Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Friendliest aviation Ccmmunity on the web
  • Modern site for PC's, Phones, Tablets - no 3rd party apps required
  • Ask questions, help others, promote aviation
  • Share the passion for aviation
  • Invite everyone to Flightinfo.com and let's have fun

Dalpa say NO again to Parker.

Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Modern secure site, no 3rd party apps required
  • Invite your friends
  • Share the passion of aviation
  • Friendliest aviation community on the web

General Lee

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 24, 2002
Posts
20,442
NEW YORK, Jan 12 (Reuters) - The pilots' union of Delta Air Lines (DALRQ.PK: Quote, Profile , Research) reiterated its opposition on Friday to a takeover of the bankrupt airline by rival US Airways Group (LCC.N: Quote, Profile , Research), saying it had committed $15 million to the effort to ensure the bid fails.
The union, a vocal opponent of the takeover bid, is one of the nine members of Delta's official committee of unsecured creditors. The committee has a key role in deciding the future of the bankrupt airline.
US Airways offered to buy Delta on Nov. 15 and earlier this week raised its bid by about 20 percent to $10.5 billion. It has said that any job cuts under its plan would be carried out through voluntary leaves of absence and attrition.

The bid has been opposed by most Delta employees. The pilots' unions at America West and US Airways -- the two airlines that merged to form US Airways Group -- have also expressed reservations. But earlier this week the chief of the America West pilots' union said he was "neutral" to the bid and focused on protecting the interests of its members.
The Delta chapter of the Air Line Pilots Association said the new offer did not address issues it had raised earlier, including antitrust concerns, route overlaps, job losses and provisions of its contract with Delta.
It also said the increased offer would raise the debt load of the combined company by $1 billion.
"Delta pilots will not change any provision of our contract in order to facilitate the hostile takeover of our company," Lee Moak, chairman of the union's master executive council, wrote in a memo to pilots.
"As such, the MEC remains totally committed and one hundred percent focused on one thing -- the death of the US Airways' merger attempt," he added. (Additional reporting by John Crawley in Washington)


And this directly to the pilots from LEE MOAK today:


Parker mistakenly believes that he can somehow magically overcome the scope protections built into our contract and to date refuses to discuss the contract in anything other than superficial terms. The Delta PWA is a part of Delta's Plan of Reorganization and must be a part of any such plan of reorganization. Parker, however, simply ignores the implications of our contract. For example, in response to just a single issue, he has been quoted as saying, "We don't know enough about the contract and how this clause came to be." Pilot contract issues will not go away regardless of how much money Parker throws at this merger. For example, our contract:

o Prohibits a "code-sharing" relationship between Delta and US Airways that is critical to the success of the merger plan.
o Dictates that, in the event of a merger, our contract is the controlling document and all provisions remain in force, provisions which prevent many planned US Airways synergies.
o Provides that the amount of Delta flying cannot decrease during a merger transition period until full operational integration, a period that would take years.
o States that Delta pilots must fly any aircraft configured for over 76 seats. US Airways would be prohibited from operating an entire portion of their fleet of aircraft as a result of this provision.
o Most importantly, the Delta pilot contract is binding on any successor or affiliate, including a transaction where Delta is bought by another carrier or holding company subject to the provisions of Letter of Agreement 7, Bankruptcy Protection Covenant.

The Delta pilots will not change any provision of our contract in order to facilitate the hostile takeover of our company.



Bye Bye--General Lee
 
Last edited:
NEW YORK, Jan 12 (Reuters) - The pilots' union of Delta Air Lines (DALRQ.PK: Quote, Profile , Research) reiterated its opposition on Friday to a takeover of the bankrupt airline by rival US Airways Group (LCC.N: Quote, Profile , Research), saying it had committed $15 million to the effort to ensure the bid fails.
The union, a vocal opponent of the takeover bid, is one of the nine members of Delta's official committee of unsecured creditors. The committee has a key role in deciding the future of the bankrupt airline.
US Airways offered to buy Delta on Nov. 15 and earlier this week raised its bid by about 20 percent to $10.5 billion. It has said that any job cuts under its plan would be carried out through voluntary leaves of absence and attrition.

The bid has been opposed by most Delta employees. The pilots' unions at America West and US Airways -- the two airlines that merged to form US Airways Group -- have also expressed reservations. But earlier this week the chief of the America West pilots' union said he was "neutral" to the bid and focused on protecting the interests of its members.
The Delta chapter of the Air Line Pilots Association said the new offer did not address issues it had raised earlier, including antitrust concerns, route overlaps, job losses and provisions of its contract with Delta.
It also said the increased offer would raise the debt load of the combined company by $1 billion.
"Delta pilots will not change any provision of our contract in order to facilitate the hostile takeover of our company," Lee Moak, chairman of the union's master executive council, wrote in a memo to pilots.
"As such, the MEC remains totally committed and one hundred percent focused on one thing -- the death of the US Airways' merger attempt," he added. (Additional reporting by John Crawley in Washington)


And this directly to the pilots from LEE MOAK today:


Parker mistakenly believes that he can somehow magically overcome the scope protections built into our contract and to date refuses to discuss the contract in anything other than superficial terms. The Delta PWA is a part of Delta's Plan of Reorganization and must be a part of any such plan of reorganization. Parker, however, simply ignores the implications of our contract. For example, in response to just a single issue, he has been quoted as saying, "We don't know enough about the contract and how this clause came to be." Pilot contract issues will not go away regardless of how much money Parker throws at this merger. For example, our contract:

o Prohibits a "code-sharing" relationship between Delta and US Airways that is critical to the success of the merger plan.
o Dictates that, in the event of a merger, our contract is the controlling document and all provisions remain in force, provisions which prevent many planned US Airways synergies.
o Provides that the amount of Delta flying cannot decrease during a merger transition period until full operational integration, a period that would take years.
o States that Delta pilots must fly any aircraft configured for over 76 seats. US Airways would be prohibited from operating an entire portion of their fleet of aircraft as a result of this provision.
o Most importantly, the Delta pilot contract is binding on any successor or affiliate, including a transaction where Delta is bought by another carrier or holding company subject to the provisions of Letter of Agreement 7, Bankruptcy Protection Covenant.

The Delta pilots will not change any provision of our contract in order to facilitate the hostile takeover of our company.



Bye Bye--General Lee



1113c?
 
Well, I guess this is the end of it. Expect a concession announcement from Parker within a few hours.

{Oberstar}
 
Capt. Lee Moak said:
"As such, the MEC remains totally committed and one hundred percent focused on one thing -- the death of the US Airways' merger attempt," he added.

I cannot keep myself from being intrigued by this quote...
 


Nope. The only way anyone can pull an 1113c on us is if Delta or someone else CANNOT get DIP financing to exit BK. Since someone would be trying to BUY us, they obviously would have financing lined up. The BK judge already approved this for us.

Bye Bye--General Lee
 
Last edited:
Well, I guess this is the end of it. Expect a concession announcement from Parker within a few hours.

{Oberstar}

Parker just browned his shorts. Remember, Parker initally thought these were "technicalities." Then it went to "unexpected items." Maybe Parker could give another interview to USAToday......


Bye Bye--General Lee
 
Wow, what an ironic twist this could prove to be: Delta pilots could be the one who actually "limits" regional jet size and growth. That would be interesting.......

CD
 
All of those AWA/US CR9s with 86 seats would be parked until they could take out seats, down to 76. How would that affect the $1.65 billion a year in synergies and savings?


Bye Bye--General Lee
 
Nope. The only way anyone can pull an 1113c on us is if Delta or someone else CANNOT get DIP financing to exit BK. Since someone would be trying to BUY us, they obviously would have financing lined up. The BK judge already approved this for us.

Bye Bye--General Lee

General, I hope you are right but, as we have seen over the years, contracts are made to be broken.
 
General, I hope you are right but, as we have seen over the years, contracts are made to be broken.

The I suggest you consult the MEC, and the BK judge. It must have some weight if Parker and his people called them "unexpected items."


Bye Bye--General Lee
 
General I feel for you, but I think if your in Bankruptcy, the company that owns your job can define the work rules, all previous contracts are nullified unless the company wants to keep them. Even if they keep the name the same, they will just say it is "the new Delta inc". Just a thought at what Parker may be thinking.
 
The trick is that the Judge already approved the terms of DALPA's working agreement. It would be very hard to change those terms with an unwilling management.
 
I really don't give a Sh!t whether the deal goes through or not. What I can't understand is why you would want to keep a management team that has taken so much from you.
 
I really don't give a Sh!t whether the deal goes through or not. What I can't understand is why you would want to keep a management team that has taken so much from you.

It's called the lesser of two evils. Parker is no genius and he's definitely not the good guy. He just moves in on companies when all the cost cutting has been done by previous management.
 
hi Gen,

IMHO the NWA/DAL deal was struck before entering CH11.

Bonderman owns AWA/US and is providing the private equity deal for a NWA/DAL combo through the Texas Air Group, which he owns. Its all flash with a predicted outcome to drive the DAL creditors, and judge into the arms of the NWA/DAL combo. Its all about the "Big" money and always has been with the investment bankers cleverly pulling the strings within the Law.
We've seen theese investment bankers at work at NWA for a long time. Our old CEO , John Dasburg. left NWA and went to Burger King, and set up a deal for them to buy it from a UK company, now he is at DHL, and the names of the investment bankers are always the same.

Look at Newbridge Capital Partners and you will see Bonderman as a principal along with Blum, a NWA BOD member.

Newbridge struck a deal with the Bank of China a few years ago and spun a private equity deal worth 11 billion $, money thats being used to spawn new deals within the group, IE Bondermans Texas Pacific Group, ect....

Hang on it will be a fast ride I am sure.
 
hi Gen,

IMHO the NWA/DAL deal was struck before entering CH11.

Bonderman owns AWA/US and is providing the private equity deal for a NWA/DAL combo through the Texas Air Group, which he owns. Its all flash with a predicted outcome to drive the DAL creditors, and judge into the arms of the NWA/DAL combo. Its all about the "Big" money and always has been with the investment bankers cleverly pulling the strings within the Law.
We've seen theese investment bankers at work at NWA for a long time. Our old CEO , John Dasburg. left NWA and went to Burger King, and set up a deal for them to buy it from a UK company, now he is at DHL, and the names of the investment bankers are always the same.

Look at Newbridge Capital Partners and you will see Bonderman as a principal along with Blum, a NWA BOD member.

Newbridge struck a deal with the Bank of China a few years ago and spun a private equity deal worth 11 billion $, money thats being used to spawn new deals within the group, IE Bondermans Texas Pacific Group, ect....

Hang on it will be a fast ride I am sure.

You are probably right. Regardless, the DL/NW merge would have far less scrutiny from the GOV'T, and less job loss compared to a DL/US mess. If a merger has to take place, I would rather have one that makes the result as strong as possible, so we don't have to go through this mess again.


Bye Bye--General Lee
 
General I feel for you, but I think if your in Bankruptcy, the company that owns your job can define the work rules, all previous contracts are nullified unless the company wants to keep them. Even if they keep the name the same, they will just say it is "the new Delta inc". Just a thought at what Parker may be thinking.

And I thought Johnnie Cochran died??? You might need to ask our BK judge these questions.....He approved this.

o Most importantly, the Delta pilot contract is binding on any successor or affiliate, including a transaction where Delta is bought by another carrier or holding company subject to the provisions of Letter of Agreement 7, Bankruptcy Protection Covenant.


Thanks for feeling for me, by the way. This really isn't any fun for any of us.
I don't wish it on anyone.


Bye Bye--General Lee
 
Last edited:
General--If you think there won't be downsizing with a NW/DL merger, you're dreaming. What would it have? 13,000 pilots? MEM, CVG, DTW, MSP, ATL, JFK, SLC? Whether you turn MEM and CVG into "focus cities" or not, you've got excess.

And, you're still stuck with two former 'bankruptcy babies' and the associated debt and reorganization drain--even post-bankruptcy.

Be careful what you wish for...TC
 
General--If you think there won't be downsizing with a NW/DL merger, you're dreaming. What would it have? 13,000 pilots? MEM, CVG, DTW, MSP, ATL, JFK, SLC? Whether you turn MEM and CVG into "focus cities" or not, you've got excess.

And, you're still stuck with two former 'bankruptcy babies' and the associated debt and reorganization drain--even post-bankruptcy.

Be careful what you wish for...TC

If you read all of the articles out there so far, it seems to say otherwise. Most of DL and NW hubs are not close. Memphis and Cinnci might be downgraded to focus cities, but both have limited mainline service anyway. I see more RJ parkings. Most people are excited about a possible Northwest and Delta merger. I think, along with others, that it would be a power house.
The DC-9s may eventually go, but not all at once, since they are still producing revenue and yields are up. Both airlines are also flying more international flights, requiring more pilots. And I think they would have about 10,000 pilots total. Delta is down to 6,000 pilots, right? GL?
 
Heavy--You might be right. BUT! No airline just out of Ch. 11 will be a "powerhouse". Continued existance might be the most reasonable goal.

I remember debating with some moron on a.net (yeah, I know what it makes me...) about the future of USAir (pre-merger). He made similar statements: "shed debt, bright future, motivated employees". We saw how that worked out.

Insert statements about Delta/NWA: 'powerhouse, good fit, synergy...".

An airline just out of Ch.11 is like an airplane taking off over gross and losing an engine--you just try not to hit anything and keep flying and, gradually, maybe gain some altitude...eventually.

Do I think Delta/USAir would be good? Of course not. I'm just pi$$ing in their cornflakes and jerking the General's chain.

Would Delta/NWA be good? Of course not. I wouldn't wish that on the NWA guys.

But, I wouldn't wish a merger on anyone, anyway. TC
 
All these airline CEOs are arrogant bastards that think they have the courts in their pockets (and in most cases they do). Consequently, union contracts are just another bug to step on while fattening their personal bank accounts.
 
Hey, what are some real-world numbers? How much money are the creditors getting from Delta's plan vs. USAir's offer?


Many of the creditors are pre selling their claims. Delta claims were selling at about 60-80 cents on the dollar a couple of weeks ago.

Parkers' original plan was about 40-50 cents on the dollar, depending on how many additional claims would be generated by his "synergies" that could be lower. DAL's plan is about 60 cents on the dollar.

At the end of the day it's hard to tell, because we don't really know how much the original creditors still have in outstanding claims after the pre-sale. Many of them might profit more through future business with DAL than what they would get from either plan, let alone the difference between the two.
 

Latest resources

Back
Top Bottom