Class D part time

[down2mins]

I'm trying to find where it states the criteria for a Class D to go to E or G when the tower is closed. I thought I remember it being something about whether or not there was weather reporting available, but that doesn't match up with the examples I've looked at in an A/FD. The only thing I can find in the AIM is under 3-2-5: "At those airports where the control tower does not operate 24 hours a day, the operating hours of the tower will be listed on the appropriate charts and in the A/FD. During the hours the tower is not in operation, the Class E surface area rules or a combination of Class E rules to 700' agl and Class G rules to the surface will become applicable. Check the A/FD for specifics". The A/FD does not specify the criteria for it to be E vs. G either. I know it's only important to know if it's E or G, but I had this question presented to me. Anyone know?

 

[time builder]

The trend I see is that Class E's have an ILS, where Class G's don't. Just a guess, I could be wrong.

 

[nosehair]

In the AFD, under airspace (item 33 in the sample legend) I see Class D (0400-100Z) other times class G. or whatever. It's in the AFD.

 

[down2mins]

timebuilder - thanks, seems like a decent probablilty
nosehair - i understand how to find if it's E or G. I'm trying to figure out why E vs. G.

My boss has pretty much answered the ? for me though. It deals with an airport having an official weather reporter (not just ASOS or AWOS) - that is when it can go to Class E to the surface.

 

[minitour]

There's part time Class D's with official weather reporters that go to G when the tower closes.

-mini

 

[down2mins]

Ok, so maybe it's not an absolute characteristic, but I suppose the way to look at it is that if they don't have the official observer, they won't go to Class E??????

 

[minitour]

Ok, so maybe it's not an absolute characteristic, but I suppose the way to look at it is that if they don't have the official observer, they won't go to Class E??????

As a Rule of Thumb? Seems logical. It seems in aviation there are ALWAYS exceptions to the rule.

-mini

 

[CFIse]

There's part time Class D's with official weather reporters that go to G when the tower closes.

In order for Class D airspace to revert to Class E airspace to the surface when the tower is closed there must be:
- a certified weather observer
- communication to the surface with the ATC facility having jurisdiction over the area (or "rapid relay" but I have no idea what that means).

If you don't have both then it's Class G at the surface.

 

[minitour]

In order for Class D airspace to revert to Class E airspace to the surface when the tower is closed there must be:
- a certified weather observer
- communication to the surface with the ATC facility having jurisdiction over the area (or "rapid relay" but I have no idea what that means).

If you don't have both then it's Class G at the surface.

What are you referencing? Not saying you're wrong at all, just an observation that I had where I thought (read: assumed) there were official weather observers at several class D's that I know go to Class G when Tower goes "byebye".

Also, just a thought, this is what is "required" to make it Class E, but maybe it can also be class G? Like...you can't have Class E without it but you can have Class G with it? Maybe?

-mini

 

[JustFly]

When the tower goes "bye-bye", does the weather observer go with them? A lot of times the tower is the official weather observer, in order to go class E I think that a weather observer would have to be seperate and stay at the airport. Example, an airport that still has FSS on the field 24/7.

 

[minitour]

When the tower goes "bye-bye", does the weather observer go with them?

ahhhhhhh

Interesting. I'll give 'em a call Monday and find out.

-mini

 

[ksu_aviator]

http://www.faa.gov/atpubs/AIR/air1801.html

Chapter 18. CLASS E AIRSPACE

Section 1. GENERAL

18-1-1. INTRODUCTION
Class E airspace consists of general controlled airspace.

18-1-2. CLASS E SURFACE AREAS
A Class E surface area is designated to provide controlled airspace for terminal operations where a control tower is not in operation. Class E surface areas extend upward from the surface to a designated altitude; or to the adjacent or overlaying controlled airspace.

18-1-3. DESIGNATION
If the communication and weather requirements of paragraphs 17-2-9 and 17-2-10 are met, Class E2 airspace should be designated to accommodate:

a. IFR arrival, departure, holding, and en route operations not protected by other controlled airspace.

b. Instrument approach procedures. Class E2 airspace may be designated to accommodate special instrument procedures if such action is justified and/or in the public interest. The following factors are among those that should be considered:

1. Type of procedure including decision height or minimum descent altitude.

2. The actual use to be made of the procedure, including whether it is used by a certificated air carrier or an air taxi/commuter operator providing service to the general public.

NOTE-
For special instrument procedures, consideration should be given to availability to other users.
3. The operational and economic advantage offered by the procedure, including the importance and interest to the commerce and welfare of the community derived by the procedure.

4. Any other factors considered appropriate.


17-2-9. COMMUNICATIONS
Communications capability must exist with aircraft, that normally operate within the Class D Surface Area down to the runway surface of the primary airport (the airport upon which the surface area is designated). This communication may be either direct from the ATC facility having jurisdiction over the area or by rapid relay through other communications facilities which are acceptable to the ATC facility having that jurisdiction.


17-2-10. WEATHER OBSERVATIONS AND REPORTING
a. Weather observations shall be taken at the primary airport during the times and dates the Class D airspace is active. A federally certified weather observer or a federally commissioned automated weather observing system (this includes all weather reporting systems) can take the weather observation. The weather observer shall take routine (hourly) and special observations. An automated weather observing system can provide continuous weather observations.

b. Scheduled record and special observations from weather observers or automated weather reporting systems shall be made available to the ATC facility(s) having control jurisdiction over the Class D designated surface area. This can be accomplished through Automated Flight Service Station/Flight Service Station (AFSS/FSS), Longline Dissemination, National Weather Service (NWS), or other FAA-approved sources. Facilities that require weather reports from satellite airports may enter into a letter of agreement (LOA) with the associated AFSS/FSS, airline/contract observer, airport management, etc.

NOTE-
[1] At ATC sites where non-Federal employees perform weather duties, the appropriate FAA office shall ensure that the reporting and dissemination requirements applicable to National Weather Service and FAA publication standards are followed
[2] In facilities where direct access to automated weather observing systems is not available, controllers will apply the provisions of FAA Order 7110.65, Air Traffic Control.
_________________________________________________________

To sum up, the airport is designated as Class E when the Class D is closed if, in the infinite wisdom of the FAA, the airport and the community surrounding would benefit from having controlled airspace to the surface. The weather observations and communication conditions must be met for that extension to be made.

 

[down2mins]

Thanks KSU!!