CVR for busting pilots?

[rajflyboy]

1. Can or could a CVR be used to get a pilot in trouble in the United States of America?

2. Can either the FAA or a company ever use a CVR for this purpose?

3. Would the pilot win the court case if this were to happen?

 

[Godfather]

1. NO...legally speaking the CVR/FDR can only be used for purposes of gathering data to examine and investigate causes of an accident or a failure of a particular item on the aircraft. This data is to be distributed only to the manufacturers, FAA, NTSB and company involved for analysis purposes.
However, if the NTSB or Feds fault the crew for "Pilot Error", after they conclude their investigation and you are still living to tell about it after an accident, you could get sued by the the surviving parties and their attorneys will do everything they can to obtain the CVR/FDR data to use it against you in court. Again, they can't use the actual data but they can cite the official Fed and NTSB report they used the data to help make their conclusion.

If you are involved in an altitude bust, clearance or separation deviation or in something where you walk away from the plane and no one got hurt or the plane was not damaged, then NO, CVR/FDR data can't be used, but the FAA will use their own ATC tapes, Radar data and FAA personnel testimony in the enforcement action and that is legal.

2. NO, not for any enforcement action. If they do, they broke the law.

3. Only if find the best attorney available that knows aviation law.

 

[rajflyboy]

Thanks for the post!

Good thoughts!

 

[CE750Driver]

1. NO...legally speaking the CVR/FDR can only be used for purposes of gathering data to examine and investigate causes of an accident or a failure of a particular item on the aircraft. This data is to be distributed only to the manufacturers, FAA, NTSB and company involved for analysis purposes.
However, if the NTSB or Feds fault the crew for "Pilot Error", after they conclude their investigation and you are still living to tell about it after an accident, you could get sued by the the surviving parties and their attorneys will do everything they can to obtain the CVR/FDR data to use it against you in court. Again, they can't use the actual data but they can cite the official Fed and NTSB report they used the data to help make their conclusion.

If you are involved in an altitude bust, clearance or separation deviation or in something where you walk away from the plane and no one got hurt or the plane was not damaged, then NO, CVR/FDR data can't be used, but the FAA will use their own ATC tapes, Radar data and FAA personnel testimony in the enforcement action and that is legal.

2. NO, not for any enforcement action. If they do, they broke the law.

3. Only if find the best attorney available that knows aviation law.

I know first hand of instances where Godfathers advice is not true. Take it with a grain of salt. The FAA cannot punish you for what is on it, but companys can, and probably will. No jury would ever go against them in court if it came to a trial.

 

[glasspilot]

If you work for an outfit that pulls CVRs in order to bust pilots then it would be in your best interest to get fired.

 

[CE750Driver]

If you work for an outfit that pulls CVRs in order to bust pilots then it would be in your best interest to get fired.

Not pulling CVRs in order to bust pilots, but when an incident happens and it is pulled by the Feds. Companies will use whats on there to punish you, and no court in the world will convict them if you are being stupid.

 

[Midnight Flyer]

1. Can or could a CVR be used to get a pilot in trouble in the United States of America?

2. Can either the FAA or a company ever use a CVR for this purpose?

3. Would the pilot win the court case if this were to happen?

Ok, what did you do!?

 

[GogglesPisano]

There is no law/reg that prohibits a company from pulling, listening to and using data from recording devices installed on their equipment.

The only thing that stands in the way of using this against a crewmember is a collective bargaining agreement.

 

[rajflyboy]

So

you think a court would side with a company doing that?

thats is questionable right there

 

[GogglesPisano]

So

you think a court would side with a company doing that?

thats is questionable right there

Why would a court get involved? The pilots could sue for wrongful termination, but on what grounds?