Big Sky - East Coast

[Waylon]

I know this may not be very popular but the question you have to ask yourself is? Would of the cards played out any different if the Big Sky pilots would of voted in ALPA and been more closely tied to the XJ pilot group.

 

[DiverDriver]

Big Sky pilots:

If you are looking to stay in the northeast might I suggest applying to Air Wisconsin. We just announced LGA/RDU domiciles in addition to PHL/DCA/ORF current domiciles. Supposedly they are to be staffed up during midde 2008.

I wish you well.

 

[On Your Six]

For the PICs out there with pretty good hours, I would recommend Netjets (especially with their new TA). BOS is one of the new domiciles. Avantair with its P180s is also hiring and it has a BOS base. Check out this link:

http://airlinepilotcentral.com/airlines/fractional.html

Colgan, PDT and Air Whisky will all offer NE jobs if you really want to stay in the area.

Good luck.

 

[Shakenbake]

I know this may not be very popular but the question you have to ask yourself is? Would of the cards played out any different if the Big Sky pilots would of voted in ALPA and been more closely tied to the XJ pilot group.

I think the Big Sky pilot group went to ALPA twice and tried to get representation. ALPA told them "no thanks". But as soon as MAIR acquired Big Sky and ALPA and the Mesaba pilots realized that the whipsawing was about to begin they (ALPA) asked Big Sky to come on board and the Big Sky pilots told ALPA "no thanks". I believe that is how it all worked out. I could have some of the details wrong. Anyone else know more?

 

[rigger]

From Mother ship Delta:



Big Sky Airlines will terminate all Delta Connection flights after Jan. 7, citing continued operational challenges in the Northeast and rising fuel prices. Because of the planned cancellations, we will terminate our codeshare relationship with Big Sky and will no longer reserve seats for customers on Big Sky flights after Jan. 7.
These cancellations will affect flights in all markets served by Big Sky including: Allentown, Pa.; Boston; Burlington, Vt.; Cape Girardeau, Mo.; Cincinnati; Jackson, Tenn.; Massena, N.Y.; Ogdensburg, N.Y.; Owensboro, Ky.; Plattsburgh, N.Y.; Saranac Lake, N.Y.; Trenton, N.J.; Watertown, N.Y.; and White Plains, N.Y. We will continue to operate Big Sky flights between Bangor, Maine and Boston using 50-seat Comair jets.


Sucks guys!!!

 

[rtmcfi]

I think the Big Sky pilot group went to ALPA twice and tried to get representation. ALPA told them "no thanks". But as soon as MAIR acquired Big Sky and ALPA and the Mesaba pilots realized that the whipsawing was about to begin they (ALPA) asked Big Sky to come on board and the Big Sky pilots told ALPA "no thanks". I believe that is how it all worked out. I could have some of the details wrong. Anyone else know more?

You have it right.

 

[captain dad]

Liquidation

http://www.startribune.com/business/12681302.html

 

[CA1900]

How's this for a response to an airline they're trying to keep:

http://www.adirondackdailyenterprise.com/news/articles.asp?articleID=9737

“From our meeting that we had, we knew there were problems, but we were willing to work with Big Sky to allow them to get back on their feet,” Miller said.

According to Miller, Big Sky owes the town about $57,000 for de-icing, fuel and landing fees. Miller said he has notified airport employees that Big Sky no longer has credit at the Adirondack Regional Airport until it pays its bill.
...
“They were going to try and hold Big Sky’s feet to the fire and make them stay, like they had done with CommutAir, because they do have the EAS contract,” Miller said.

So by "willing to work with" them, they mean "cash up front"? Niiiiice.

Enjoy Greyhound, people.

 

[NEDude]

I feel no pity for the residents and government of Saranac Lake. None at all.

I can't believe they were ever upset about our reliability. I can't count the number of times I had to fly an empty airplane in and out of SLK or RUT. But dispatch still had us go because we got paid for landing there.

My guess is they were upset about how much the company was charging passengers to fly out of there.

 

[kmox29]

Liquidation

http://www.startribune.com/business/12681302.html

Just seeing that guy's face makes my blood boil. Although I left the airline almost 2 years ago, I still harbor pure hatred for him and Spanjers.

How can he earn $1.1 million and receive $550,000 in bonuses for almost destroying 2 carriers? There has gotta be a special place in hell for these guys.

 

[Cpt Oveur]

Yes, there is. Right next to Lorenzo.

 

[cale42]

This was a doomed operation from the start.. I spent a couple bids in MSS flying for AMW. The people there were so excited to boot us for Big Sky.. it was all they could talk about. Noone seem concerned that Big Sky had no employees and no experience on the East Coast, and no real concrete plan. Even so.. that northern NY flying is brutal on the whole. With the weather and the lack of runway and nav equipment.. its amazing flights ever got in and out of those places on any kind of regular schedule.

On a related note.. does anyone else feel this is the start of the whole EAS concept being doomed. As long as the regionals are short like they are pilots don't want to go to the 1900. And thats the only plane that can really work EAS profitably.. and even thats tough. With AMW and Big SKy actively pulling out of every city the gov't will allow, Colgan getting the Q's.. there is literally noone to fly the EAS service.. just aint gonna happen...

cale

 

[CA1900]

On a related note.. does anyone else feel this is the start of the whole EAS concept being doomed...

As a taxpayer, I certainly hope so. If the market won't support air service, guess what? You don't get air service!

Saranac Lake, for example, is 150 miles from Albany, NY, and 110 miles from Burlington, VT. Utica, NY, was finally dropped as an EAS city, but it was less than 50 miles from Syracuse, and had a subsidy of over $1 Million a year! That one really ticked me off, as the planes were almost always empty -- the passengers were driving to Syracuse to take the JetBlue flight to the same city.


The saying, "beggars can't be choosers," seems to ring especially true here. If you want federally-subsidized air service, then you get the lowest (or only) bidder. And seldom is the lowest bidder going to provide you the best service out there, because good service costs money.


These people want hourly 737s for $50 when they can't even half-fill a couple of 1900s in a day. I don't know what they're putting in the water up there, but it must be pretty damn good.

 

[rptrain]

On a related note.. does anyone else feel this is the start of the whole EAS concept being doomed.

i'd take that bet. in its current form, EAS is good for nobody.

 

[propsarebest]

i'd take that bet. in its current form, EAS is good for nobody.

Agreed. It is real bad for everyone, especially the city/county that gets a chubby when someone finally does fly in to their hole. Then they spend a ton of $$$ (YOUR MONEY) to build a fancyass terminal that nobody uses. Then they bitch and complain about the lack of use.

 

[JPAustin]

I think the Big Sky pilot group went to ALPA twice and tried to get representation. ALPA told them "no thanks". But as soon as MAIR acquired Big Sky and ALPA and the Mesaba pilots realized that the whipsawing was about to begin they (ALPA) asked Big Sky to come on board and the Big Sky pilots told ALPA "no thanks". I believe that is how it all worked out. I could have some of the details wrong. Anyone else know more?

That is exactly correct. I hope what little connection Big Sky does have with Mesaba perhaps can persuade the Mesaba MEC to negotiate for a preferential hiring program. I know some guys at XJ are PO'd because Big Sky voted NO to ALPA in XJ's time of need, but come on, I wouldn't want to be the girl picked to dance last either when my services are suddenly needed afterall. Regardless, my condolences to the Big Sky pilots. I always liked the operation (what little I knew of it) and respected the skills required to fly in that crap northern plains/rockies crap.

 

[clippyrip]

If any of you have connections to get the Big Sky pilots some preferential hiring it would help. There are a lot of people worried about getting another job before their head goes below water. Last night there was a resume building party and there were a number of people really sweating this news. The newest rumor is that the FAA is headed out here to shut things down effective immediately. Great Christmas Bonus.

 

[profit]

That is exactly correct. I hope what little connection Big Sky does have with Mesaba perhaps can persuade the Mesaba MEC to negotiate for a preferential hiring program. I know some guys at XJ are PO'd because Big Sky voted NO to ALPA in XJ's time of need, but come on, I wouldn't want to be the girl picked to dance last either when my services are suddenly needed afterall. Regardless, my condolences to the Big Sky pilots. I always liked the operation (what little I knew of it) and respected the skills required to fly in that crap northern plains/rockies crap.

It is NOT correct at all. ALPA never tried to get the TWU decertified and replaced by ALPA.

ALPA/XJ disliked the idea of the 100+Million earned by Mesaba diverted to the holding company and used to grow an entirely separate airline.

ALPA invited the Big Sky chairman to the ALPA BOD meeting to discuss the issue. The BS chairman ate lots of free food, talked with numerous reps and national officers, and went home and did NOTHING. He had his chance and failed to attempt to make friends with potential brother and sister union pilots. XJ/ALPA attempted to find a cooperative solution, but it fell on deaf ears. So XJ/ALPA had to play the scope card. Mesaba pilots paid dearly with a very average contract to secure their company scope. The end result was Big Sky being limited to 19 seats.

Big Sky pilots didn't vote no to Mesaba, they voted for a very sub-standard contract that would have resulted in growth fueled by money earned by Mesaba.

You might want to get your facts straight before you spew that stuff.

 

[profit]

It is NOT correct at all. ALPA never tried to get the TWU decertified and replaced by ALPA.

Sorry, I meant UTU.

 

[JPAustin]

It is NOT correct at all. ALPA never tried to get the TWU decertified and replaced by ALPA.

ALPA/XJ disliked the idea of the 100+Million earned by Mesaba diverted to the holding company and used to grow an entirely separate airline.

ALPA invited the Big Sky chairman to the ALPA BOD meeting to discuss the issue. The BS chairman ate lots of free food, talked with numerous reps and national officers, and went home and did NOTHING. He had his chance and failed to attempt to make friends with potential brother and sister union pilots. XJ/ALPA attempted to find a cooperative solution, but it fell on deaf ears. So XJ/ALPA had to play the scope card. Mesaba pilots paid dearly with a very average contract to secure their company scope. The end result was Big Sky being limited to 19 seats.

Big Sky pilots didn't vote no to Mesaba, they voted for a very sub-standard contract that would have resulted in growth fueled by money earned by Mesaba.

You might want to get your facts straight before you spew that stuff.

I give you, a PO'd XJ pilot!

Come on dude, whoever said ALPA tried to get the TWU "decertified"? They certainly tried to persuade Big Sky pilots to vote out TWU in favor of ALPA, but Big Sky pilots rightfully had a bad taste in their mouth after approaching ALPA twice to no avail.

Get off your high-horse. Its Christmas and people just heard they are out of a job, just in time to have already spent some hard earned money on the holidays. Pissed or not, you should have compassion for any pilot forced out of a job for any reason, especially during the holidays. Do YOU know what each and every individual pilot there at Big Sky thinks or thought about ALPA or Mesaba? Some probably hated both, true, but the rest were just earning a living and supporting a family.

It is best YOU are aware of the PRESENT FACTS before YOU start SPEWING off THAT stuff.