CAL/Colgan

[hou757]

Will CAL make any changes to their Colgan contract with all the problems being discussed at the NTSB reports? Curious what others think.

 

[planejockey]

Larry thinks Colgan provides Cannnissstant poor performance therefore rewards the sh***ty. CAL is headed towards a slow death due to LK.

 

[jonjuan]

Will CAL make any changes to their Colgan contract with all the problems being discussed at the NTSB reports? Curious what others think.

Are you kidding? If they make changes, i.e. give the regional flying back to Expressjet, then it's admitting that he made a fatal mistake. Too late for that. He must vigorously defend his decision or else the victims attornies will have a field day.

BTW, seems strange Colgan would put this on their website. Does ALPA know about this? It appears Colgan is trying to distance themselves from the pilots.

http://www.colganair.com/flight_3407_releases/faq_2009-05-13.pdf

 

[Paul R. Smith]

Are you kidding? If they make changes, i.e. give the regional flying back to Expressjet, then it's admitting that he made a fatal mistake. Too late for that. He must vigorously defend his decision or else the victims attornies will have a field day.

BTW, seems strange Colgan would put this on their website. Does ALPA know about this? It appears Colgan is trying to distance themselves from the pilots.

http://www.colganair.com/flight_3407_releases/faq_2009-05-13.pdf

What a company!!!

No such lip-service as "we are doing what we can to help the crew's family in this difficult time". They instead chose to say "Even though they were a Colgan flight crew, we have no idea where they learned to fly the Q like that".

They almost came out and said...We don't think a higher level of pay and QOL is needed at all at Colgan. The RAA president agreed with that sentiment.

We like our pilots starving and tired, that way they pick up more open time and are less likely to call in sick (something we discourage) and they are less likely to remember the "safety first" motto we blew up their skirts in indoc.

So have we laid to rest the notion that higher pay attracts more quality candidates? CEOs?????

 

[andyd]

How about any pilot's flying part 121 revenue passengers have an ATP and type rating in the aircraft being flown? This would raise the minimum age to 23 years old, eliminate the puppy mills and force wages to be raised.

 

[jmreii]

Are you kidding? If they make changes, i.e. give the regional flying back to Expressjet, then it's admitting that he made a fatal mistake. Too late for that. He must vigorously defend his decision or else the victims attornies will have a field day.

BTW, seems strange Colgan would put this on their website. Does ALPA know about this? It appears Colgan is trying to distance themselves from the pilots.

http://www.colganair.com/flight_3407_releases/faq_2009-05-13.pdf

The victims attornies already smell blood and are going in for the kill. I bet the attornies make continental the focal point.

 

[Vegaspilot99]

How about any pilot's flying part 121 revenue passengers have an ATP and type rating in the aircraft being flown? This would raise the minimum age to 23 years old, eliminate the puppy mills and force wages to be raised.

Thats an interesting idea.

 

[flyboyike]

How about any pilot's flying part 121 revenue passengers have an ATP and type rating in the aircraft being flown?

Just to clarify: are you suggesting the applicant should get himself a Q400 type elsewhere and then apply to Colgan?

 

[flynryan15]

I wonder what would happen if dozens of Colgan pilots started using the new Fatigue Policy? Kind of like he Chuck Colgan put your money where your mouth is!

 

[climbhappy]

it makes you wonder: are they doing this to attract new pilot candidates or doing PR work before the jury trial.

 

[andyd]

Just to clarify: are you suggesting the applicant should get himself a Q400 type elsewhere and then apply to Colgan?

No, the applicant has an ATP before being hired. And then in the 121 training be typed at cost to the company hiring.

 

[Lear70]

How about any pilot's flying part 121 revenue passengers have an ATP and type rating in the aircraft being flown? This would raise the minimum age to 23 years old, eliminate the puppy mills and force wages to be raised.

I've been preaching that (ATP minimums for ALL airline pilots, including new-hires), for about 5 years now...

Started when PCL started hiring all these 19 year old GIA kids with 450 hours TOTAL time and expected us Captains just to carry the load... regardless of safety concerns, workload, or the "single pilot cockpits" that happened when anything non-standard came up until they had a year or two of line experience.

Nobody's been listening...

 

[Sig]

... and expected us Captains just to carry the load...

But it worked then, didn't it?

I am by no means saying you are wrong. The problems I see with the Colgan crash are different. They can't be solved by 2 ATPs up front or with better pay.

Let's put 2 2000 hr Baron pilots up front as newhires- one is a CA because of his SSN. Neither have opened the boarding stair door of a Dash.

Now how can we make this even more real-world, and more wildly bizarre? One has 9 VMs from the divorce lawyer, the other has 9 from his brother in law saying his baby is on the way? It isn't so simple.

I wish I knew the answer. In my walnut-sized noggin, I think seeing a stick push activate in the sim is a real eye-opener. Then again, I don't know a whole lot of anything any more.

Be safe out there.

 

[JungleJett]

The victims attornies already smell blood and are going in for the kill. I bet the attornies make continental the focal point.

CAL is always looking for the cheapest route..and they got it.

 

[Paul R. Smith]

....,....

 

[Superpilot92]

How about any pilot's flying part 121 revenue passengers have an ATP and type rating in the aircraft being flown? This would raise the minimum age to 23 years old, eliminate the puppy mills and force wages to be raised.

Thats EXACTLY what needs to happen. I emailed my state and local reps about this a couple days ago. Imagine that, requiring pilots to have a *GASP* Airline Transport Pilot rating to fly as an Airline Pilot. Crazy i know The airlines can now just hire anyone they want often without even a sim evaluation just to get a warm body to fill a required seat. Force them to hire people with an ATP, people who have shown they can fly to Airline Transport Pilot standards (i know another gasp) then the airlines will have to raise pay to attract actual qualified pilots. That would also help get rid of alot of the zero to hero pilot factories. This absolutely needs to be what happens.

 

[JettBoii]

Having an ATP does not make you a good pilot. Experience allows you to acquire more flying time which in turn makes you hopefully have better judgement which in turn results in better decision making skills which equals a more competent pilot which hopefully gets the airline a safer crew.

Something like that.

 

[turbodriver]

Having an ATP does not make you a good pilot. Experience allows you to acquire more flying time which in turn makes you hopefully have better judgement which in turn results in better decision making skills which equals a more competent pilot which hopefully gets the airline a safer crew.

Something like that.

True, but having an ATP will make you a better pilot than the 500 wonder that came out of gulfstream who has had NO prior experience in a RJ let alone in a glass cockpit.....

 

[JettBoii]

True dat.

 

[ROSWELL41]

All this talk about an ATP is great, but it would not have effected either of the Colgan pilots. Captain with 3000+TT and the FO with 2000+TT. Low timers didn't crash this Q400.