Comair Stuff

[eaglefly]

You bunch of brazen little pea brained idiots.... how dare you take on the responsibilty of even GUESSING what happened... I wish to god I knew your names.... I swear I would never allow ANY of you on my A/C.

If you can't say anything nice.... Say nothing at all!!!!!!!!!

Karma gentlemen... Karma... trust me.. you will get yours!

Another idiot crawls out.....................

 

[erj-145mech]

You bunch of brazen little pea brained idiots.... how dare you take on the responsibilty of even GUESSING what happened... I wish to god I knew your names.... I swear I would never allow ANY of you on my A/C.

If you can't say anything nice.... Say nothing at all!!!!!!!!!

Karma gentlemen... Karma... trust me.. you will get yours!

Its not guessing, its common knowledge now that the NTSB has released the data.

 

[Cody_V]

Just wanted to express my sorrow for the crew, the passengers, the families and friends of those involved in this unfortunate event. No matter what the results and conclusions of the investigation are I am sorry for the great loss our industry has taken and my thoughts and prayers are with those involved.

 

[DrewBlows]

And according to the NTSB, the crew initially pre-flighted the wrong aircraft on sunday morning, including firing up the APU, before realizing it, and were rushed into getting the right aircraft ready for the morning flight.

Sorry erj, I'm going to pick on you for a minute to illustrate a point that a lot of people seem to confuse.

There is a difference between fact and speculation (or opinion). A prudent writer would distinguish the difference in their writing. Print media is generally much better at distinguishing the difference than television media. Erj has given us a good example of mixing fact with speculation.

And according to the NTSB, the crew initially pre-flighted the wrong aircraft on sunday morning, including firing up the APU, before realizing it,...

This is fact. The NTSB did, in fact, say that the crew preflighted the wrong airplane.

...and were rushed into getting the right aircraft ready for the morning flight.

This is speculation (or opinion, it's not clear). It states what is impossible to know, but doesn't offer it as opinion or speculation, leaving the appearance that it is fact. If you think that the crew may have been rushed, say so, but don't make a factual statement. The fact is that the only ones who know if the crew was rushed is the crew. I'm sure that the CSA agents and/or ramp agents could offer their opinion as to whether the crew was rushed, but barring a statement from the crew such as "we are rushed because we preflighted the wrong airplane", any statement from a CSA or ramp agent would be opinion also.

If you want to speculate or opine on the accident feel free (I wouldn't choose to do that, but that's my opinion), but when you do make it clear that is what you are doing.

 

[ReportCanoa]

Black's Law Dictionary defines negligence as "the failure to use such care as a reasonably prudent and careful person would use under similar circumstances...."

Yep, and define reasonably prudent. It goes on and on. Call it what you wish, but negligence is a word used only in the courtroom. I wrote it was 'designed' by lawyers and what I meant was 'used' by lawyers. A 'reasonably prudent' person still makes errors.

 

[erj-145mech]

The NTSB spokswoman said that the pilots started the auxilliary power unit, that is ver batum, and I distinctly remember her saying that in a news conference. She was asked about DFR data when that was brought up.

 

[Cody_V]

I think it is important to understand the ignorance and stupidity of the media and sometimes even the NTSB in the preliminary stages of a post accident investigation. These journalists pretend to grow a brain and are suddenly experts in aviation and end up printing and saying a lot of stupid, inaccurate, and completley false information just to strecth out a 1000 word article or 5 minute video. It has happened in just about every accident I can remember. The media also loves to immediatley point the finger at pilot error because it is easier to blame the ones at the helm when they can't defend themselves. These chicken-$hit reporters take the easy road out and stir peoples fear and emotions so they can cash a check at the end of the week. One reporter, and I can't remember the exact quote, but basically commented that they are keeping James alive if only to find out what happened. What the hell is that!!! Another questioned why James would steer the airplane onto the wrong runway for takeoff. Last time I was FO on a CRJ I had no tiller on my side!! This is just a small example of inaccurate and misleading facts.

Bottom line, the media is almost always our enemy as pilots. When it hits the fan, right or wrong, if I am ever lying in a hospital bed or worse, I would sure like to know that my fellow collegues and the aviation community has my back until the facts are revealed if at all.

 

[wmuflyguy]

The NTSB spokswoman said that the pilots started the auxilliary power unit, that is ver batum, and I distinctly remember her saying that in a news conference. She was asked about DFR data when that was brought up.

Whats your point? That is a pre-flight duty. Doesn't prove they were rushing.

 

[erj-145mech]

You are not going prove that they weren't rushing until you interview the FO either?

This is the investigation phase of the accident, you aren't going to prove anything at this point. I've been in this business long enough and have seen enough to form an educated opinion.

 

[DrewBlows]

I've been in this business long enough and have seen enough to form an educated opinion.

That's the problem, you state YOUR OPINION as fact. In addition to your inability to distinguish between fact and opinion, I am beginning to think that you may have a reading comprehension problem.

 

[Donsa320]

The only intentional mistake that I can see in this accident was continuing the take off on a runway without runway lights during the hours of darkness. Sunrise was 0703hrs EDT that morning. They rolled about 0610hrs EDT. If they had requested the runway lights be turned on the whole thing would not have happened, I believe, as then the tower probably would have caught the error in time. Lining up on the wrong runway was certainly not intentional and was the only other mistake. Sad.

DC

 

[JetPilot_Mike]

You are not going prove that they weren't rushing until you interview the FO either?

This is the investigation phase of the accident, you aren't going to prove anything at this point. I've been in this business long enough and have seen enough to form an educated opinion.

Who cares what you think. You have never showed up at the airport, at O dark thirty, been let out by a rampie, asked him what plane is going to ATL, have him point to that one and say, "I think that one." We fire up the APU right away, as it's dark, and you need to get the flaps to 20 for the walk around. Then the lead rampie shows up, and says you're in the wrong one. You shut down, and do it all over again. It's happened about 5 times to me in my 7 years. Believe me, after having them make me preflight twice, the last thing I am worried about is being "on time." I doubt they cared either.

I've never been a mechanic, but I bet that's pretty easy...except when you rig up the cables wrong like that 1900.

 

[erj-145mech]

Well Mikey, I don't give a rats a$$ what you think either, but I'm just as entitled to my opinion as you are.

I've never gotten to the airport at oh dark thirty to preflight a jet, I was there all night performing required mx so that you could get there at oh dark thirty to drive it to its next destination. I had the coffee made and waiting on your dumb a$$ to show and leave so that I could go home.

In my thirty two years in aviation maintenance, I have never crossed the control cables, just as you never crashed after taking off on the wrong runway.

 

[ultrarunner]

If you think that the crew may have been rushed, say so, but don't make a factual statement. The fact is that the only ones who know if the crew was rushed is the crew. I'm sure that the CSA agents and/or ramp agents could offer their opinion as to whether the crew was rushed, but barring a statement from the crew such as "we are rushed because we preflighted the wrong airplane", any statement from a CSA or ramp agent would be opinion also.

While I agree with that, if in fact the crew was concerened or attempted an on-time departure it's reasonable to speculate that if the crew had to bring up a second cold airplane after readying a previous one, they were short on time.

Not sure what time they pushed vs. the departure time (someone here I'm sure has that info) but if they pushed on-time after bringing up two cold airplanes, there were cranking like mad. As anyone here knows how long it takes to just wake up one plane, let alone two.

 

[wmuflyguy]

While I agree with that, if in fact the crew was concerened or attempted an on-time departure it's reasonable to speculate that if the crew had to bring up a second cold airplane after readying a previous one, they were short on time.

Not sure what time they pushed vs. the departure time (someone here I'm sure has that info) but if they pushed on-time after bringing up two cold airplanes, there were cranking like mad. As anyone here knows how long it takes to just wake up one plane, let alone two.

It takes longer to carry ones crap (roller-baord, chart case...etc) between the two planes, than it takes to bring the CRJ up and running.