Alert Dear CubCrafters - please provide an upgrade for backup ignition batteries

[Neal]

Dear CubCrafters,

Many of us do not trust the PowerSonic 12V AGM battery as a viable solution for the ignition backup battery that comes standard from the factory or in kits for the EX-3/FX-3. There is a better option which I believe is used in the newer X/NX Cubs - the TCW IBBS LiFePO4 solution. A slim design that fits perfect in the space where the existing PowerSonic battery is installed.

As the TCW IBBS is not a trivial drop-in replacement I ask that CubCrafters provide a service bulletin or some instruction for those that may want to upgrade this battery to a better solution which CubCrafters already knows how to wire in as the ignition backup solution. You could sell a kit that includes the battery and new mount required to go in the place of the PowerSonic setup and instructions for what needs to be changed in the G3X config for the battery type change to LiFePO4.

The TCW IBBS 3AH is a perfect fit but another consideration would be the 6AH option that supplies power to both Light Speed ignition modules, if possible.

Upgrading to the TCW IBBS also eliminates the need for owners to remove the right forward panel at each condition inspection to replace the PowerSonic battery which only has a one year lifespan and some have found batteries failing at only two months after replacement. We cannot afford with our insurance to lose a plane over this, much less a life. You can do better, we can do better.

Please help us, your customers, be safer with more modern solutions for backup power.

 

[TailwindsJJ]

Neil hi
Does that IBBS 3AH battery act as a plug and play in terms of fit and wiring in place of the TCW lead acid original supplied by cub crafters.
It’s rather absurd that they shipped my kit with that lead acid battery that then sat for 3 years during my build and was dead by the second year.
Thanks

 

[TailwindsJJ]

Meant to say power sonic not TCW

 

[Neal]

Does that IBBS 3AH battery act as a plug and play in terms of fit and wiring in place of the TCW lead acid original supplied by cub crafters.

No, it is not a drop-in replacement which is why I'm asking CubCrafters to provide a service bulletin on how to replace the PowerSonic AGM option with a TCW IBBS LiFePO4 solution.

My advice to kit builders such as the EX-3:

-The PowerSonic battery should be charged and only used for testing. When the time comes such as the Airworthiness inspection (DAR) replace with new.

-The starter battery should be charged and stored per the vendor's instructions

-TCW outlines storage (non use) of the IBBS battery. You will need a charge solution, I suggest just buying theirs. I bet most kit builders don't know this and leave their IBBS uncharged and unused for years. Not good. Follow the vendor's guidance for all batteries

-If installing the Garmin G5, it has its own backup battery. I don't know the vendor instructions for storage and care of this battery.

 

[Neal]

Someone needs to come up with a charge solution for the PowerSonic AGM battery and should charge the battery prior to installing at the annual condition inspection. You don't know the state of the battery when receiving a new one and if you need to rely on it for backup ignition you are probably out of luck for the first flight or several flights after replacing. It's just a 12V battery so a NOCO would work, you just need to create an adapter which shouldn't be hard to do with the terminals below as the PowerSonic uses a narrower spade type:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B4H54KPS

 

[TailwindsJJ]

No, it is not a drop-in replacement which is why I'm asking CubCrafters to provide a service bulletin on how to replace the PowerSonic AGM option with a TCW IBBS LiFePO4 solution.

My advice to kit builders such as the EX-3:

-The PowerSonic battery should be charged and only used for testing. When the time comes such as the Airworthiness inspection (DAR) replace with new.

-The starter battery should be charged and stored per the vendor's instructions

-TCW outlines storage (non use) of the IBBS battery. You will need a charge solution, I suggest just buying theirs. I bet most kit builders don't know this and leave their IBBS uncharged and unused for years. Not good. Follow the vendor's guidance for all batteries

-If installing the Garmin G5, it has its own backup battery. I don't know the vendor instructions for storage and care of this battery.

Neil - Thanks
I did ask Earth X if they had a drop in replacement and I am going to check with them again.
I will post if I have any good news
Regards

 

[Neal]

They do not. This is covered on the forum recently in various threads related to the backup ignition battery. You can review my MOD where I used the EarthX ETX-104 which *is* a drop-in replacement, however, the ETX-104 is being discontinued. Their EBBS is their solution which is a larger version of the TCW IBBS.

 

[ve6yeq]

Next time I have access to the necessary crimp tools, I will remove the PowerSonic AGM battery and switch the right ignition to the existing TCW IBBS. I know that CC still has the option for the EX-3/FX-3 to have a non Garmin G3X panel that does not have the IBBS, but I would have to guess that the volume would be low enough just to drop that option from the lineup and switch to the IBBS (or EBBS) for backup power needs.

 

[Neal]

From a specifications standpoint, the PowerSonic meets the requirement. From experience, the data proves otherwise, in case anyone wonders why the desire to change.

 

[Cactus Charlie]

Next time I have access to the necessary crimp tools, I will remove the PowerSonic AGM battery and switch the right ignition to the existing TCW IBBS.

I think that would be unwise but maybe you have considered the reduction in the time the IBBS could power G3X Touch and found it satisfactory.

My alternator failure power management plan is to run G3X Touch on IBBS and ignition on main battery with all other non essential loads shed. I will not accept any reduction in the time IBBS can power G3X Touch system.

 

[ve6yeq]

I think that would be unwise but maybe you have considered the reduction in the time the IBBS could power G3X Touch and found it satisfactory.

My initial thinking was that the backup batteries (Garmin, IBBS, Ignition) would allow the aircraft to operate VFR long enough for a diversion and precautionary landing (>30 min) rather than an immediate emergency landing (~5 min). My thinking has changed about the role of the backup batteries, which are really only to prevent glitches (e.g., reboots during engine start, troubleshooting, and shedding loads) and to provide power for an immediate emergency landing. Power for any diversion and precautionary landing comes from either the starter battery (e.g., alternator failure) or the alternator (e.g., starter battery failure) after load shedding, especially if not in day VFR conditions.

The current 3Ah IBBS is more than enough (> 30 min) to power both the minimum day VFR Garmin G3X Touch, etc., and the right ignition for an immediate precautionary landing (e.g. land in a field not immediately below and to be able to do an inspection pass), as long as the diversion to the landing site is short and nothing more.

My alternator failure power management plan is to run G3X Touch on IBBS and ignition on main battery with all other non essential loads shed. I will not accept any reduction in the time IBBS can power G3X Touch system.

I also agree that treating the IBBS and ignition backup batteries as the power source during an alternator failure is incorrect. For situations where longer diversions to a site where a precautionary landing is possible (e.g. open water, remote forests), I am planning on installing some redundancy in both power generation (e.g. dual Munkworx generators) and power storage (e.g. support for a separate accessory battery with "boost").

 

[Neal]

I watched FlightChops latest video last night where he tested the Monkworkz

 

[Cactus Charlie]

I also agree that treating the IBBS and ignition backup batteries as the power source during an alternator failure is incorrect.

I believe, based on test data, that the IBBS is very capable of powering the entire G3X Touch system for more that 2 hours. That is why I want to get that load off the main battery immediately and save main battery capacity for ignition.

After alternator failure I consider IBBS to be primary for instruments and main battery to be primary for ignition.

If alternator failure is recognized immediately, and main battery is fully charged and in good condition, and power is managed appropriately, the existing FX-3 system is capable of sustained flight for well over an hour. I have also demonstrated, by flight test, that a 2 AH ignition backup battery in good condition will run the engine for over 30 minutes.

I strongly believe that changing the alerting system to give immediate warning of alternator failure should be a far higher priority that changing the electrical system itself.

I've said it before but here it is again - the standard FX-3 alerting system does not give immediate warning of alternator failure. There is no alerting until the main battery has discharged to the voltage alerting level. That may be far too late to plan a landing.