check ride

[chillflylow]

Was this wrong?? Iam a F/O on a C-550 and this happend to me and I wondering if this sort of thing has happend to any of yall ..If so how did you handle it.We landed and we were on our way to the hotel the capt. and myself when he told me I got a check ride with the FAA monday..I said for what?? he said for busting a altitude a while back, when flying with the F/O that Quit..I said good luck. well the weekend past and we talked a number of times but the ride was not brought up untill sunday at 9pm when he said we have to fly that check ride in the morning at 8am.. I said WE?? he said yes WE.. I siad why do I have to fly your check ride?? its about the crew and auto pilot... I said If you wanted me to fly you should have told me sooner than now..I am not flying the ride in the morning.. How long have you know about this?? about 8 mo.he said.. And you just now told me ?? I didnt think you needed to know.. then we argued a while about it and i call the ops man.. You see the capt I was with is the ``chief pilot`` .. i asked what took so long to get this done and he him hawed around and the ops guy finally told me that he found out his ticket had been pulled for departing a controlled airport with out talking to any one in the Mu2.. and the Faa tried to schedule the ride about 4 mo. ago but the said they would have to reschedule be cause he could not take a ride with his ticket suspended .. i didnt know about that and niether did the ops man..fyi That is the second time his ticket had been pulled in 5 years ..so i told him I was not going to get involved in his mess and this was unprofessional to say the least..Well he called me later and said if I would relocate the plane the FAA had someone to fly with him..I said ok as long as i didnt have to fly or see the FAA to keep me out of this.. He said ok
Upon getting to the other airport the next morning i went to hide in the pilot lounge.. When the FAA showed up the inspector said Where is your co-pilot?? In the pilot lounge was the reply from the capt.. My blood started to boil.. LIED to DECIEVED to the end.. Now this dud, that had to do this ride had got me involved after telling me he would not...The inspector walked in and said are you the co pilot ?? I then explained just what i felt about the whole thing and how I didnt think that I should have to do this ride and I didnt even find out about till late last night..He gave me the feeling that i could do this now or later so i said lets go.. get this over with.. I was so mad .. well the ride was passed and the capt. went back to being the same as before making me work real hard to keep us from getting violated.. I now understand all the rumors Ive heard about him and can prove most of them>> Any one with any thoughts on this?? good or bad.. never seen or heard anything like this before not very professional I thought but Iam just a F/O so ive been told>>

 

[CFIcare]

Wow. That sounds to me like a good old fashioned case of the FO having to eat the $hit sandwiches the captain serves and smile while they eat 'em. Unfortunately a lot of bosses treat their crews like this (and worse) because they figure that you ought to be worshipping them at the least for the honor of even sitting in that right seat. It's true that even knowing this guys rep if you quit there would be 100 people lined up (remember Animal House? and the paddling scene? "THANK YOU SIR MAY I HAVE ANOTHER?")

I say this because I myself am a bit bitter at being screwed over recently by a similar cad. I got a great gig riding FO in a Lear and I was told the job would be a steady thing. Enough so that I should go ahead and cash out of my job CFIing at the FBO. So after a few weeks of "steady" trips I did just that. Nevermind tha fact that the captain/dir ops/chief pilot has a nasty style in the cockpit that involves no checklists, barking rapid fire orders, and flat out yelling and cussing. ( I have about 20 hours in the Lear ok? I'm no expert and he knows it). Anyway. Lo and behold the owner of this part 91 airplane decided to sell it and I find out after it's already GONE. I was waiting "on call" for a week with no trips and finally I got antsy and called to find out what's going on. Oh yeah, the plane got sold. Sorry tough beans. Too bad my old CFI job was gone because they hired someone else in my place.

Back to your dilemma. I think putting you in the middle was wrong, but I doubt it will be the first time you will be expected to "bend over" for the boss. What happened with that last FO that quit? YOu have yo ask yourself if the C550 hours are worth the abuse to you personally, and if any of his shenanigans might endanger your own certificate one day by proxy. If so, run. It might be really really hard given these times, but it might be for the best. I think that my situation happened for the best because this guy was shady indeed. It better have happened for a good reason because losing that gig plus my CFI job just about ripped my heart out. I still haven't found another job and here it's two months later. I'm freelance instructing but it ain't paying the bills.

If you think you can put up with his crap, sit in the right seat until you get the magic 500 hrs, be looking for another gig and then bolt. Be careful how you leave if you do because he might spread some nasty stuff about you too. Sounds like he's already a frequent flier on FAA airlines. Good luck with everything...

 

[Gulfstream 200]

dude relax.

I have "sat in" on checkrides before (long and short notice)...the feds aren't really watching you, and they will usually let you know this. You are filling a seat.

Just sit there and do your job, what were you afraid of? You just do your PNF duties and thats it. If he busts, he busts. You wont. You fly with this guy all the time? and now that the FAA is there you won't fly with him? does not sound good on your part....

NOW, if you dont feel safe flying with this guy, why are you there in the first place??

I think you should have put a positive spin on, maybe turned the ride in to a PIC check/type ride for yourself at the same time (?).....(then job shop!!!)

It sounds like a $hit job, but get the most out of it and leave, ya know?? fighting it like you are is just going to make it worse. You say this guy is a walking violation, and the fact he got his ticket pulled for something so stupid makes me think I might not be flying with him, not as an F/O....

remember, these days, if there are TWO of you in the cockpit, TWO of you get violations --- dont matter who was flying....

 

[chillflylow]

Well I dont mind taking check rides with the FAA thats not the problem I was having.. The problem was that 44-709 recert check ride that he hid from me and the co. for 8 mo . The last F/O quit because of the violation. It seems that the captian had filed the flight in the non type rated F/Os name then tried to hang him with it .. He even hid the fact from the co that he had to fly the plane for the re cert check ride from a violation and the fact he lost his ticket before that.. With out permission from the OWNER I was afraid I could at the least loose my job for flying the plane with out permission.Even though its daily pay 3 to 4 days a week is not bad.. This was not a 6 mo 135 ride or type ride .. Iam a contract pilot not even full time with the company, even though I fly about 10 hr a week with them.. I have tried to put a (what i could have done to make it better spin on it )but cant think of it..Slacker you have sat in on these rides like this before?? Not to sound to whiney I was just wondering if this is normal in small corperate flight departments.. The inspector did tell me that I was not taking the ride .. in the same breath he said the ride was on CREW coordination (which I thought had already been blown) and his ability to operate the auto pilot.. The word CREW led me to believe that I was under the gun by proxy.. being part of the crew that is.. Iam new to the corperate world and this kind of attitude..

 

[trainerjet]

This is certainly easy for me to say. And certainly more easily said than done, especially with the economic and job climates of today, BUT.....

This guy is BAD NEWS. It's only a matter of time before he goes down permanently. He's seems to have skated a couple of times, but it will catch up with him sooner or later. DO NOT allow him to take you with him when his ticket gets pulled for good. Do not walk, but RUN, as fast and as far as you can, away from this loser. Protect yourself, before it is too late.

 

[hellas]

This is not a big deal the FAA was not looking at you and you should have been told that. But why are you so upset and WHY are you still working there? If you really though your career was in jeopardy take your boss out back and let him trip once or twice. For goodness sakes dont bend over for a citation job..

 

[Gulfstream 200]

yeah, sad to say this stuff is normal in the lowest end of the charter world...I think every one of my 135 checks were done on the very last day of my "grace" month, checkrides combined with trips, flew broken planes..etc....same old story...It will never change. And some of the "lifers" you fly with....well....you know.

However, I NEVER did anything I was not comfortable with as far as Safety or License violations. If (err..when) I broke rules I at least knew exactly what I was breaking...not that this is OK, but Im sure you know what I mean.
Dont mess around with these characters these days. Like I said, rememeber..you will BOTH get violated if HE busts regs and meets an inspector who is having a bad day...He may not care, but that type of violation will assure you STAY at this level of job forever!

You are contract with these guys?, if you had other work I would certainly be there!

The FAA checkride thing is no big deal....I would just watch this loser when it comes down to short runways in winter weather, foggy/low approaches, Tstorm avoidance, etc.....you know, the type of things that can really hurt you!!

Good luck moving on to better!!, it will happen