Delta/NWA Question?

[IronCityBlue]

Iron City, don't you work for Jet Blue? Why not troll their threads and leave all the delta stuff to the interested parties. Or are you trying to suck up so you can hopefully get hired on?

Outsourcing is a trend that will harm all of us equally. It was a large part of the reason the initial 190 rates were so low, to compete with rock bottom 170 and RJ700 and 900 rates already (Neeleman basically delt himself an ace based on market rates caused by outsourcing). Outsourcing is bad and I'm against it at any airline.

 

[IronCityBlue]

It's no debate.

It's obvious that you are much more intelligent than any of the airline executives and have the whole industry figured out. Now, if you'd just get off this waste of time message board and go to your CEO suite, you could save Delta singlehandedly and put your millions in the bank already.

Oh. whats that? you're not Delta's CEO? oh. never mind.

Praising airline CEO's now, are we? Yes, they always know best. That's why they've trashed the customer service portion of the industry, an industry that hasn't made one penny under their watch, yet they ride off into the sunset with record breaking bonuses every day.

Of course CEO's want to oursource everything to the lowest bidder. Of course its up to pilots to stop that. Not sure where you're going with your argurment. You want to fly shiny new 777's for Delta Connection? Um, ok, go for it. I guess that makes about as much sense as praising airline CEO's.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

He has options you do not.

 

[ohplease!]

Outsourcing is a trend that will harm all of us equally. It was a large part of the reason the initial 190 rates were so low, to compete with rock bottom 170 and RJ700 and 900 rates already (Neeleman basically delt himself an ace based on market rates caused by outsourcing). Outsourcing is bad and I'm against it at any airline.

I'll bet the Legacy guy's think of you and your airline as just as much of a problem to the industry as ANY regional airline. After all, your airlines mode of operations (and your by way of your willingnes to work there at SUB-mainline rates with NO union representation) is to come into traditionally "legacy" cities and undercut (sometimes at losses) to "take their flying".

But since thats in your best interest, I guess that makes it alright....huh?

 

[IronCityBlue]

I'll bet the Legacy guy's think of you and your airline as just as much of a problem to the industry as ANY regional airline. After all, your airlines mode of operations (and your by way of your willingnes to work there at SUB-mainline rates with NO union representation) is to come into traditionally "legacy" cities and undercut (sometimes at losses) to "take their flying".

But since thats in your best interest, I guess that makes it alright....huh?

We would all benefit from a significant reduction in competition, including the prohibition of future start ups. But that's not a reality. As for "SUB-mainline rates" I assume you realize that no start up in modern history (ever?) has paid, out of the gate, established legacy rates. I'm sure you also realize that there are unionized pilot groups that fly JetBlue's sized aircraft (and much larger) for a larger percentage below "mainline rates" than JetBlue pays.

However part of your point, that some pilots are upset that JetBlue doesn't pay more, is accurate. No one knows that more than most JetBlue pilots. We are working as hard as we can to increase our pay rates, work rules, retirement contributions, etc. And yes, there is even a union drive in progress. (Actually a preliminary card campaign in advance of a full fledged drive that should officially start pretty soon).

But in any case, I hope you can tell the difference between a different airline flying for less than another airline (we ALL undercut SWA anyway on the pax side, now don't we?) and airline management within a company being free to shop its own lift around to the lowest bidder.

There is a profound difference between JetBlue flying for less than a legacy mainline rate and JetBlue underbidding another pilot group to fly A-320's and E-190's within the same company for less. I do hope you appreciate that immense difference.

And as far as coming into "traditional legacy cities" goes, the ONLY reason JetBlue was ever able to come into JFK and BOS (the VAST majority of our operation) is because of poor legacy management and corporate tactical blunders worthy of a History Channel special 20 years from now.

In any case, outsourcing is bad for everyone. The fact that you presently benefit from it (or percieve some benefit from it) doesn't mean everyone should burry their head in the sand and hope it just goes away. The first step is admitting we (collectively as pilots) messed up big time allowing planes to be outsourced. Only after first admitting that can we begin to discuss how to take corrective action.