Best King Air

[Fblowjets]

Add:
Training cost are very expensive for us (proline 21) but your figures should be close. We flight plan 1000lbs the first hour 900 the second and 800 there after. Its conservative but works well. Then again we are in ATL where the first 20mins of the flight is at 4000ft. At FL 240-FL260 you are looking at burning 370lbs per side. We also operate at max power and she loves it. 805ITT

 

[Byei]

I've learned to lower bragging speeds by at least 5% for actual line flying. So if 290-295kts is reasonable I"ll be happy. It is sounding like that is a pretty good match for us. We've been told our pax count will increase to 6-7 on average this year from our sales/marketing team. We operate out of a 4400' small town strip, so we don't have to worry much about taxi time...except to let the oil warm up We could continue to operate the Beechjet, but because we will do 2-3 short legs in a row we are almost always burning 1600lbs an hour...but we love it, it will be hard to give up.

byei

 

[NewmanF16]

...no Bravo will carry 8 pax, full fuel from almost any airport in USA in the summer, then fly 5 hours and land with IFR reserves.

True...But the Bravo would only need to fly a little over three hours to go as far as the King Air...

Unless your trip lengths are under probably 400nm, newer Citations will very likely be cheaper to operate and out perform King Airs. Also nice to cruise over the weather in a quite cabin than slog through it.

 

[BoilerUP]

We operate out of a 4400' small town strip, so we don't have to worry much about taxi time...except to let the oil warm up We could continue to operate the Beechjet, but because we will do 2-3 short legs in a row we are almost always burning 1600lbs an hour...but we love it, it will be hard to give up.

Been a while since I've flown the Beechjet, but isn't 4400' a bit short if the runway is wet or contaminated? Perhaps that isn't a problem where you are based...

Anyway, back on topic...I was told by a CJ2+ operator their operating costs on that airframe is equal to their previous aircraft which was a B200.

That said, no Bravo or CJ series (short of maybe the upcoming CJ4) will be able to go full fuel and full seats like the B350 can. Sure it'll be slower and maybe cost a little more to operate, but in regard to sheer payload and runway requirements I don't think you can match its capability.

 

[400A]

As an example of how awesome the 350 is, during training they make you do a single engine go-around with the gear down and the flaps full.... And it will do it! :beer:

 

[solpilot]

400A

Where did you do your training? Just curious. I've been to Flight Safety and Simuflite and have never been asked to go-around SE with gear and flaps full. I've only done gear and flaps approach. That said, I agree with you it probably will do it.
As far as TAS:
Summer flights in the south plan on 290 TAS
Winter flights 300-310 TAS
speeds are based on 800ITT (20 degrees below red line)

 

[400A]

400A

Where did you do your training? Just curious. I've been to Flight Safety and Simuflite and have never been asked to go-around SE with gear and flaps full. I've only done gear and flaps approach. That said, I agree with you it probably will do it.
As far as TAS:
Summer flights in the south plan on 290 TAS
Winter flights 300-310 TAS
speeds are based on 800ITT (20 degrees below red line)

I am not typed. I have about 50 hours SIC in it and the guys I flew it with shared the experience with me. They went to FSI ICT. It was dome as a demo only kind of thing. It was not part of the syllabus. It was done during their initial as a demonstration of how powerful the aircraft is. It could have been instructor specific, or have been discontinued.

 

[Fblowjets]

Its not bragging, you asked what it will do and we get 300-315 out of it. SO FAR. It might change in summer but we bought this plane brand new in December and flown it 50 hours so far. We have loaded it with 8 pax and 2 crew full fuel and she was still in CG, and under weight. Great airplane....

 

[ksu_aviator]

You may not be interested, but you might try the SA227 Metro III/Merlin IVc. If you get a 16,000 MTOW, you'll have tremendous range and payload.

MTOW 16,000
BOW 11,000'ish
Fuel Burn 700/500
Cost per Hour $550 (pilot not included)
Cruise 250-275
Seats 12 comfortably

You said you carry 4 to 5 pax? Let's say that is 1000 lbs. You'll be able to fly 7 hours with reserves.

The cabin is huge. My 280lb owner and his football buddies sit comfortably side by side with room to walk between them.

Down sides:
Loud;
Uses plenty of runway;
Water/Methanol is required during the spring, summer, and most of fall and it can be hard to find;
A type rating is required;
It is hard to find a Metro III/Merlin IVc that is not in a cargo configuration, so you'll have some extra start up costs;
Battery starts can be iffy.

If you want a comfortable, big cabin that is cheap to operate and reliable, take a look at the SA227.

 

[400A]

You may not be interested, but you might try the SA227 Metro III/Merlin IVc. If you get a 16,000 MTOW, you'll have tremendous range and payload.

MTOW 16,000
BOW 11,000'ish
Fuel Burn 700/500
Cost per Hour $550 (pilot not included)
Cruise 250-275
Seats 12 comfortably

You said you carry 4 to 5 pax? Let's say that is 1000 lbs. You'll be able to fly 7 hours with reserves.

The cabin is huge. My 280lb owner and his football buddies sit comfortably side by side with room to walk between them.

Down sides:
Loud;
Uses plenty of runway;
Water/Methanol is required during the spring, summer, and most of fall and it can be hard to find;
A type rating is required;
It is hard to find a Metro III/Merlin IVc that is not in a cargo configuration, so you'll have some extra start up costs;
Battery starts can be iffy.

If you want a comfortable, big cabin that is cheap to operate and reliable, take a look at the SA227.

Another web site shows DOC at $1550 per hour. After flying a Merlin III myself I am more likely to believe that number. At todays fuel prices you will burn almost $550 per hour for gas. I found the TPE's very expensive to maintain.

Just my opinion, not flaming.

 

[Byei]

Merlin.....yup, the previous regime tried that before....pax said never again...sorry

And someone else asked earlier if 4400' was short for a Beechjet? Well, we definitely use enough of it and flaps 20 is pretty common. We have good close-by alternates we use if there is any contamination, when it is dry it is actualy very comfortable.


byei

 

[ksu_aviator]

Another web site shows DOC at $1550 per hour. After flying a Merlin III myself I am more likely to believe that number. At todays fuel prices you will burn almost $550 per hour for gas. I found the TPE's very expensive to maintain.

Just my opinion, not flaming.

Maybe I'm just that good....

I just checked and our average expenses come up to $589 an hour for a Merlin IVc (the big one). That does not include insurance or pilot salary. That is aircraft alone. When you add those we come up to about $1600/hr.

Our fuel burn and average fuel price are pretty low because we use Avfuel (who doesn't?) and long range cruise power for every flight. Plus I like to fly in the 20's so we are only burning 450 to 500 lbs for our second our fuel burn. I actually got 350 lbs per hour out of it when I went up to 270 last week. My numbers show that we average $3.81 per gallon (that includes taxes and ramp fees).

We also average $100 per hour for scheduled and unscheduled maintenance. We have brand new engines and don't plan on keeping the aircraft long enough to reach the really expensive maintenance. It will be 19 or 20 years before these engine time out.

There is a vast difference between the Merlin III and a Merlin IVc. The increased MTOW is 3500 lbs and the cabin is the largest for a single pilot aircraft.

But I don't want to talk you into something you, or your company doesn't want. I was just putting it out there. We are convinced it is the best corporate turbo-prop for the dollar. Mostly because the cabin is just phenominal and the aircraft is incredibly reliable.

 

[Byei]

Maybe I'm just that good....

I just checked and our average expenses come up to $589 an hour for a Merlin IVc (the big one). That does not include insurance or pilot salary. That is aircraft alone. When you add those we come up to about $1600/hr.

Our fuel burn and average fuel price are pretty low because we use Avfuel (who doesn't?) and long range cruise power for every flight. Plus I like to fly in the 20's so we are only burning 450 to 500 lbs for our second our fuel burn. I actually got 350 lbs per hour out of it when I went up to 270 last week. My numbers show that we average $3.81 per gallon (that includes taxes and ramp fees).

We also average $100 per hour for scheduled and unscheduled maintenance. We have brand new engines and don't plan on keeping the aircraft long enough to reach the really expensive maintenance. It will be 19 or 20 years before these engine time out.

There is a vast difference between the Merlin III and a Merlin IVc. The increased MTOW is 3500 lbs and the cabin is the largest for a single pilot aircraft.

But I don't want to talk you into something you, or your company doesn't want. I was just putting it out there. We are convinced it is the best corporate turbo-prop for the dollar. Mostly because the cabin is just phenominal and the aircraft is incredibly reliable.

Sorry, couldn't resist. I did actually bring the plane up, but it didn't last very long. I have talked to a number of people who have had great experiences with them however...especially the IVc.

I appreciate your input,

byei

 

[GVFlyer]

Having never flown the Merlin, I don't have an opinion concerning it, but the military has had pretty good luck with the airplane.

http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/ac/c-26.htm

GV

 

[pilotyip]

It is not the B-90