Delta furloughing more?

[FDJ2]

So I guess you are green-slipping, huh?

I wasn't defending greenslipping or slamming it. I was just pointing out that he has no clue about facts of the litigation.

 

[Networ-King]

The sad thing about this whole greenslipping thing with the dalpa douches is that at America West when they furloughed, pilots were allowed to fly opentime in their contract as well, but their union had the balls to tell them "go ahead and fly as much opentime as you want, but we're going to penalize you $1000.00 dollars each time you do it"...... I remember seeing this in writing and I wish I had saved it to post here. Now THATS what a UNION is suppose to do. Find a way around the wording of the contract.... just like management. But I guess the guys/gals running dalpa are a bunch of greenslipping whores themselves.


Any AMWEST ...errrrr..... USAir guys out there that remember this post by your MEC? And could you post it here if you have it? Thanks

 

[av8n]

FDJ2 posted : You obviously have no clue about the litigation, but it is humorous reading your rants.

Since you are such an expert - please explain it to all of us.

 

[JohnQ]

FDJ2 posted : You obviously have no clue about the litigation, but it is humorous reading your rants.

Since you are such an expert - please explain it to all of us.

I'm a DAL pilot, and I will try and explain it.

In Dec 2000 there was a despicable grassroots no-OT movement. This was done while DAL was still hiring pilots, not when guys were on furlough. Some group of "they" decided that we shouldn't fly OT any more since the company was dragging their feet in negotiations.

So "they" decided that anyone who flew OT would have his name put on a bulletin board (funny how "they" never signed their OWN f'ing names next to it...the spineless wimps), flight kit stolen, etc. You know--real honorable stuff.

Then some REALLY stupid guys on the DAL ALPA forum decided that they would actively support the no-OT "program"--which under that pesky little thing called the Railway Labor Act is nothing more than an illegal withholding of service. The company finally sued ALPA for not taking specific action to prevent these guy from harassing other guys who were flying under the contract.

This was not a lawsuit to "force" guys to fly overtime. It was to prevent the harassment by the group of knuckleheads who thought that they somehow had the right to tell others what they could or could not contractually do, all without any sanction from the MEC. If these guys had just not flown OT on their own and not cared what anyone else did, then there never would have been a lawsuit.

BTW I've never flown OT. Why? Because I don't want to, that's why. But I wouldn't dream of telling another guy that he could not fly IAW with his union's negotiated contract, absent a specific order from his MEC.

But I am not sure that that opinion will be welcomed on this "you owe me" message board. As in "you owe me high pay rates, no OT flying, a good scope clause, better vacation rules, or even a liquidated company, all so I don't have to change anything ever, no matter how much the world around me changes."

 

[FDJ2]

JohnQ pretty much nailed.

 

[av8n]

So "they" decided that anyone who flew OT would have his name put on a bulletin board (funny how "they" never signed their OWN f'ing names next to it...the spineless wimps), flight kit stolen, etc. You know--real honorable stuff.

How can putting a notice on a bulletin board possilbly be a violation of the Railway Act? It called freedom of Speech, allegedly the backbone of Western Civilization.

The bulletin board is no different than a listing of sex-offenders. No one is telling them what to do, or what not to do, they are just being exposed for the selfish creeps that they are.

The company finally sued ALPA for not taking specific action to prevent these guy from harassing other guys who were flying under the contract.

Give me the names of all the pilots who were fired for harassment over the alleged no green slip campaign.

Give me the names of all the pilots who were fired for the stealing of flight kits during this time frame.

This was not a lawsuit to "force" guys to fly overtime. It was to prevent the harassment by the group of knuckleheads who thought that they somehow had the right to tell others what they could or could not contractually do, all without any sanction from the MEC.

This is not what was stated in the lawsuit by Delta themselves in the 11st Circuit Court of Appeals filed on 18 Jan 2005 on page 4. I quote "Delta relies upon many of the pilots choosing to work this open time to fufill its scheduled flights. If all of Delta's pilots were to refuse to pick up additional flights and refuse overtime, Delta would not be able to operate its full complement of flights."

Delta wanted nothing more than making voluntary overtime mandatory.

 

[FDJ2]

How can putting a notice on a bulletin board possilbly be a violation of the Railway Act? It called freedom of Speech, allegedly the backbone of Western Civilization.

Explain that to the 11th Circuit.


The bulletin board is no different than a listing of sex-offenders. No one is telling them what to do, or what not to do, they are just being exposed for the selfish creeps that they are.

Ah, nothing better than self appointed union thugs, elected by no one representing no one, but themselves, but full of a great deal of bravado. That's the way to maintain solidarity, everyone make up your own rules and force others to adhere to them. Forget that, fly by the contract stuff, av8n will tell you what you can or can't do.

Give me the names of all the pilots who were fired for harassment over the alleged no green slip campaign.

Give me the names of all the pilots who were fired for the stealing of flight kits during this time frame.

You've got to be kidding. Were you even there?


Delta wanted nothing more than making voluntary overtime mandatory.

What Delta wanted doesn't matter nearly as much as what the 11th Circuit ruled was the obligation of the union while engaged in section 6 negotiations.

 

[atpcliff]

Hi!

I just talked to my buddy at Delta, and he heard they were going to recall some guys soon, as they were getting short??!!??

We do have one guy here who took a leave of absence from Delta to come back.

Cliff
YIP

 

[737 Pylt]

Hi!

I just talked to my buddy at Delta, and he heard they were going to recall some guys soon, as they were getting short??!!??

We do have one guy here who took a leave of absence from Delta to come back.

Cliff
YIP

Cliff:
I don't know who your buddy is at DAL, but we are in NO uncertain terms recalling guys soon! The talk here is to furlough more if anything! After all, we need to keep those management bonuses going!
737

 

[michael707767]

BTW I've never flown OT. Why? Because I don't want to, that's why. But I wouldn't dream of telling another guy that he could not fly IAW with his union's negotiated contract, absent a specific order from his MEC.

I have not flown a greenslip since the furloughs began. Why? Trust me it's not because I didn't want to. I could have used the money. But, I think every greenslip that goes out is a slap in the face of our junior and more importantly our furloughed pilots. Every greenslip means the company can staff less, which means we all could have moved up and more pilots, perhaps all of them, could be back on property. I am disgusted with my union and with this pilot group that we could not even agree to no overtime with guys on furlough. Talk about an I've got mine mentality.

 

[Noserider76]

I have not flown a greenslip since the furloughs began. Why? Trust me it's not because I didn't want to. I could have used the money. But, I think every greenslip that goes out is a slap in the face of our junior and more importantly our furloughed pilots. Every greenslip means the company can staff less, which means we all could have moved up and more pilots, perhaps all of them, could be back on property. I am disgusted with my union and with this pilot group that we could not even agree to no overtime with guys on furlough. Talk about an I've got mine mentality.

100 percent agree with your post. We need to show that even though management doesn't give a rat's butt about the employees we will take care of our own. I think every pilot who wanted to return would be back by now if guys weren't picking up trips like candy on the sidewalk.

 

[Spooky 1]

100 percent agree with your post. We need to show that even though management doesn't give a rat's butt about the employees we will take care of our own. I think every pilot who wanted to return would be back by now if guys weren't picking up trips like candy on the sidewalk.

It is always hard to paint a realistic picture of the situation by simply looking at a few posts here on a website. What is the opinion of the majority of Delta pilots regarding this issue? Seems that if the majority of the Delta guys/gals felt the way you do, this would cease pretty quickly. Is this a hot topic in the lounge or LEC meetings or just something that most of the others look the other way at? Why don't you pass a MEC/LEC resolution that simply "discourages GS" until all the pilots are back to work? I supect that it might not pass, but then maybe there is another side to this story that we have not heard. All ears.

 

[Noserider76]

It is always hard to paint a realistic picture of the situation by simply looking at a few posts here on a website. What is the opinion of the majority of Delta pilots regarding this issue? Seems that if the majority of the Delta guys/gals felt the way you do, this would cease pretty quickly. Is this a hot topic in the lounge or LEC meetings or just something that most of the others look the other way at? Why don't you pass a MEC/LEC resolution that simply "discourages GS" until all the pilots are back to work? I supect that it might not pass, but then maybe there is another side to this story that we have not heard. All ears.

Unfortunately it doesn't seem to be much of an issue at all. At least with the pilots I fly with. With giant paycuts and BK most people's plate is full. I agree a resolution wouldn't pass and the union has its hands full already anyway. It needs to come from the ground up.

 

[av8n]

The bulletin board is no different than a listing of sex-offenders. No one is telling them what to do, or what not to do, they are just being exposed for the selfish creeps that they are.


Posted by FDJ2:

Ah, nothing better than self appointed union thugs, elected by no one representing no one, but themselves, but full of a great deal of bravado. That's the way to maintain solidarity, everyone make up your own rules and force others to adhere to them.

If you are not ashamed of your actions - why does a list scare you?



Give me the names of all the pilots who were fired for harassment over the alleged no green slip campaign.

Give me the names of all the pilots who were fired for the stealing of flight kits during this time frame.


Posted by FDJ2:
You've got to be kidding. Were you even there?

Either produce the names or "go get your shine box."

 

[FDJ2]

Either produce the names or "go get your shine box."

You want the names of pilots who were fired. YGTBSM, the 11th Circuit doesn't FIRE pilots, but it does interpret the law, levy sanctions, impose injunctions and if need be imprison. You can, however, find the names of at least 49 DAL pilot defendants, each having had a lawsuit of at least $100,000 filed against their personal estates by DAL if you're that interested in their names.