Citation II SIC requirments

[Meiguy]

A guy I fly with corporately is upgrading from a King-Air to a Citation II. I had been flying with him in the King Air just to build up my multi time and gain some experience. But now that they are getting a citation they are going to use 2 pilots and considering hiring me as full-time f/o. I have about 700 TT and around 120 mulit most of which is turboprop or jet. I would go to Simcom for sic on the citation but still don't think the insurance will accept me since my times are so low and have already been screwed over many a times by the insurance companies. My question is how much pull does going to simcom or flightsafety have and do any of you flying citation use low time sic's or start out this way in Part 91 operations. And is there anything else I could do to help sway the insurance besides buiding time and what I've mentioned above. Also would having a current sic checkout in a citation II for 135 operation help out. Any info would be appreciated.

 

[starvingcfi]

...just curious. where are you out of?

 

[2000flyer]

Total time and turbine/jet time are what matters. Having gone through Simcom, FSI or SimuFlite will help the insurance situation. The company may have to pay higher premiums, depends on their carrier. Our company's insurance requires a "factory approved" school for any SIC to be insured.

Insurance companies seem to have felt the crunch since 9/11. Many have really tightend their belts on insuring crews. If the guy/company you're flying for wants to hire you, then let them negociate with their carrier.

I don't think having a 135 check would help you at all. However, thats just my opinion. Again, it all depends on what their carrier wants.

Best of luck!

2000Flyer

 

[falconpileit]

ur fine

You should be fine. They want to see you've got all your certificates, had some real world time, and you've got a school under your belt. That being said, if your liability limits are over 10-20 Million.......they'll also want your left testicle.

 

[pa56pa]

My initial jet experience started early like you... and prior to 9/11, the insurance company my ex-employer dealt with had minimums of 500 hrs for the Citation 2. I got on as SIC when i had about 750 hrs. So, it has happened. I'm just not familiar with the latest insurance requirements since 9/11...

I wouldn't personally worry about the insurance company. Let your employer worry about that.

 

[MMO 0.705]

MEI GUY,
I fly the 500 series citations and do not have a problem with insurance. Im at a little more than 700 hours total time but I am type rated. That has helped out alot with insurance comapnies. Maybe they'll type you if you give the committment? You shouldn't have a problem though with insurance with factory school. Hope everything goes well.

 

[hopeful]

how did you get at ce550 type without ATP minimums?

 

[Meiguy]

Thanks for all the info. I guess I'll just have to wait and see how everything pans out. Hopefully I won't have to chalk another job lossed over an insurance requirment.

 

[JetPilot500]

how did you get at ce550 type without ATP minimums?

It's obiously not an ATP Type Rating. You can get a Type Rating on a Commercial or even a Private Certificate.

However, when you become an ATP, your type ratings will not transfer over. You will have a "Commercial Privileges" statement on your certificate for the type rating unless you take the ATP checkride in the type rated aircraft.

Except for insurance purposes, the Type Rating on a Commercial Certificate is pretty much useless.

JetPilot500

 

[Rick1128]

Normally the difference in cost between a F/O initial and a PIC initial is very minimal if any. Last time I checked at Simuflite the difference was $100.00 for the Learjet program and no difference at all for the HS125 program. And it would help with the insurance.

It is my understanding that the transfer of type rating to a pilot's ATP has changed. The PTS for type rating is the ATP PTS and that type rating taken while holding a Commercial Certificate will transfer to the ATP.

A Commercial type is not worthless. An ATP is only required for pilots flying PIC under Part 121 or Part 135 Commuter, or Part 135 passenger carrying jets. A cargo jet PIC only requires a Commercial certificate. It would also allow the pilot to log PIC time to enable him/her to qualify for their ATP.