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Contract pilot questions

jrbevis

pilot
Joined
Dec 13, 2005
Posts
75
Total Time
3500
Curious if you guys have ever experienced any of these situations. If so, please comment on how you handled them.
1. The guy sitting left seat is out of currency and me (the guy in the right seat is current). I put his name on the flight plan since he is the guy getting paid to be PIC. If something happened during flight would I have any repercussions since I am the only qualified guy to be PIC?
2. Would insurance clear him to be PIC if he is out of currency?
3. If you airline on a Monday night to start a Tuesday AM flight do you charge for 2 days?
Thanks!!
 

jasonwb

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 26, 2004
Posts
67
Total Time
6000
Curious if you guys have ever experienced any of these situations. If so, please comment on how you handled them.
1. The guy sitting left seat is out of currency and me (the guy in the right seat is current). I put his name on the flight plan since he is the guy getting paid to be PIC. If something happened during flight would I have any repercussions since I am the only qualified guy to be PIC?
2. Would insurance clear him to be PIC if he is out of currency?
3. If you airline on a Monday night to start a Tuesday AM flight do you charge for 2 days?
Thanks!!



I'll give these a shot..........

1. you are the only qualified PIC, so yes, you are responsible. just because he is getting paid as PIC for whatever reason, you are current and qualified so its all on you. the faa doesnt care who's been there the longest, knows the passengers the best, or whose getting paid the most........you are the PIC so YOU need to paid as PIC.....and you should have your name on the flight plan.....you handle this one by telling them," i know these are your passengers(if this is the case), and i am only a contract guy, but i am current so i need my name on the flight plan. i am more than happy to let you fly every leg since they are your passengers, but i will be the final authority when it comes to the decisions made during the flights"

2. I don't know of any insurance company that would clear them as PIC out of currency. if you are doing a lot of flying with them, you should fill out their "pilot insurance" form so you can be added to their insurance(if you havent already)......again, you should be paid as PIC since you technically are the PIC....you handle this one by telling them, "tell your owners to send you to school and get you current" (if that's the case)

3. You betcha you charge them for 2 days if you airline out the day before....and they pay for your expenses from the time you leave your house to head to the airport to catch that airline. dont let them try to push you into only paying you when the actual "trip" starts. you are away from home so the "trip" starts when you walk out the front door of your house. i know some guys are just happy to get trips these days, but we have to stand our ground as contract guys no matter what the industry is doing. we are only hurting ourselves and the rest of the industry if we start doing our duties at a lesser rate or for that matter, traveling the day before for free....

...out of curiosity, what type aircraft are you flying?

hope this helps you out........i dont know all the details of your situation.......

Good Luck!
JB
 

Fly91

Registered Pilot
Joined
Jul 31, 2008
Posts
635
Total Time
lots
Curious if you guys have ever experienced any of these situations. If so, please comment on how you handled them.
1. The guy sitting left seat is out of currency and me (the guy in the right seat is current). I put his name on the flight plan since he is the guy getting paid to be PIC. If something happened during flight would I have any repercussions since I am the only qualified guy to be PIC?
2. Would insurance clear him to be PIC if he is out of currency?
3. If you airline on a Monday night to start a Tuesday AM flight do you charge for 2 days?
Thanks!!

I assume you're talking Part 91. Part 135...don't read this.

My take on it:

He is still the PIC and he IS QUALIFIED to fly that plane, his type-rating from the FAA says he's qualified. He can legally be on the flight plan too. Insurance companies don't make law, they make company policies that just tells an aircraft owner what they require so they will be covered in the event of an accident. He never needs to go to recurrent training if the insurance company doesn't want that. (I'm sure they do though)

If something happened on that flight...lets say an operational violation. That PIC would get the violation as PIC, you might or might not be violated as the SIC. Alot of times they let the SIC slide. FAA violates people...not insurance companies. Recurrent training, Part 91, is all about the insurance companies...not the FAA and a pilots certificate.

If I were you, I'd keep my name off that flight plan as much as possible. If something does happen, he will have to deal with it as PIC. Its not your responsibility, Part 91, to make sure the "other guy" is current anyway. You are current, so at least you're covered for insurance. But it doesn't really matter if one pilot is NOT covered, if something happens they can void the insurance just because he is not current. The aircraft owner would have to deal with the insurance company if something happens to the plane and they audit his PIC pilot records and see he's not current. The pilots walk away. He will get burned, they will probably drop the insurance and not cover the damage, and the owner will have to pay for the damage himself.

Also, nothing can happen to the PIC regarding a violation from the FAA either, he's 100% legal to fly that aircraft with just his type-rating. The FAA doesn't care about non-current pilots Part 91.

It's up to the insurance company if they want to "clear" him to fly out of currency. I've flow for someone 3 months out of currency and the insurance company approved me to do that trip. Just depends. That approval must be given before the flight of course.

Now, he'd be in a whole bunch of trouble for knowingly flying without currency under Part 135 or his 135 check rides.

Hell yeah, you charge every day you're gone from home.

.
 

K.V.

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 14, 2003
Posts
240
Total Time
a lot
I assume you're talking Part 91. Part 135...don't read this.

My take on it:

He is still the PIC and he IS QUALIFIED to fly that plane, his type-rating from the FAA says he's qualified. He can legally be on the flight plan too. Insurance companies don't make law, they make company policies that just tells an aircraft owner what they require so they will be covered in the event of an accident. He never needs to go to recurrent training if the insurance company doesn't want that. (I'm sure they do though).



I'm pretty sure 61.58 applys to part 91.



Sec. 61.58 - Pilot-in-command proficiency check: Operation of aircraft requiring more than one pilot flight crewmember.
(a) Except as otherwise provided in this section, to serve as pilot in command of an aircraft that is type certificated for more than one required pilot flight crewmember, a person must --
(1) Within the preceding 12 calendar months, complete a pilot-in-command proficiency check in an aircraft that is type certificated for more than one required pilot flight crewmember; and
(2) Within the preceding 24 calendar months, complete a pilot-in-command proficiency check in the particular type of aircraft in which that person will serve as pilot in command.
 

ruhroa

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 17, 2003
Posts
234
Total Time
8300++
you are either current as a PIC or not. If you are not current then you cannot sign the paperwork as the PIC........ In fact i would think it would open a hornet's nest should anything happen as i am sure the insurance company requires current and qualified crew ...for an example maybe the PIC lost his medical for some reason, he still has a type so that kind of negates the faa type rating makes you legal theory. I believe that as a contractor you fall in the tough position of do i want a days pay vs do i insist on being paid to get to the position to fly (work) for a day. I have run ino this several times, i know with people available in the local area that it is a tough sell (helping out a friend) who lives far enough away that he / she would want to be paid an extra day esp if it is a day trip. read paying a local 1k for a day trip vs paying a friend etc. 2 days pay plus airfare and hotel and meals . cost becomes 2k plus a couple of hundred for hotels and meals for a day trip. i got to tell ya you may be right to want that compensation. but it is hard to justify the extra outlay under the banner "we are sticking together"
 

pilothouston123

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 11, 2005
Posts
245
Total Time
>7,000
"If something happened during flight "
This is the most important thing to remember. Insurance companies run the freedom of Billioniares. If something does happen, inusrance companies are going to look for a way to void your insurance and not pay a claim, Then get you a new career.
 

ksu_aviator

GO CATS
Joined
Dec 1, 2001
Posts
1,327
Total Time
4100
Curious if you guys have ever experienced any of these situations. If so, please comment on how you handled them.
1. The guy sitting left seat is out of currency and me (the guy in the right seat is current). I put his name on the flight plan since he is the guy getting paid to be PIC. If something happened during flight would I have any repercussions since I am the only qualified guy to be PIC?
2. Would insurance clear him to be PIC if he is out of currency?
3. If you airline on a Monday night to start a Tuesday AM flight do you charge for 2 days?
Thanks!!

1. Yes.

2. Hell no. They go above and beyond the FAA's requirements. Chances are that if a pilot hasn't been to a 142 training course in the last 6 months, that pilot isn't insured to fly the aircraft. That doesn't mean the pilot can't fly the aircraft, but it does mean that he isn't covered.

3. Two days

4. The question you didn't ask...Can the Insurance company hold me liable in the event of a claim? The answer is YES. It is a long explanation, but basically if you allow someone to operate the aircraft outside of the FAA rules (which it sounds like you would be), than the insurance company could file a suit against you for that loss. This would only happen if the owner lawyered up and claimed he didn't know the "PIC" wasn't current. If they found out you were current and knew that the "PIC" wasn't, then you could and would be held liable. Not to mention what the FAA might do to you.
 
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