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Continental Pilots Protest Additional Scope Violations

CancelIFR1200

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OvrBlk
Continental Pilots Protest Additional Scope Violations

Houston, Texas, June 20, 2011—The Continental pilots, represented by the Air Line Pilots Association Int’l (ALPA), have filed two group grievances against United to protest violations of scope provisions in their collective bargaining agreement applicable to a merger during the period of separate pilot contracts and operations of the two airlines, legacy Continental and legacy United. The first, filed June 2, 2011, concerns removal of B-767 aircraft from the Continental fleet (by sale). The second charge, filed June 16, 2011, is related to a reduction in the ratio of Continental to United flying required with respect to twin-aisle aircraft, specifically for the third quarter of 2011. ALPA is seeking prompt correction of these issues by the company, including a stop to any attempts at further sales of B-767 aircraft, correction to the ratio of flying performed by Continental to United, monetary damages and all other appropriate relief.

“Once again, management is seeking short cuts to the merger process and trying an end-run around our contract instead of negotiating at the table,” said Capt. Jay Pierce, chairman of the Continental pilots’ chapter of ALPA. “In the airline industry, attempts to cut corners typically lead to very bad results. Blatantly disregarding our existing contract not only runs contrary to management’s stated interest in reaching ‘fair’ resolution on a new contract, it is no way to make progress toward successfully completing the merger and securing much-anticipated benefits for passengers, shareholders and employees.”

These two incidents mark the second and third time since the merger close date in October 2010 that ALPA has been forced to fight off management attacks to the Continental pilots’ contract. In December, an arbitrator ruled in favor of ALPA and against Continental management in their attempt at circumventing scope provisions related to 70-seat jet flying.

The Continental scope provisions protect pilots’ job security, both generally and during a transaction such as a merger. The provisions reserve for Continental pilots all flying performed by or for Continental or an affiliate, while allowing exceptions for flying that can be performed under code share or by another airline, such as foreign carriers, Continental Connection and Express carriers. During the period of separate operations in a merger, the scope provisions, among other things, prohibit certain types of fleet changes and require that ratios of Continental pilots’ flying to the merger partner’s flying equal or exceed those same ratios prior to the merger.

ALPA represents over 53,000 pilots at 39 airlines in the United States and Canada, including approximately 5000 pilots at Continental Airlines.
 

COpilot

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"Dignity & Respect, Working Together" are these just words, and catch phrases you like to throw around Mr Smisek; do you think we can't even count?
 

luckytohaveajob

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A lawsuit will be delayed for years and a grievance win won't change anything.

What happens if the CAL ALPA wins the grievance and the planes are already sold or parked? The planes are already sold! The company will price it in as the cost of the transaction.

HOW DID PBS WORK? In the companies favor.

HOW DID SLEEPING IN THE CREW ROOM DURING IRREGULAR OPS GO? In the companies favor.

HOW DID THE AGE 60 INSTRUCTOR THING WORK OUT AT CAL? In the companies favor.

HOW DID THE 70 SEAT UAL EXPRESS FLYING OUT OF CAL HUBS? In the companies favor.

HOW HAS THE EXTENDED CONTRACT NEG. BEEN WORKING OUT? In the companies favor.

HOW DID THE ACARS TIMES DISCREPANCIES WORK OUT? In the companies favor.

WHAT MATERIAL VICTORY HAS CAL ALPA WON WHICH IMPROVED THE LIVES OF THE CAL PILOT? NOT ONE ITEM!

Call in sick when you are sick, slow down, write up items, say no, and stop the show with the parking brake.
 

xkuzme1

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A lawsuit will be delayed for years and a grievance win won't change anything.

What happens if the CAL ALPA wins the grievance and the planes are already sold or parked? The planes are already sold! The company will price it in as the cost of the transaction.

HOW DID PBS WORK? In the companies favor.

HOW DID SLEEPING IN THE CREW ROOM DURING IRREGULAR OPS GO? In the companies favor.

HOW DID THE AGE 60 INSTRUCTOR THING WORK OUT AT CAL? In the companies favor.

HOW DID THE 70 SEAT UAL EXPRESS FLYING OUT OF CAL HUBS? In the companies favor.

HOW HAS THE EXTENDED CONTRACT NEG. BEEN WORKING OUT? In the companies favor.

HOW DID THE ACARS TIMES DISCREPANCIES WORK OUT? In the companies favor.

WHAT MATERIAL VICTORY HAS CAL ALPA WON WHICH IMPROVED THE LIVES OF THE CAL PILOT? NOT ONE ITEM!

Call in sick when you are sick, slow down, write up items, say no, and stop the show with the parking brake.

WOW. I dont work for CAL, but this is a good argument. Well said. How long til those REALLY REALLY young (undeserving) 777 Captains fall off the list?

X
 

luckytohaveajob

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Lets read some CAL pilots say "shut it down."

Group grievance and a lawsuit! Yawn. Jay Pierce's messages sound like he has been in the board room to long. His tone is weak. He attitude is weaker. And his concern appears to not be anything but lip service.

Let read Jay say shut it down.
 

Ex737Driver

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A lawsuit will be delayed for years and a grievance win won't change anything. Wrong. See 70 seat court award.

What happens if the CAL ALPA wins the grievance and the planes are already sold or parked? The planes are already sold! The company will price it in as the cost of the transaction. Or actually be forced to purchase additional wb's to compensate. See Reuters for Air India delayed 787 deliveries.

HOW DID PBS WORK? In the companies favor. Still working. Waiting for improvements in next contract.

HOW DID SLEEPING IN THE CREW ROOM DURING IRREGULAR OPS GO? In the companies favor. How you figure? It's happened how many times since then? 0. If a pilot chooses to do so in the future, their stupidity.Company has agreed to pay for irreg ops rooms either directly or through expense reimbursement.

HOW DID THE AGE 60 INSTRUCTOR THING WORK OUT AT CAL? In the companies favor. Did lose it.

HOW DID THE 70 SEAT UAL EXPRESS FLYING OUT OF CAL HUBS? In the companies favor. Wrong. Union won grievance in court. Still UAL and not CAL flying.

HOW HAS THE EXTENDED CONTRACT NEG. BEEN WORKING OUT? In the companies favor. I missed your name on the list of negotiators. You know this, how?

HOW DID THE ACARS TIMES DISCREPANCIES WORK OUT? In the companies favor. Wrong. Times may be changed for sonic but pay remains same for pilots.

WHAT MATERIAL VICTORY HAS CAL ALPA WON WHICH IMPROVED THE LIVES OF THE CAL PILOT? NOT ONE ITEM! Wrong. To not be a cal pilot, you really seem to think you know a lot about us.

Call in sick when you are sick, slow down, write up items, say no, and stop the show with the parking brake. First smart things you've said.


For someone that will never be a pilot for cal or the new ual, you really seem to have an obsession with us. Your apparent hatred of cal smacks of a child that has been told no and had their hand slapped. sad.
 

luckytohaveajob

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--PBS. Hows that working out? Everyone at CAL is on reserve conversion.

--70 seats UAL Exp flying out of CAL hubs with CAL paxs. The simple fact of the passenger having to use two tickets has not stopped anything. The CAL website will book the flight with 70 seat connections without any pax inconvenience. And gate agents, electric carts, and others are all to happy to make sure the pax gets from the CAL flight to the UAL Exp flight without issue.

--More 787 orders because of an issue of losing the B767 is not a victory. Those B787 orders would occur regardless. So CAL pilots will give up on today for a promise tomorrow. Not good.

--CAL pilots did sleep in the crew room and once is enough to say it all.

--And as far as the negotiations go I do have a personal interest.
 
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luckytohaveajob

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Ex737Driver and Jay Pierce both sound like Charlie Sheen.

Winning! Duh!

How is the winning over at CAL? In the companies favor!

70 seats/SCOPE--Arbitration work around
WB airframes decreasing--Contract enforcement nonexistent
Negotiation time table, pace, momentum, and issues?

The four corner stones of the contract sound more like:
1) What can we fly master?
2) We will work for less if we get ------? and blank is not pay
3) Retirement is not an issue we can work till 65
4) Benefits are not needed because Obama care has taken care of us

Why is the fight such a secret? What are the threats to the company?

Management has stepped up their attacks not withdrawn. And I am also not just being critical after the fact.

Jay Pierce is a liability. He said SCOPE was a nonstarter. SCOPE is vitally important, but his play had a chilling effect.

If he had instead allowed the company to implement section by section the Delta deal on everything but SCOPE and then blocked the final ratification because of SCOPE we could sit tight. Now the company has counter attacked and the union is playing defense when the union should be driving the ball home with pressure on the company.

A year has have been lost. But CAL is winning. duh! Jay Pierce sounds just like Charlie Sheen.
 
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luckytohaveajob

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Bump.

So what is Jay Pierce's strategy? Stone wall the company into submission while the CAL pilot rolls over on both groups?
 

Flopgut

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******************** you punk. Go straight to hell....

We're doing everything in our power....
 

densoo

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Please, stop violating the contract. If you don't stop immediately they might stop saying "please."
 

Flopgut

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Like flying reserve captains as FO's?

Pay close attention. That is a perfect example of something that has changed. That has stopped.

We've won a scope arbitration. We will win this most recent one as well. And there may be another after that. There is a mediator involved now and all this poor faith negotiating on mgt's part will account for something. This is a huge airline with a lot of money and it's going to take a while. There is no point in acting hard and popping off about who's got balls and who doesn't. Guys like you who do are usually boot-lickers when it actually gets down to doing something.

You don't need to bump this thread anymore, just go away.
 
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