Declaring minimum fuel

[a&p cfiguy]

I'm looking for some thoughts on declaring minimum fuel. I've flown with captains that have done it and some that absolutly refuse to and will instead make a fuel stop at a different airport that would not have been necessary if ATC could have helped out a bit.

Say you're in a holding pattern close to your destination airport, they give you an EFC time and you figure out you can make it with alternate and reserve fuel, but then they give you another EFC time for 20 minutes later and now you figure that you will start eating into this reserve/alternate fuel. Should you declare minimum fuel in hopes of getting priority, or should you request a different destination (you're in a light private jet that can land at a number of nearby airports).

What if you're on a long cross country flight just inside the range of your aircraft. But 300 miles out, ATC descends you down low and if you descend you won't be able to make your airport (with reserve fuel). Should you declare minimum fuel in hopes they can keep you higher for longer, or should you just plan on making a fuel stop now (assuming there's a suitable airport available).

I guess the real question is, should you ask for and expect special treatment if you are running low on fuel to your destination, but have alternate fuel stops available along the way? Anyone ever have to deal with negative consequenses of declaring minimum fuel (when there was a suitable fuel stop nearby)?

 

[FLYLOW22]

Most of the time, ATC will force the declaration of emergency status and priority handling.

If you got to that stage, it's likely that it's A) not your day or b) a day that you should have diverted 30 minutes earlier.

 

[Wankel7]

I was coming back from Toronto and it was starting to look tight. As we were coming over the top of CVG direct to SDF ....then they started to vector us big time.

I just said that if we take these vectors it will put us at min fuel. He said...ok re cleared direct.

I guess they could have said well...tough take it. It would have been a goat rope with customs and all. But if we had to stop we had to stop.

I say if a little help from ATC could make the difference in stopping or not stopping ask for it. Maybe they will throw you a bone.

Now, if you are doing this every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday, and twice on Sunday....you could be pushing it

 

[dime line]

I'm looking for some thoughts on declaring minimum fuel. I've flown with captains that have done it and some that absolutly refuse to and will instead make a fuel stop at a different airport that would not have been necessary if ATC could have helped out a bit.

Say you're in a holding pattern close to your destination airport, they give you an EFC time and you figure out you can make it with alternate and reserve fuel, but then they give you another EFC time for 20 minutes later and now you figure that you will start eating into this reserve/alternate fuel. Should you declare minimum fuel in hopes of getting priority, or should you request a different destination (you're in a light private jet that can land at a number of nearby airports).

What if you're on a long cross country flight just inside the range of your aircraft. But 300 miles out, ATC descends you down low and if you descend you won't be able to make your airport (with reserve fuel). Should you declare minimum fuel in hopes they can keep you higher for longer, or should you just plan on making a fuel stop now (assuming there's a suitable airport available).

I guess the real question is, should you ask for and expect special treatment if you are running low on fuel to your destination, but have alternate fuel stops available along the way? Anyone ever have to deal with negative consequenses of declaring minimum fuel (when there was a suitable fuel stop nearby)?

In the quoted above, I have no problem declaring min fuel, have done it before, in this situation or any for that matter. But this situation you have no way to know if they decide to get you down early. And no negative consequences, why would there be?

 

[TurboHonda]

A minimum fuel advisory is just that, an advisory. You planned the trip legally and reasonably. If ATC directed changes push you outside the envelope that you planned and you’re eating up your legal reserves, you should advise ATC of that fact.

I have done it several times and will not hesitate to do it in the future. Typically, they will ask if I’m declaring an emergency and I will tell them no. I am only declaring a minimum fuel advisory.

 

[Bandit60]

A minimum fuel advisory is just that, an advisory. You planned the trip legally and reasonably. If ATC directed changes push you outside the envelope that you planned and you’re eating up your legal reserves, you should advise ATC of that fact.

I have done it several times and will not hesitate to do it in the future. Typically, they will ask if I’m declaring an emergency and I will tell them no. I am only declaring a minimum fuel advisory.

Could not have said it better. I have had the same thing happen to me when declaring min fuel. The controller asked me twice if I was declaring an emergency. Twice I had to say no that I am declaring min fuel. I then asked the controller if she know what that meant. To my suprise there was a long pause before she came on and told me yes.

 

[Coool Hand Luke]

A minimum fuel advisory is just that, an advisory. You planned the trip legally and reasonably. If ATC directed changes push you outside the envelope that you planned and you’re eating up your legal reserves, you should advise ATC of that fact.

I have done it several times and will not hesitate to do it in the future. Typically, they will ask if I’m declaring an emergency and I will tell them no. I am only declaring a minimum fuel advisory.

I concur.

I was going into Santa Fe one time on a CAVU day and someone in a Cessna was doing practice instrument approaches. We were given a hold as a result, which would have put us tight on fuel (hey it was in a Beechjet) so we simply told the controller we were min fuel. No problem, he had the Cessna make a one-pattern hold in his procedure turn and we came straight in and landed.

 

[fischman]

Do what you have to do to get the plane down safely.

 

[glasspilot]

I concur.

I was going into Santa Fe one time on a CAVU day and someone in a Cessna was doing practice instrument approaches. We were given a hold as a result, which would have put us tight on fuel (hey it was in a Beechjet) so we simply told the controller we were min fuel. No problem, he had the Cessna make a one-pattern hold in his procedure turn and we came straight in and landed.

I think I'd cancel IFR before I even thought about holding for some plane doing practice approaches.

He's procedure turn outbound? Fine, I'm in bound with the field in sight. See ya.

 

[Galaxy]

I think I'd cancel IFR before I even thought about holding for some plane doing practice approaches.

He's procedure turn outbound? Fine, I'm in bound with the field in sight. See ya.

Seeing this is in the frac forum...
Most fracs have rules about being on an IFR flight plan at all times. Some do have the ability to cancel IFR but must then be on a VFR flight plan. Like thats gonna happen...

I just don't see the fuss- It is not an emergency-I have used it a few times and heard it used plenty of times without an emergency being declared. There is a difference between min fuel and emergency fuel situation-.