Challenger 300

[smails]

I am looking for some information on the 300 from some people who are actually flying it. Performance, maintenance issues, and just general feeling about the aircraft. Any input would be appreciated.
Thanks

 

[Godfather]

Our company leased a 300 for a year (07-08)while we waited for the G450 to be built and delivered. Good plane with better than book performance. Good fit for our missions in North America with adequate room in the cabin.

2 drawbacks were Bombardier's wonderful (lack thereof) customer support and the flight deck is smaller than the 600 series Challengers. Other than that, I liked it and would not hesitate to fly it again.

 

[GCAP]

I've been flying the 300 for 5 years. Fantastic plane. Great runway performance. Very reliable, depending on who does your maintenance ( we have our own "crew chief" )
Altitude capability actually does put you above most weather. Depending on your BOW, it is NOT a 3000nm plane!!!
Again.....fantastic plane

 

[smails]

Thanks. We have a 450 and a couple Falcon 900s, and getting the 300 for the shorter trips. My main concern is the reliability "issues" that the other models have, but I hear that the 300 doesn't seem to be as bad?? Nice to hear that they do better than book numbers, unlike some other aircraft!

 

[jonjuan]

Thanks. We have a 450 and a couple Falcon 900s, and getting the 300 for the shorter trips. My main concern is the reliability "issues" that the other models have, but I hear that the 300 doesn't seem to be as bad?? Nice to hear that they do better than book numbers, unlike some other aircraft!

The 604 is extremely reliable, btw.

 

[StarHustler]

I fly the 300 and Love it. It is by far the most reliable Jet I have flown yet. Performance is great and economics are even better. Our company liked it so much, they bought a second one a year later. The only negatives are a 'cheap interior' and as previously mentioned, Bombardier 'customer support'.

 

[Iflewjetz]

Great aircraft. I have been flying them about 5 years. We are taking ours to Europe next week. The rudder sucks on it. Ailerons are small. Crosswinds suck. But it climbs like a beeotch. Performance is great. We take it out of a 4200 foot strip along with two other 300 operators. Our reliablility has been pretty good. I know another operator that got a lemon, so your mileage may vary.

 

[Webslinger]

Great aircraft. Desinged for "ease" of maintenance and no TBO. Flys great, handles weather well but is a little slippery in a X-wind. Ailerons are not big enough for the job. Interiors are upgraded with SN > than 153 I believe. Bombardier is up to
SN 20330 or (330). This is finally a Corporate aircraft that "works great, lasts a long time". Collins Proline 21 5000 avionics. Easy to land, easy to fly..awesome performer for the money and takeoff and landing numbers rival DA-50 numbers! hope that helps.

 

[smails]

Thanks, I appreciate the input.

 

[GSXR600]

Best airplane I've ever flown.....and it can do 3000NM if u plan it well. I did CYUL to EGKB following 60mnt ETP's calculation due to restrictions on country registration, included the arrival 2950ish NM at FL450 4 pax and 300lbs of bags, pulled back to LR.77 as per the book and landed with 2650lbs OB. Great machine

 

[t-bone]

Very comfortable airplane to fly, and performance #s into shorter runways are great. Longest leg I've flown was VNY-TNCM and we landed with 2500#s after taking off with 13.5, average tailwind was only around 40 knots on that trip...3157 miles.

 

[ultrarunner]

Could a CL-300 driver PM me. Looking for some APG perf numbers.

Thanks,

Ultra

 

[Bleeds On]

I hear a lot of dissatisfaction with Bombardier support, but what exactly is the issue? Slow response, no parts availability, poor knowledge of systems?

 

[LJ45]

I hear a lot of dissatisfaction with Bombardier support, but what exactly is the issue? Slow response, no parts availability, poor knowledge of systems?

Red tape, no one can make a call on the spot...most of the time...sort of like the US gov...it's bogged down. It not just one single thing, it just Bombardier...oh and a touch of French thrown in.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

Buy a Gulfstream. They never break.

 

[stupidpilot]

buy a gulfstream. They never break.

riiiiiiiiiggggghhhhhhhttttt........

 

[LJ45]

Buy a Gulfstream. They never break.

Well...Bombardier does build a good airplane...except early Learjet 45s and the early Globals, but the CL300 was right from the start. It just goes down hill after the sale, unless you really work at it. You can make it work, you just have to work "the system"

 

[can99]

And dont accidentally send a part back to the wrong warehouse as they will charge you $1500+ per box as a fine for make a mistake!

 

[JJET44]

And dont accidentally send a part back to the wrong warehouse as they will charge you $1500+ per box as a fine for make a mistake!

I'd tell them to come and get their airplane because your gonna buy a Falcon although APro isn't much better.

 

[G100driver]

Buy a Gulfstream. They never break.

I knew that we could count on you to be constructive .....

CL-300 appears to be a great airplane (never flown one). Everyone that I know who flies it, loves it.

I would caution on using it as an overwater aircraft .... it is a little light on navigation and pressurization.

Only GPS and a single source of pressurization.

 

[Bleeds On]

... a single source of pressurization.

I asked Bombardier about that and they said that should you lose your pack you'll be running on "trim" air which limits you to FL350 or so. Isn't that where the G200 slogs around on a daily basis? The only thing you really lose is ability to maintain an exact cabin temp.
I wonder if they offer a retrofit of more capable nav equipment.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

I knew that we could count on you to be constructive .....

CL-300 appears to be a great airplane (never flown one). Everyone that I know who flies it, loves it.

I would caution on using it as an overwater aircraft .... it is a little light on navigation and pressurization.

Only GPS and a single source of pressurization.

probably not much different than taking a Hawker overseas?

:crying:

 

[ttflyer]

I asked Bombardier about that and they said that should you lose your pack you'll be running on "trim" air which limits you to FL350 or so. Isn't that where the G200 slogs around on a daily basis? The only thing you really lose is ability to maintain an exact cabin temp.
I wonder if they offer a retrofit of more capable nav equipment.

I always thought the "single source" issue was a bit overblown. When we went across, we planned a 10,000' depressurization scenario and we weren't even close on fuel issues. And that's assuming you're not happy on the trim-air system which should be fine...

As far as long range nav - no there is no INS option. But again, 20 years ago nobody had even a fraction of the nav capability of dual GPS and they did just fine with ancient, inaccurate INSs. Would I like to have INS? Sure, but I don't think the world would spin out of control if I lost both GPSs in the middle of the Atlantic. Inconvenient, but not a reason to lose the airplane...

Is the Challenger 300 the best choice if your mission is extended over-water ops? Probably not. But it is more than capable of the trip. They do it every day. And so do a bunch of other guys in LearJets and Hawkers...

 

[G100driver]

Given the choice of 2 GPS's or 2 INS's when flying over water, I will take the 2 INS's. Once we get back over dry land, I will take the GPS.

Also, what is wrong with taking a Hawker over the pond ... I hear that some of them now two sources of bleed and dual nav sources ....