Becoming a career aviator is rough!

[CrimsonEclipse]

Crap man, that's rough. He's lucky he got out at all.

Looks like a Pawnee. Is that at Woodbine?

What happened? Engine failure?

Banner towing is really dangerous, usually lose 1-3 a year in NJ alone.

CE

(hope the guy's ok)

 

[avbug]

Banner towing is dangerous? Is it possible to have a more benign assignment?

Most of those doing the banner towing are more than likely entry level pilots with little experience, trying to "build time." A higher percentage of incidents occuring in such an arena doesn't make the job dangerous.

 

[FN FAL]

That's a very zen viewpoint worthy of some contemplation.

The best single piece of advice I received as a young pilot was delivered in two words: Stay tense!

Hahaha...I hear you bro. I plan on straying tense for a long time.

 

[wrxpilot]

Hahaha...I hear you bro. I plan on straying tense for a long time.

A repo man spend his life getting into tense situations!

 

[CrimsonEclipse]

Banner towing is dangerous? Is it possible to have a more benign assignment?

Most of those doing the banner towing are more than likely entry level pilots with little experience, trying to "build time." A higher percentage of incidents occuring in such an arena doesn't make the job dangerous.

SO, we should require that banner pilots have at least 5000 hours.
Ya know, so the 'time builders' don't make the industry look bad.

CE

 

[Goose Egg]

What I will say is this: I realize now that when I was "paying my dues" I was entirely too anxious for the "next step" to arrive. Little did I know I was experiencing the best times of my life. This is not to say that it's all downhill from here, but take some time to "smell the roses". You'll never get this back, and believe it or not, you'll miss it. Indeed, as a wise man once said, "Enjoy it while it lasts".

AMEN! That's my philosophy with instructing--hang around a bit and actually try to learn something. Instructing is great!

-Goose

 

[JSky26]

very humbling thread to say the least...

 

[momalley81]

Yeah, I was around Wildwood; just later in the day. Heard about Andy, hope he makes out ok, but that is one of the worst planes to crash in out there; especially with the extra 40 gal in the hopper.

And Avbug may be right, it isn't dangerous in and of itself really. The problem is you're putting low time guys in planes manuvering low-level with little training, and spending all day low-and-slow. Any mistake you make, there isn't much time to correct.

That being said; we know it may be a cake assignment for a high-time fire bomber and ag pilot stud like you. But for a 250 hour wet behind the ears CFI, it is a bit of a change of pace for them. They rarely spend more than a minute at a time below 500 agl. Now they're spending hour after hour down there, cut the guy some slack!

It sucks. Be safe out there. I'll be back next weekend.

 

[FN FAL]

A repo man spend his life getting into tense situations!

Dude, say it like you mean it!

"A repo man spend his life getting into tense situaitons?"

 

[avbug]

SO, we should require that banner pilots have at least 5000 hours.
Ya know, so the 'time builders' don't make the industry look bad.

No one said any such thing, least of all me. However, the assertion that towing banners is dangerous in the least, is ridiculous. Five thousand hours of five hundred; very little maneuvering, very little action, merely a pickup, a drop, and a lot of low-stress flying in between.

I guess I wouldn't know about that...having opened and run a banner tow business as a working CFI.

It's as dangerous as you make it. If you find it dangerous, it's not the job. It's the pilot.

 

[CrimsonEclipse]

No one said any such thing, least of all me. However, the assertion that towing banners is dangerous in the least, is ridiculous. Five thousand hours of five hundred; very little maneuvering, very little action, merely a pickup, a drop, and a lot of low-stress flying in between.

I guess I wouldn't know about that...having opened and run a banner tow business as a working CFI.

It's as dangerous as you make it. If you find it dangerous, it's not the job. It's the pilot.

I know what you mean. I just walked through Liberty City with a Confederate
flag at 2am and I was perfectly safe.....because It's only as dangerous as
you make it.

CE

 

[Papps]

I havent read this entire threat yet, but isn't it time we have one of the self rightous, j#@k-off, company boys say something like "if you dont like it, then quit" or something retarded like that.

 

[mcjohn]

The planes are over flown and beat up. Engine trouble is a daily routine for many companies. So far on the Jersey Shore this season a few planes at different companies have blown jugs (doesn't mean you have to crash of course.) We've had 2 minor engine failures (also doesn't mean you have to crash) but the engine started back up. Think of it this way avbug. Is crop dusting dangerous? What ever that answer is it applies to us...at one tenth or less of what you experience crop dusting. All I know is that skimming the tree tops on 40+ knts gusty day IS DANGEROUS. I also agree that many experienced pilots can do it safely for many years and us low timers are the ones that tend to get in trouble and complacent the quickest....especially a low timer that starts hot dogging just above the tress.
I see you mention that you opened a towing company at one point so you know the dangers associated with the drops, pick ups, AND PILOTS. What length rope were you using at your company? Anything less than 200' can be quite dangerous. D A N G E R O U S ! Sorry, I just had to say it again since it seems to BUG avBUG.

 

[LR25]

I have over 10 years of towing, I have had about 3 events in that time frame that caused me great alarm, 2 of them were my fualt, the other was someone elses. All the events I was able to fly out of without incident.

The airplanes are what you have to watch out for, not the flying.

A co worker put a perfectly good Pawnee straight down a pine tree trunk after about 2 turns in a spin becuase he got stupid, and this was after droping the banner.

Its how safe do YOU want to make it.