Cheap Pilot Wants To Fly More, Help!

[Joseph II]

The problem: I want to fly for fun and build flight time. I cannot find a job as a CFI because the local flight schools are churning out CFI's and there are too many "in-house" instructors for an outsider to get a foot in the door. I will do this part time because I have a full time job and I have no huge desire to advance rapidly up the aviation career ladder.

***I want to fly as cheaply as possible!***

My solution: Buy an airplane. Charge to flight instruct and rent to friends (considering a lease back?). Put all proceeds back into the airplane. Making a profit is not necessary but I don't want to be loosing money either.

Has anyone done this? Has it worked our did you get burned? I would prefer a C152 for the cost savings, but in Colorado in the summer a C152 is not a good option.

What about buying an airplane and putting it on the line as a lease back?

Thanks!

 

[de727ups]

It's called freelancing...

I think a free lance CFI with his own plane can do well under the right circumstances. You have to live in a place where you can market yourself, find students, and not get kicked off the airport for working out of the back of your car.

You might be able to find a 152 with a sparrowhawk conversion (125 hp) or a 150 with a 150 hp conversion. Find a liberal arts college that will let you teach ground school as a community education type course.

Traditional leasebacks aren't the best because you have to share the profit with the flight school. You'll probably have to pay the schools shop rate for maintanence. You'll have to be on the schools payroll to instruct in the plane for insurance reasons....on their payroll means you get $15/hr while they charge $35. With freelance you keep the full $35. If you can find a buddy who is an A and P to work on the plane you might be able to trade him flying time for wrenching time...a great deal if you can find the right guy.

 

[banned username 2]

a "Cheap Pilot"???

I never knew there was such a thing!

 

[JimNtexas]

What is the legal situtation with respect to the FAA and a flight instructor with his own plane?

I understand the huge tort liablity and problems with airport management, but what hoops would the CFI have to jump through with the FAA to rent and instruct in his own plane?

 

[skyking1976]

Hmmmm...

Sounds like a question for our friends at AOPA.

Skyking

 

[de727ups]

Part 61

Instructing in your own plane under part 61 involves no special FAA oversight. You could get ramp checked just like anyone else, that's it.

The insurance companies hit you much harder. I'm afraid to find out what it's gonna cost me to commercially insure the 152 aerobat I'm getting, but wouldn't be surprized to see it at 5K a year for full coverage. If the plane is paid for you could get by with liability only for a lot less....it's the commercial hull coverage that's high. I'd feel pretty good about liability only if I was the only instructor and did IFR training but soloing a 10 hour pilot without hull coverage crosses my line.

The local airport managements and other flight schools can be the biggest problem. Some flight schools feel the need to protect their territory and will see you as a threat.....which you are, in a way. If they were smart they would encourage you to buy gas and maintenance from them and ask you to send your students to them when they are ready for a bigger plane. Most aren't smart and will do what they can to make life hard for you. Airport managements are much the same way...see you as a threat to airport peace and harmony. I've been kicked out of two large airports in the past, both BFI and RNT. Basically, I wasn't welcome to operate in the manner I wanted to, even though I was in compliance with FAR's and airport regs.

People will say you can't do good training part 61 out of the back of a van. On the contrary....I was a high time airline pilot doing it for fun with the best IFR equipped 172 on the airport. It's all about quality of instruction and quality of equipment....not what kind of office you have or if you operate under 141.

 

[Joseph II]

Thanks de727ups and everyone else.

Part 61 requires no special deal with the FAA. You are good to go once you get your CFI-A.

I really had no idea that the teritory around the airport can be so heavily guarded. I guess at one airport by me there are two schools with 30+ airplanes and the other airport has 4+ small FBO's. Two airports charge $75+ $40 dual for a Warrior while the other airports charge $65+$30 for a C172.

Not that I want to low-ball anyone, but I believe paying $115/hour for training is a bit high. If there is a way to make flying more affoardable for myself and others in the area, I would like to do it.

Speaking of flying small airplanes... Those of you who are working on a flying career, or those of you who fly for fun.. How many flight hours do you average a year?

My grand total was 14 last year. Man, that is pitiful.

 

[XLR8]

When I did a little instructing I found people with their own airplanes and taught them in those. Sometimes it was hard to come by but generally you can get paid more than you would at a flight school and they can pay less than they would pay at a flight school.

IE. Flight school charges $30/hour - You get $10/hour. You Charge $20 - They pay less than the flight school, you get more than you would working for the flight school.

Of course, usually people that own their own airplane are usually working on a higher rating (ie, instrument, commericial, etc.) which I always liked because they actually knew how to fly.

Anyway, good luck! Fly Safe and don't let it go to far!

 

[WrightAvia]

yea...we gotta ask the fsdo guys about

this one. I mean a guy owning a plane and instructing in it...that's got to be holding out to the public for transportation or something like a 135 operation. Not good. And if that instructor was to RENT that plane out to one of his illegal charter students that would be like a 121 operation. We better turn that guy in.

 

[ShawnC]

141 isn't a big deal until you hit commercial IMO that's only because it has the 250 hr requirement waived.

Even still you have to submit for 55 hrs of flight time, which is alot at those larger flying schools.