Can a safety pilot log X-CTY time?

[mklyce]

I am spliting time with another pilot at the airport I fly at and we can't figure out if we both can log PIC and X-cty or just the pilot under the hood can log the x-cty? Any help would be much appreciated.

Thanks!

MK

 

[nosehair]

I think it's a legal toss-up.

I would not log it if it is for a certificate or rating, but otherwise, I would.

 

[ackattacker]

I think it's a legal toss-up.

I would not log it if it is for a certificate or rating, but otherwise, I would.

My thinking is the opposite... the only reason to log this sort of time is for a certificate or rating. Nobody else really cares about x-c time. And safety-pilot time looks pretty bad at an interview.

I don't see any reason why it would not be legal to log it as x-c though. I log x-c time when I'm an SIC, so why not any other legally required crewmember.

 

[nosehair]

I don't see any reason why it would not be legal to log it as x-c though.

Just the wording of the definition of x/c under 61.1 which defines the aeronautical experience requirements: "X/C time includes a landing at a point more than 50 nm..."

If you, as the safety pilot, make a landing at the destination, then it fits the legal requirement of 61.1.

 

[Amish RakeFight]

Cross country as per ATP certification only requires a flight beyond 50 NM. A landing is not required.

Go ahead and log x-ctry time as SIC. Just dont log the landing.

 

[Amish RakeFight]

Both can log PIC. The safety pilot needs to be the designated PIC (ACTING), while the person under the hood can LOG PIC as sole manipulator.

 

[ackattacker]

Just the wording of the definition of x/c under 61.1 which defines the aeronautical experience requirements: "X/C time includes a landing at a point more than 50 nm..."

If you, as the safety pilot, make a landing at the destination, then it fits the legal requirement of 61.1.

Ah, you're right, that is a bit nebulous. One might argue it either way.

To be safe I suppose you could *both* make a landing at the destination. Then both log it x-c.

 

[nosehair]

Cross country as per ATP certification only requires a flight beyond 50 NM. A landing is not required.

Go ahead and log x-ctry time as SIC. Just dont log the landing.

Ah! This is true. When I said "for a certificate or rating", I meant Pvt,Com, Inst.

I would log the time for other than that which would include the 500 x/c pic for 135 and for the ATP.

IMOH, those 500 hours can be gained in many a wide variety of ways - that's doing 500 hours in many ways which broadens your experience.

However, I think the 50 hrs x/c for com/inst, should be on your own.

Now, if you are actually, really 'running the flight', doin' the nav, and overseeing all things and the guy under the hood is just flying basic instruments - then it is loggable x/c. That's how I think we are supposed to log - what you actually do.

 

[midlifeflyer]

Just the wording of the definition of x/c under 61.1 which defines the aeronautical experience requirements: "X/C time includes a landing at a point more than 50 nm..."

But that's not the wording. The wording is, "time acquired during a flight...That includes a point of landing that was at least..."

There's nothing in the reg other than that the =flight= needs to meet the requirements and that the person logging it has to have some otherwise loggable time.

But you were right in your earlier observation that it's a toss-up. I thought the reasoning was suspect, but the old, officially disowned, Part 61 FAQ took the view that it didn't count and there is an FAA Regional Legal opinion floating around that essentially punted the question back to flight standards.

All other things being equal, my purely personal view is that until the question is answered, to be on the safe side, I'd try to fulfill the certificate requirements with "sole manipulator" cross country time.

 

[nosehair]

But that's not the wording. The wording is, "time acquired during a flight...That includes a point of landing that was at least..."

?? your wording is closer to the actual print - ? but still has the same meaning, ie. "includes a point of landing..."

There's nothing in the reg other than that the =flight= needs to meet the requirements and that the person logging it has to have some otherwise loggable time.

The 'flight', under 61.1(b)(3)(ii) includes (A) "appropriate" aircraft. (towards the certificate or rating) (B) Landing more than 50... (C) means of nav...

So, that (B) is what you're wiggling around when you use it for a cert or rating...