Consolidation of Training

Thedude

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Some one refresh my memory, but I am looking under FAR part 121.434 for consolidation of training and I can't seem to find and can't remember if IOE counts toward your 100 hrs in 120 days. Anyone?
 

great cornholio

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I'm guessing that like most things 121 that depends on your ops specs. Anyways I just upgraded so I feel that I'm fresh on this. I just got a letter saying that the 100 hrs for the 120 days DOES include IOE. That is the consolodation of knowledge thing. The 100 hours for a high mins captain DOES NOT include IOE so for me that means I need 100 hours in the J41 for the consolodation of knoweledge time and 121 hours of time in the J41 to be off high mins. (my IOE was 21 hours) please excuse any erros as I'm a few beers into it as its one of my few days off for a while.
 

vclean

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The required 100 hrs in 120 days includes IOE for SIC. IOE does not count towards the 100 in 120 for PICs, since the IOE/Checkairman is PIC during IOE.
 

Flying Illini

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vclean said:
The required 100 hrs in 120 days includes IOE for SIC. IOE does not count towards the 100 in 120 for PICs, since the IOE/Checkairman is PIC during IOE.
Since the Checkairman is the PIC (I'm assuming that the release is in his name?), but the person who upgraded is sitting in the left seat and flying...does he log PIC as well or not? Why isn't the newly upgraded person's name on the release?
 

pilotyip

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100 hr consolidation is not required of PIC's who previously flew as SIC in the same type for 100 hours.
 

great cornholio

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vclean said:
The required 100 hrs in 120 days includes IOE for SIC. IOE does not count towards the 100 in 120 for PICs, since the IOE/Checkairman is PIC during IOE.

This must be an ops specs thing. I have sheet that I have to fill out until I'm off high mins. It says that the 100 hours required in 120 days does include IOE for new capts even though we were SIC during IOE. The only thing is that it has to be 121 flights so ferry flights don't count. The 100 hours to get off of high mins does not count IOE. So you have to have IOE + 100 hours to be off of high mins. Also that 100 hours has to be 121 flights so ferry flights don't count.
 

great cornholio

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Flying Illini said:
Since the Checkairman is the PIC (I'm assuming that the release is in his name?), but the person who upgraded is sitting in the left seat and flying...does he log PIC as well or not? Why isn't the newly upgraded person's name on the release?

Our release has the name of all 3 crew members. So there is a spot that says "Pilot in Command" "First Officer" "Flight Attendnant". During IOE the checkairman's name is in the Pilot in Command spot. The newly upgraded Capt's name is in the First Officer spot. Since the Checkairman is the PIC he has to sign all of the paperwork. The newly upgraded captain sits in the left seat and acts as the captian (IE writes stuff up, fills out the papework, makes the decisions, etc). The newly upgraded captain logs IOE flights as SIC time. Beause they legally can't log the PIC time because the checkairman is the PIC and on IOE you technically aren't a qualified captain becasue you haven't had your fed ride or line check yet. Hope that helps.
 

Thedude

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Ok, second part of the question. For 121 SIC, does a part 91 leg count? I have a 13.1 hr leg coming up and I can't remember if a part 91 leg does count and I don't think it does.
 

CFIse

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Thedude said:
Ok, second part of the question. For 121 SIC, does a part 91 leg count? I have a 13.1 hr leg coming up and I can't remember if a part 91 leg does count and I don't think it does.

You are correct - it does not. I can't recall the reg., but the way to think of it is "line flying" and Part 91 ain't line flying.....
 

pilotyip

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It counts in supplemental flying, becasue in the charter buiness you fly empty on many legs into a revenue trip. The FAA lets us count 91 front end flying towards IOE.
 

Thedude

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pilotyip said:
It counts in supplemental flying, becasue in the charter buiness you fly empty on many legs into a revenue trip. The FAA lets us count 91 front end flying towards IOE.

Really?? I have never heard that. Can you point me to a FAR to back that one up? I have been in the supplementals for years and this is the first time I have ever pushed the 120 day clock this far and I need all the flying I can get.
 
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