Ce-525 Pic / Sp

[PSL]

Two questions:

1) Is there any requirement that the PIC of a CE-525 occupy the left seat ?

2) Is there such a thing as a CE-525 Single Pilot Type rating ?

Thanks

 

[English]

Yes and Yes

 

[English]

I guess I should expand on that...

From the limitations section of the operating manual...

Minimum crew
Except where otherwise prescribed by applicable operating limitations,
Minimum crew for all operations:
1. Pilot, provided:
a. The pilot holds a CE525(s), single pilot, type rating.
b. The airplane is equipped for single pilot operations as specified in the KOEL (operable autopilot, headset with mic must be worn, checklist on board, 4-bug reference ring on pilot's airspeed indicator, and provisions available for storage and retention of nav charts accessible to the pilot)
c. The pilot must occupy the left pilot's seat.

OR
1. Pilot and 1 copilot, provided
a. The PIC holds a CE525 (s) or CE525 (second in command required) type rating.

 

[PSL]

Thanks English ...

Here's the specific example ....

A pilot (ASEL-IA) owner of his new CE-525 wants to fly the aircraft from the left seat. He plans to go to school for the type rating in the near future ...

With him, is a CE-525s PIC that has a CFI-AMEL ticket.

Can the owner legally fly the A/C from the left seat, given this crew pairing ? The way I read your response; the answer is No.

I was asked some years ago to teach an owner of a LR-JET who had no ME rating from scratch in his aircraft. I politely declined, based on many reasons; but principally the LR-JET is type certified for two pilots with no SP provision like certain models of the CE-500 series.

Obviously this owner can not serve as SIC because he doesn't have a ME rating.

Any thoughts ?

 

[501261]

NO, because the owner/pilot does not have a MEL. Without a Multi he can't legally be used as an SIC, without an SIC the PIC can't sit on the right side.

 

[English]

Ooh, that's a good one.

My initial response is to agree with you, that he cannot serve as SIC because he does not have a multiengine rating. If the owner had a multiengine rating, then the single pilot type-rated pilot could definitely utilize the crew provisions of his type (CE525s) to act as PIC from the right seat, or could utilize his CFI-AMEL to instruct from the right seat. But in the situation you give, I can't see a way to do it.

Maybe someone else could chime in.

 

[English]

Sorry 501261, we must have posted our replies at the same time!

 

[throttlejockey]

Provided the following:

1) the owner/pilot is receiving flight training for the purpose of receiving a new class and type rating,

2) The instructor is current and qualified in type,

3) the aircraft is configured with fully operable dual controls,

There is absolutely no reason why he cannot sit in the left seat of the aircraft and fly the plane.

Just think of the Citation as a large multi-engine training aircraft.

Its in the regs

 

[English]

throttlejockey,

We aren't talking about the Citation, we are discussing the Citationjet. It's an important distinction because the scenario given places a pilot with the CE525s type in the right seat. There is a limitation in the operating manual for the CE525 that limits the pilot's ability to operate this aircraft single pilot in any seat other than the left seat. This aircraft was certified single pilot. If operated single pilot the aircraft MUST be operated with the typed pilot in the left seat. Since the student is not appropriately rated in multi engine aircraft, doesn't that mean this is a single pilot operation? I think the most restrictive regulation applies. Since the operating limitation is more restrictive than the FARs, I would go that way.

 

[throttlejockey]

Guys:

If the requirements of the single pilot authorization cannot be met with the qualified pilot in the right seat, then the aircraft reverts to an aircraft type which requires a second flight crewmember. (The CE-525 is a two-pilot aircraft with a Single-Pilot Exemption).

In this scenario, FAR 61.55 applies:

FAR 61.55(d)(3) states that you can designate someone who does not meet the requirements of 61.55(a)(b) or (c) as the second in command of an aircraft as long as it is for the purpose of receiving flight training, and no passengers or cargo are carried on the aircraft.

Additionally, FAR 61.33 has various exemptions for the purposes of receiving flight training in aircraft requiring a type-rating.

As stated above FAR 61.55 requires that no passengers or cargo are onboard during the training. This holds true for FAR 61.33 as well.

Thus, only the owner/pilot and the CE-525 type rated, current and qualified instructor could be the only persons onboard. This will limit you to personal trips w/o passengers until he gets the type. (Which, BTW can be done in the aircraft as well.)

throttle