decisions...

[down2mins]

Need opinions, please.

Places I'm looking at:

Eagle
Pros: seems stable, upgrade time (from what I hear) seems like it will be dropping, I like the bases and looks like its fairly easy to get your first choice, relatively decent 1st yr pay
Cons: commuting from CMH, $ for commuting
Questions/Concerns: I'm still unclear on the $ to commute and how that all works, but I can look that up in another thread unless someone cares to explain in detail . I'm interested in ORD, is that easy to get? Those of you there, how do you like it? How long is reserve?

ExpressJet
Pros: Company that seems to have "a good head on it's shoulders"...only time will tell how the branded flying works out. Contract seems pretty good. I know 5 or so people there who like it, good equipment, relatively decent pay. Good to average upgrade time.
Cons: Bases. I know guys who live in CMH and are based in CLE and IAH. I would prefer CLE, seeing as how it's only a 2 hr drive. I also know people who commute to IAH out of CMH, but I think I'd rather move than bother with that.
Questions: The mins are low, but I hear rumors they're not hiring at the mins? What are my odds with internal recs? What bases are going Jr? Seems CLE is getting fewer and fewer lines but that would be my first choice by a long shot. I would seriously reconsider going there if I was bound to get ONT. And how long is reserve running?

Colgan
Pros: CMH base? day trips?? Quick upgrade?
Cons: pay, training contract, everything else I hear some of the Colgan people complain about on here
Questions: Will CMH go Jr? Is it going to be a Saab base? Really, how is the equipment? What's upgrade time? And how long is reserve running?

All seem like they will hire low time right now. I'm not really chasing an upgrade, I'm chasing a QOL, so that's why I have a lot of questions. Pros of all: At least for me, they're hiring low time. Now before some of you start the comments, I'm relatively low time (650/101+) and am not itching to go to the first place that will hire me. If I see something I like, where I can enjoy a decent QOL, and fly for a good company, then why not get onboard if they'll take me. If not, I'm happy instructing until I find something that works for me. Basically, I don't have 'SJS', but just figure with the way the regional industry is right now, it may be a good time to move on.

Thoughts? Answers to questions?
Thanks.

 

[belchfire]

I know some old time AE people and flew for a while under the American Connection brand. It is my opinion that AMR runs the worlds largest, most dysfunctional airline and that Eagle is not much better...the culture is nearly the polar opposite (across the board) of SWA for instance.

I have a much higher opinion of the CAL family. They were headed "The American Airlines" way some decades ago but somehow through the turmoil of management changes and so on remembered that they are a service company-actually burned the books of the "thou shall nots" in a parking lot as a sign of the change...or so I have heard.

Colgan is a wild card. I really don't know that much about them but I have not read that much favorable. They remind me in many ways of some of the outfits I have worked for-in a distinctly unsavory way. If I were considering a turboprop outfit I would look more at Piedmont than Colgan.

Chasing the quick upgrade is fine to a point-I was burned by the chaos that followed 9-11 because I chased the quick upgrade. I got downgraded to FO and put back on FO pay by an outfit that still bills itself as a "stepping stone". A stepping stone that is (as it turns out) firmly placed in quicksand.

Be Very Careful!

Something you must consider is if there will be anywhere to step to-if there isn't for many years as in my case you would be better off somewhere with better working conditions and pay. Just don't get used to that better pay because when you do move to the bottom of someone else's list there will be a pay cut. Some folks are probably trapped at regionals by that syndrome now...

just my thoughts...

 

[BoilerUP]

How you liking the whale, belch?

 

[belchfire]

How you liking the whale, belch?

On the Eighth day God created Boeing! P&W too for that matter. I think the other guy is working for airbus...

hehehehehe

 

[Guitar Guy]

Some thoughts for you, down2mins.

Chasing upgrade can be a difficult road. First, the upgrades at any carrier can come to screeching halt and then you're stuck or you have to move to another "quick upgrade" and start at the bottom again. Second, if a company has a quick upgrade, it's usually because the working conditions aren't that great. Maybe you can gut it out, maybe you won't want to. But give that some consideration.

As for commuting, in a word: don't. Move to wherever you'll be based. You'll find that commuting takes away your off days when you have to commute in the night before a trip or a reserve block of days. Then you can add in the $$$ for a hotel room or crash pad. Plus, add in a cancelled flight or two or perhaps some weather and then that "easy" commute becomes not so easy or perhaps impossible. And does your future employer even have a commuter clause or will you burn through all of your sick time for your commute when you have trouble getting to work?

Honestly, I do wish you luck in whatever you decide to do. I'm just trying to give you some food for thought.

 

[pacsky72]

Eagle commute cost:
Commuting on CASS carriers would cost you zero. Commuting on AA/AE and NOT in the cockpit will cost you $11. Jumpseating with any AMR aircraft is also free. ORD would be very easy to get as a base. As a commute, you'd probably take Shuttle or UA to keep it free. If there were spots on Eagle you'd have that as well.
Eagle has a commuter-clause that keeps you safe if you can't make it in to work (and you attempted at least two flights, both of which would have gotten you in before your sign-in time). This comes in very handy when weather closes in and flights cancel or you are bumped in your attempt to jumpseat. If you call scheduling and let them know you're having difficulty getting in, they have the authority to positive-space you to work. In any event, this contract bit helps with ORD and it's many problems.
Good luck with your decision!

 

[Master Shake]

Since you don't sound to particular, try CommutAir. Dash-8's in addition to the 1900's and a CLE base.

 

[down2mins]

Thanks for all of the insights. I may be in touch with a few of you if I have more questions pop up here soon.

 

[Goose Egg]

No answers really, seeing as I'm pretty much in the same boat as you, but a thought, for what it's worth...

Isn't it interesting that the airlines that we were thinking about when we started this whole flying thing are not the airlines that we are considering now? Things have a tendency to change a lot. The airlines that I was nearly obsessed with all through my training are now way down on the list for me, with one possible exception (consult my avatar). Just an observation and a rambling thought. The internet seems to be good for that sort of thing.

But then again, I'm a little young to be telling stories that go nowhere.

-Goose

Edit: Advice: From what I've been able to tell, commuting is something that should be avoided if at all possible. I'm using that as one of my main criteria for my job search--commuting avoision.

 

[pilotyip]

There are tons of jobs poping up out there, just take one and if you don't like it take another. Make sure the next job is a career progression that makes sense to your next employer. You will know in five years if you made the right choice. Don't worry about QOL at this stage.

 

[AvroGuy]

There are tons of jobs poping up out there, just take one and if you don't like it take another. Make sure the next job is a career progression that makes sense to your next employer. You will know in five years if you made the right choice. Don't worry about QOL at this stage.

That is lame.!!! QOL should always be considered. Nothing worse than having to show up to a place you absolutely hate. But on the other hand if you can deal with it the upgrade may be fast.

Talking about upgrade. With 600TT, no matter where you go the upgrade will be a few years off. You will have to build your time before you qualify for capt. You may be able to get it done in 1-1 1/2 years if you can hold a line fast.

Commuting isn't that bad, the way I see it, as long as it is a one leg commute. Start doing multiple legs to get to work becomes stressful and stress sucks.

Eagle not a bad place. Just like anywhere else it has its problems, I came from XJ to AE and I am much happier. Not to mention I have a job and not still on furlough. Eagle pay is good in my opinion, it could always be better, and most of the equipment is fairly newish. If you come to eagle I would recomend the SAAB. You will hold a line in four-five months, now compare that to me in the CRJ. I have been holding the morning ready reserve line for the past four months(not by choice). I have been at the bottom of the CRJ fleetwide for 1 year now. Hopefully that will change in the near future. I am still here because of stability, pay, and QOL.

 

[down2mins]

I agree. Like I said, I'm not going to leave my perfectly good salaried CFI job to go work for next to nothing and have little time for an outside life, just to fly something turbine. That's why I'm being picky. Some say you can't be with low time, but it seems like there are quite a few options to choose from in today's market.

Thanks again for the thoughts. I'm actually now looking at Eagle, XJT, and PSA.

 

[Goose Egg]

...I'm not going to leave my perfectly good salaried CFI job to go work for next to nothing and have little time for an outside life, just to fly something turbine. That's why I'm being picky. Some say you can't be with low time, but it seems like there are quite a few options to choose from in today's market.

My thoughts exactly.

-Goose

 

[Flex81]

Doesn't CHQ have a CMH base? Why don't you try there. I heard they just lowered their minns to 1000/100. Upgrade will be a little longer now but I don't forsee it being as long as Eagle's.

As far as chasing an upgrade... I would say YES! -- go to a crappy company that flies turboprops because they always have a high turnover rate. That is, if you think you can tough it out. Yes, you may end up on the bottom of another regional's seniority list but only after you have the turbing PIC so who cares. At least you have a chance of getting hired at a major. This industry is all about timing. Get yourself competetive and then wait till something comes up and jump on it.

Don't forget- you can go from a crappy turboprop job to a major. I see it all the time. Guys with 3-4 years of 121 airline experience in a turboprop going to FedEX, Alaska, Frontier, Southwest, AirTran, Midwest, and fractionals such as NetJets, FlexJet and Citation Shares.

 

[fried chickens]

down and goose,
I've done the 5 hr trans con commute and and 1 hr commute. I have no problem commuting but I'm not married with kids. I've been fortunate to have a place to call home when I'm not at home. I'm not willing to move for this business. Bases change all the time.

If you guys want an airline job right now, just take the best one you can get right now, get some time in and jump ship maybe to republic so you don't have to commute. You guys aren't chasing the upgrade so who cares if you "waste" 6 months to 1 year with one company. During that time you'll figure out something more permanent.

FWIW if I was in your place, I'd go to XJET

 

[Flex81]

FWIW-- One of the places I would say NOT to go is XJET. Lets hope this new charter stuff works out for ya'll, but there is a very good possibility it won't and people may loose their jobs. Don't get me wrong, XJET is probably the best regional to work at...for now.

I also wouldn't go to Eagle. Upgrade times are not going to get that much faster (if at all). And of course don't go to the GO-JETS type palces cause everyone will hate you and you will never be able to catch a ride anywhere without wondering if the captain is going to let you on.

 

[Master Shake]

Flex81 is right. Stay far away from XJET. The camraderie will kill you.

Since (s)he knows the future, perhaps (s)he will grace us with tomorrow's winning lottery numbers.

 

[av8tor4239]

Go work for burger king and save your LIFE and the LIFE of your Children

 

[down2mins]

down and goose,
I've done the 5 hr trans con commute and and 1 hr commute. I have no problem commuting but I'm not married with kids. I've been fortunate to have a place to call home when I'm not at home. I'm not willing to move for this business. Bases change all the time.

If you guys want an airline job right now, just take the best one you can get right now, get some time in and jump ship maybe to republic so you don't have to commute. You guys aren't chasing the upgrade so who cares if you "waste" 6 months to 1 year with one company. During that time you'll figure out something more permanent.

FWIW if I was in your place, I'd go to XJET

How often do people use one regional as a stepping stone to another? I'm in the dark here. Does it make sense to go to not-so-desirable, no contract Regional A because they are hiring low time pilots, build time, and apply to more-desirable, higher mins Regional B? Seems like it could be looked at in a couple ways...as burning bridges and a lateral move OR as a well planned out career progression.

 

[Yodafly]

be based at home and work for Colgan

its not as bad as you read on here

its all about money, days off, commute and upgrade

pick a company only after you have discussed these things with an employee that works at each of your choices... they are all hiring