DC10s, and some older 757s. I wish Song could have those....?

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Jim Smyth]

I can just see the sales pitch now!


Delta Orient Airlines....................... D.O.A.

 

[Workin'Stiff]

NW Fifth Freedom Rights

Not sure where you got that info, but it's wrong. How did UAL acquire Pan Am routes, FedEx the Tiger routes, etc., etc. Airlines get the routes through bilateral negotiation, and they are then "owned", the airline can sell them with approval, or be acquired, with most, if not all of the routes going along with the sale.

OK, my information was second hand. However, after looking into it, NW and UAL hold big sticks in terms of fifth freedom in Japan. They are the sole US carriers allowed to do that. So NW owns a very profitable, and very exclusive, bargaining chip in terms of the far east.

As far as Japan though, there are no "Open Skies" or bilateral agreements in terms of passenger service. There are bilateral agreements in place for cargo only. And frankly, should the merger jeopardize the routes for NW, the US and Japan would be very unlikely to keep the original agreement and keep the exclusivity that NW and UAL enjoy in place. There is a classic "monopoly" in place with regards to US-Japan service... IMHO....

 

[General Lee]

Well, Pan Am and TWA were given "exclusive" rights to London Heathrow too, and they were sold. I have heard over the last 5 years that United could sell their lucrative Narita hub---but that would be to someone else, right? All it will take is "one call, that's all"(---dumb lawyer TV commercials...) from someone in the administration to get that fixed. (Remember, the Republicans hate labor, but not management. They all give huge contributions to those people) To say that it could NEVER be changed is probably stretching it. I think "Delta European Orient" Airlines sounds wonderful. Simply FABULOUS. Su-wheat.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Workin'Stiff]

General-

Well, I didn't use the word 'never' in my post(s), but 'very unlikely'. Can't really use absolutes in this industry, right???