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Contact your local congressman

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nismo611

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 22, 2008
Posts
90
I have noticed that on FI and other aviation forums there are many complaints about aviation overall but I wonder how many people are actually doing something about it so I decided recently to contact my local congressman and as many others as I could find and I complained about the sad state of aviation including debts incurred to become a pilot and how the student loan companies are having there way with all of us but are still being bailed out, low salaries across the board, and also the state of the regional airlines with low time pilots with even lower pay scales. Please take a minute to call your local congressmen and the congressmen where you have either lived in the past or where you did your flight training. This industry is going down the drain, and it will continue to do so until people stand up and attempt to do something about it.
 
What do you want congress to do about the cost of learning to fly?

How are loan companies "having their way" with you?

You want congress to mandate higher pilot salaries?

I hear you whining...what solutions do you offer or propose?
 
What do you want congress to do about the cost of learning to fly?

How are loan companies "having their way" with you?

You want congress to mandate higher pilot salaries?

I hear you whining...what solutions do you offer or propose?


First of all they need to raise minimum time to get into a regional or a transport category aircraft, for example make having an ATP a requirement. That alone would help push salaries up, too many pilots want so badly to fly a jet that they will just take sub par pay to do it. Furthermore if you think it is ok for a 250 hour pilot to be flying you around then you are crazy. Student loan companies are no better than a loan shark with terms and conditions and borrowing costs. Why do they deserve such a huge bailout? Let them go under force the federal government to take over private loans or regulate them more closely. I do not want the government to do anything about the cost of learning to fly.
 
First of all they need to raise minimum time to get into a regional or a transport category aircraft, for example make having an ATP a requirement. That alone would help push salaries up, too many pilots want so badly to fly a jet that they will just take sub par pay to do it. Furthermore if you think it is ok for a 250 hour pilot to be flying you around then you are crazy. Student loan companies are no better than a loan shark with terms and conditions and borrowing costs. Why do they deserve such a huge bailout? Let them go under force the federal government to take over private loans or regulate them more closely. I do not want the government to do anything about the cost of learning to fly.
Which "student loan companies" (is that another term for "banks"?) got bailouts. Why did you take out a loan with oppressive terms? What further regulations would be needed?

I will write a letter asking my representatives to support any move to make ATP flight experience the new minimum for Part 121 flight crew. I think we have a splendid window of opportunity now with the glut of pilots available through furloughs and age 65 impact.
 
yes banks, I was young and naive it was my only available funding to finish my education. Sallie Mae, Citi, and Key. I firmly believe no 121 carrier should use low time pilots, use on the job training i.e. Tab GIA, or accept anything less than a professional with a professional background. It is hard to build time but it is better than ending up dead.
 
yes banks, I was young and naive it was my only available funding to finish my education. Sallie Mae, Citi, and Key. I firmly believe no 121 carrier should use low time pilots, use on the job training i.e. Tab GIA, or accept anything less than a professional with a professional background. It is hard to build time but it is better than ending up dead.

OK. Here is my draft letter to my senators and congressman. What do you think.
************
Dear [Congressman/Senator][ ]:

I am writing to ask your support in any effort to increase the minimum aviation experience requirements for airline pilots. The usual minimum requirement for new First Officers is a commercial aircraft certificate with instrument and multi-engine ratings (See CFR 121.383). That could mean the pilot would have as little as 250 hours flight experience as that is the minimum for the Commercial Pilot Certificate (see CFR 61.129). Indeed, in the middle of this decade, some operators have used pilots with that level experience.

I would strongly support any measure that increased employment requirements for all airline pilots be increased to those for an Airline Transport Rating. Among other things, this rating requires a minimum of 1500 hours of flight experience (see CFR 61.159).

Requiring pilots to obtain an additional thousand hours of flight experience doing other commercial flying will better prepare them for the demands of airline flying.

I foresee the following effects of such requirements:
.....The pool of qualified candidates will diminish
.....The compensation new pilots expect will be higher.
.....The cost of air travel will rise to a small degree as new pilot pay rises
.....The new pilots will be better prepared for their training at the airline.
.....The flying public will enjoy an added degree of safety reflecting the increased experience floor for all aircrews.

Thank you for your consideration in this matter.

Sincerely,
 
This industry is going down the drain, and it will continue to do so until people stand up and attempt to do something about it.
You're new to the industry, aren't you? Student pilot or flight instructor, perhaps? The industry is about where it's always been, going through the same cycles it always does. This your first time around, then?

First of all they need to raise minimum time to get into a regional or a transport category aircraft, for example make having an ATP a requirement.
"They?" You want congress to modify the regulation and establish this standard under 14 CFR Part 121...the Title under the Code of Federal Regulations entrusted to the FAA? You're not writing the FAA in this regard?

Who is this "they?"

Have you contacted each of the regional airlines and the unions that cover those airlines to discuss this and to lobby this idea, or is your idea of changing the world to simply write a letter to your congressman and have him jump right on it?

You believe the industry is going down the tubes and a letter to congress fixes it? Brilliant. Take care of that pesky deficit while you're at it. "They" should do something about that, too.

I firmly believe no 121 carrier should use low time pilots, use on the job training i.e. Tab GIA, or accept anything less than a professional with a professional background.
What exactly is a "professional background?" You think a pilot with 1,500 hours and a wet ATP is vastly more experienced? You think the ATP actually makes any difference in piloting ability? You're not really that blind, are you?

It is hard to build time but it is better than ending up dead.
You can find a link between youthful pilots and dead pilots? How many of the major air disasters over the past, say, 50 years have been at the hands of inexperienced, youthful pilots?

I had a discussion onu this topic today with a friend who noted that his second year of flying, at 500 hours, he was flying an F-105, and at 1,200 hours was leading 20-ship strike formations deep into Vietnam. Too bad nobody made him wait until he had 1,500 hours before they considered him professional enough to do his job, isn't it?

Furthermore if you think it is ok for a 250 hour pilot to be flying you around then you are crazy.
At 250 hours I was doing formation flight beneath powerlines, spraying fields, fresh out of high school...and doing a pretty good job. I used to get asked frequently by passengers if they could see my driver's license...they wanted to see if I was old enough to be flying them...some weren't joking. Many of them were your ilk...ones who were too ignorant of the facts to be taken seriously; clearly they didn't know what they were talking about.

Student loan companies are no better than a loan shark with terms and conditions and borrowing costs.
Perhaps you should seek legal action against the person who put a gun to your head and made you sign for that loan.

I used to cycle fifteen and twenty miles each way in the winter in the mountains, during high school, to scrub airplanes and work on them to get through my flight training, and for years worked two jobs at a time on top of flying. One does what one must. You apparently felt you should sign your soul to the devil, and you can be angry at yourself for taking that option, if you wish. But nobody else.

Rally congress to your aid to have college tuition lowered, while you're at it, and see if you can rake in some support to force flight schools to lower rental costs to make flying more accessible to everyone. You're on a roll.

Out of curiosity, why did you post a request to write congress about young pilots at regional airlines...in the training and instruction forum?

I do not want the government to do anything about the cost of learning to fly.
Ah. Cost's okay. Just not having a gun put to your head and you being forced to pay loan sharks to go fly. Gotcha. You just want congress to do something about the people who were good enough to loan you the money, then? And force everyone to reach that golden pinnacle of professionalism, the ATP...before flying for a regional airline?

Tell me about that "professional background" that one is supposed to have. Freight? Instruction? Ag? Military? Fire? What about that 800 hour military pilot? Not good enough for you, but the kid who's done nothing but bore circles around the pattern with Jimmy Two-Toes The Student for the past 1,500 hours...he's got a professional background?

How about this...set a mandate that everyone have at a minimum both a pilot and mechanic certificate, and have at least 500 hours of dual given. Each must build at least one airplane, and should have experience starting in a Sopwith Camel moving up through ragwing Cessnas through hang gliders and of course, the ubiquitous learjet, before applying for a job raising the landing gear in a Brasillia somewhere? Satisfied? Don't forget to require a doctorate...Lord only knows it's the least educated that cause the wrecks out there, along with those who don't hold an ATP...right??

You're not spamming the board enough. Try harder...

http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=123570

http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=123571

http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=123572

http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=123573

http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=123574

http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=123575

http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=123576


http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=123573


 
Last edited:
From nismo611, on May 3rd...

I suppose I was able to afford an opportunity to attend Embry-Riddle, and yes it was not without problems.

Hold the phone...you're whining about the terrible cost of doing your flight training, and yet you chose to do it at one of the most expensive places in the country? You're not just calling the kettle black, you're stirring the pot after jumping in to take a bath. Your credibility goose has been cooked.

On the same post, you also stated...

As a passenger in a regional airliner, I never thought to myself what a smooth ride. The ride always sucks and my most recent experience when I looked up front there were two older guys flying. I counted 16 stripes in that cockpit what a joke.

Seems you'll say whatever you think best supports your point, however inane it may be.

Regional pilots are too young and too inexperienced, you say...but your most recent experience involved two "older guys" flying the airplane.

You want ATP pilots at a minimum, but found two pilots holding captain qualification in the cockpit of the flight to be a "joke."

Seems that clearly anything further you have to say is a waste of time, isn't it?
 
OK. Here is my draft letter to my senators and congressman. What do you think.
************
Dear [Congressman/Senator][ ]:

I am writing to ask your support in any effort to increase the minimum aviation experience requirements for airline pilots. The usual minimum requirement for new First Officers is a commercial aircraft certificate with instrument and multi-engine ratings (See CFR 121.383). That could mean the pilot would have as little as 250 hours flight experience as that is the minimum for the Commercial Pilot Certificate (see CFR 61.129). Indeed, in the middle of this decade, some operators have used pilots with that level experience.

I would strongly support any measure that increased employment requirements for all airline pilots be increased to those for an Airline Transport Rating. Among other things, this rating requires a minimum of 1500 hours of flight experience (see CFR 61.159).

Requiring pilots to obtain an additional thousand hours of flight experience doing other commercial flying will better prepare them for the demands of airline flying.

I foresee the following effects of such requirements:
.....The pool of qualified candidates will diminish
.....The compensation new pilots expect will be higher.
.....The cost of air travel will rise to a small degree as new pilot pay rises
.....The new pilots will be better prepared for their training at the airline.
.....The flying public will enjoy an added degree of safety reflecting the increased experience floor for all aircrews.

Thank you for your consideration in this matter.

Sincerely,

Looks great to me couldn't have said it better myself.
 
No loan company has ever had its way with me.

I paid for my ratings with the money I earned, as I earned it.

Of course I am only a product of a deficient,inexpensive, inbred little local FBO, not the master-race progeny of some glam-school's disastrous experiment in pilot eugenics.
 

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