Compass agreement

[Linedriver]

Why don't we just get rid of the problem? ALPA is a conflict of interest.

We can represent ourselves more effectively, and do a fine job at it, with what we pay into ALPA National.

Being part of ALPA is like using a doctor that owns the funeral home. He will get paid regardless.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

If you are at DAL you would be giving away millions that your dues gave national.
With 12400 pilots we are ALPA.

 

[Linedriver]

Ok, been DAL for a little over a year and I'm still trying to figure out this huge romance with ALPA.

So we should stay with ALPA because we paid in so much in the past? Respectfully, that doesn't make sense.

I'm guesstimating we pay in roughly 30 million annually. Why don't we just finance our own representation that way we can ONLY worry about ourselves and interests and not have to consider what agreement was made with this regional, that national etc...

I'm not flaming here. I'm more of a do-it-yourself kind of guy and think a given person will work harder for himself than for someone else because he has a vested interest.

Has ALPA gotten us where we want to be? It's just like what we all have been hearing in the news - paying millions to big CEO's to generate losses.

Just my opinion.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

I agree there are issues, but there are bigger issues with a in house union.
Never forger the legal and aero med that come with membership. It is great insurance and most never know it is there until they need it.

 

[PCL_128]

I'm guesstimating we pay in roughly 30 million annually. Why don't we just finance our own representation

It's probably closer to $25 million, actually. In any case, your $25 million pales in comparison to the $120 million that ALPA brings in annually in dues revenue. That sum allows ALPA to hire the best attorneys, actuaries, financial analysts, etc... Your $25 million would leave you restricted to much less. Take APA for an example. Their dues revenue is similar to what yours would be. They have only four in-house attorneys. The rest is outsourced to a firm in DC. ALPA has 60 attorneys in-house, all with their own specialties, and all are available to your pilot group on a moment's notice.

Independent unions simply can't provide the resources that ALPA provides. Even with $25 million in revenue.

 

[NuGuy]

Heyas,

Fins is correct. The EF&A on the APA proposal is worthless. The example used was the position from 97, and the whole airline world has changed since then. Frozen or eliminated DB plans, pay cuts, work rules...the list is endless.

My guess these days if you were to do a real cost analysis, the money you save and the revenue you generate from single carrier ops is darn close to the increased costs.

As for leaving ALPA, I'm really starting to think that's a good idea. UAL has been on the brink for years with this. ALL services that ALPA provides to it's members are also set up for outsourcing, and infact, is a profit center for ALPA.

If DAL left, it would cause a cascade failure of ALPA. You don't lose %20 of your revenue and continue to do business as usual. UAL, CAL and probably FedEx would see the writing on the wall, and depart in short order.

My guess is that a coalition of major airline groups would then form, to pool resources for common services and interests, such as medical, legal, safety and EF&A. SWA, DAL, AMR, UAL, UPS and others would all be involved, and there would probably be wide scale poaching of talent from what would be left of ALPA administration.

What would remain of ALPA would be the representation of the regionals and the services branch. The regional representation, which has not, and cannot ever support itself, and would collapse.

The resulting fiscal crisis from the majors' departure would force a packaging of the technical/legal talent into a services outsourcing firm, and would be spun off to generate revenue to meet the legal obligations of the remaining carriers.

In the end, the spun off technical firm would be providing the same services as the majors receive now, but at probably a greatly reduced cost, and without the fiscal overhead of flight pay loss to ALPA national officers.

As a bonus, you've also freed yourself from any complicated entanglements.

Wow, I think I just talked myself into it...

Nu

 

[PCL_128]

What you describe would be the end of the air line pilot profession. Be careful what you wish for.

 

[PuffDriver]

What you describe would be the end of the air line pilot profession. Be careful what you wish for.

No, it would not.

 

[~~~^~~~]

PCL - you and my ALPA leadership have so convinced me of the benefits of outsourcing that I'd like to try outsourcing ALPA. Call them buffoons if you like, but I'm 110% behind the APA's opener.

 

[flyboyike]

Puff's correct & it mostly is already over.

Sadly, I have to agree.