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CO pilots STICK IT TO THE MAN!

ultrarunner

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How can you not respect these guys/girls! God bless 'em!

"A federal judge Monday tossed out a Continental Airlines lawsuit accusing nine pilots of getting sham divorces so their ex-spouses could collect the pilots' retirement benefits while they kept flying." That’s from The Associated Press, which reports that while the judge said he didn't necessarily condone the pilots' actions, the law did not allow him to rule in Continental’s favor.
The Houston Chronicle writes that "in Monday's decision, U.S. District Judge Gray Miller ruled that regardless of the pilots' intentions, employers and pension plan administrators are not arbiters of the legitimacy of divorces." Miller granted the pilots' motion to dismiss the case. Continental officials say the company is considering an appeal.
As for the alleged sham, AP writes Continental "said it paid out between $10 million and $11 million in suspicious pension distributions. Some individual payments were as much as $900,000, according to court papers. The airline said some of the pilots concealed the divorces from children and friends, then remarried their spouses after getting the money."
The Chronicle adds this explanation: “In its lawsuit, Continental alleged that the pilots filed for divorce but continued to live with their spouses, and never mentioned the divorces to their children and friends. The federal law that governs employer-sponsored retirement plans allows pre-retirement payments to former spouses. Once divorced, the pilots' ex-spouses used this provision to collect lump-sum distributions of the pilots' pension plans, worth up to $900,000 per pilot. In its lawsuit, Continental called the divorces 'subterfuges or sham transactions.' "
 

samballs

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So what about the one pilot that said he would pay the company back so he could keep his job.
 

EMBpilot

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I don't see anything here being "stuck to the man".

People broke the law, conspired together, didn't even tell their kids and expected to keep their jobs, seniority, pay and call themselves Airline Pilots, represented by ALPA with it's code of ethics.

They can take that scab mentality and shovel it up their ...

I might not have all the facts, correct me if I am wrong, please.
 

ultrarunner

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First off EMB, I wasn't aware they were charged with a crime. The lawsuit against them was dismissed. Or am I missing something. These guys found a loophole and took advantage of it.

And secondly, I cannot BELIEVE you used the words 'ALPA' and 'code of ethics' in the same sentence!
 

Full of LUV

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Stuck it to his fellow man (pilots).....

I don't see anything here being "stuck to the man".

People broke the law, conspired together, didn't even tell their kids and expected to keep their jobs, seniority, pay and call themselves Airline Pilots, represented by ALPA with it's code of ethics.

They can take that scab mentality and shovel it up their ...

I might not have all the facts, correct me if I am wrong, please.

I don't see CAL doing anything but guarding the sanctity of retirement fund for ALL future retirees..... If everyone did this, it would immediately bankrupt the retirement fund and all the pilots would suffer.

The way I see it, the "stuck to the man" and the man is in the form of their fellow pilots......

Guess it's "OK" because they got theirs........
 

EMBpilot

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And secondly, I cannot BELIEVE you used the words 'ALP' and 'code of ethics' in the same sentence!

See?

It is a problem and actions like that change people's view of the world.

I don't think I could continue working as a pilot or be a Union member after faking a divorce and taking a bunch of money from my employer (no matter how terrible the place is) that does not belong to me in truthful review of the situation.

Am I holier then thou? Was I raised in the 50's and honesty and clear conscience are never coming back?

Is it a crime or is there a problem with our judicial system? The Court simply said - it is not for the company to decide if the divorces were faked.
Well, look at those couples when they got the money. Care to name any who lived separately?

While it'll be hard to fix the judicial system, we have much better chance of fixing the Union. We just need to get INVOLVED more! :)
 

EMBpilot

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I don't see CAL doing anything but guarding the sanctity of retirement fund for ALL future retirees..... If everyone did this, it would immediately bankrupt the retirement fund and all the pilots would suffer.

The way I see it, the "stuck to the man" and the man is in the form of their fellow pilots......

Guess it's "OK" because they got theirs........

Couldn't agree more. Scab mentality poisoned CAL for many years to come. And there is no fix for it.
 

ultrarunner

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I here what you're saying EMB, but sometimes there is a fine line between loopholes and fraud.

I seem to recall this happening over at Delta too before their pensions were raped...not sure there was a big outcry over there as I think that was done more quietly....

Now obviously the CAL folks that did this could have constructed and executed the plan much better....and likely have avoided the public display...but I don't think they were too worried about it.

Are they still all online, or were they all terminated and have lost their jobs?
 

Amish RakeFight

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Guilty

I don't see anything here being "stuck to the man".

People broke the law, conspired together, didn't even tell their kids and expected to keep their jobs, seniority, pay and call themselves Airline Pilots, represented by ALPA with it's code of ethics.

They can take that scab mentality and shovel it up their ...

I might not have all the facts, correct me if I am wrong, please.


If it looks, swims and quacks like a duck...
 

PurpleInMEM

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Sounds like a nice, fat legal loophole that corporations shove down our collective throats all the time. Shame more guys didn't take advantage of it.

Nothing illegal here. Move along.
 

crj567

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So what about the one pilot that said he would pay the company back so he could keep his job.

Well-sir, that pilot will be forever known as "Captain Dumbass."
 

Amish RakeFight

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Sounds like a nice, fat legal loophole that corporations shove down our collective throats all the time. Shame more guys didn't take advantage of it.

Nothing illegal here. Move along.

Wrong. It violates the spirit of the intended condition. They essentially looted in favor of themselves. Why should they be entitled to circumvent the stipulations when others play by the rules. They're no better than corporate criminals who use the same framework to legally cheat for profit.
 

ultrarunner

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You got it Purple. I wonder how many if CO's ALPA brothers and sisters at Delta are wishing they'd jumped on it. I know there were likely a few.

Any idea of the number over there General? Rumor-control says one of your seniority-listed mgt pilots jumped on that train.
 
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ultrarunner

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Wrong. It violates the spirit of the intended condition.


Ahhh...sorta like when management wants to rape your contract..but gee, you're not giving in....soooooo...we'll file BK.....guess what we can do now!

Spirit of intended condition....

got it!

Works both ways Amish....
 

crj567

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Wrong. It violates the spirit of the intended condition. They essentially looted in favor of themselves. Why should they be entitled to circumvent the stipulations when others play by the rules. They're no better than corporate criminals who use the same framework to legally cheat for profit.

"Spirit of the intended condition" is like saying "I didn't mean to knock up my prom date-I will accept no parental responsibilities, and I will pay no child support." Both those concepts go about as far in court as a giant lead balloon...

-Wow-some folks are just dense.
 

Scarabus

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900,000 grand, that's over 16 years of pay for me at current crappy conditions.
 

GuppyWN

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You guys are funny. I'd take the money in a heartbeat! They earned it and by God they deserve to get it before it's taken in the name of solvency.

Gup
 

FlyinGuy

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There is a difference between what is ethical and what is legal. What they did was legal but not ethical. Therefore, they are not criminals.
 
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