B6 Hotel?

[BLUE BAYOU]

First of all, there already is a Hedonism III in Montego Bay, heheh... And second, the hotel makes a lot of sense... Last I heard, at peak of training (Pilots, Flight attendants, Customer Service/Res Agents, and Tech ops) we had over 500 rooms in the Orlando area booked. 292 rooms with the ability to rent out the vacant ones would be nice for not only the overnight crews, but also all those going to training-- recurrent and initial. At any one time that would at least give the hotel a 50% occupancy rate, which isn't bad. It could be worse, maybe we can be an airline that makes the trainees pay for their hotel rooms, hows about that???

 

[Bavarian Chef]

Good for you guys. Just remember what happened to United when they started branching out and being distracted from their core business of running an airline.

Are you serious? We are talking about a crew lodge for god's sake. Lighten up. When jb announces a bid for Econolodge, then you can start twisting your panties again.

Besides, all this talk of crazy jb love is really just to keep us distracted from cleaning the cabin, sucking up bad 190 rates, triple transcon duty days, sideways nose gears etc. My jb bubbas -- what have I left out? 32LT10 ... where are you when I need you? Are you standing in front of first class pretending to like your ... gulp ... "passengers"?

 

[JP4user]

Are you serious? We are talking about a crew lodge for god's sake. Lighten up. When jb announces a bid for Econolodge, then you can start twisting your panties again.

Besides, all this talk of crazy jb love is really just to keep us distracted from cleaning the cabin, sucking up bad 190 rates, triple transcon duty days, sideways nose gears etc. My jb bubbas -- what have I left out? 32LT10 ... where are you when I need you? Are you standing in front of first class pretending to like your ... gulp ... "passengers"?

A wee bit sensitive are we? But you're right, the friggin thing will run all by itself. Honestly, I am happy to see you guys burn the cash.

 

[Vastly Underemp]

Look, even if it takes 5 years (and who the hell ever pays off a commercial mortgage in 5 years?) they are still WAY ahead. They have a solid asset for finance collateral if they so choose or for sale if they choose; what hotel chain wouldn't be salivating to get their hands on a property right at MCO? It would, however, seem to diminish the possibility of a crew base there if they have "free" hotel space available. Just my 2 cents, your mileage may vary..

 

[Lake Alice]

Ran into a several 190 crews RIC and they are pissed beyond belief about pay. Many have apps out for other gigs. Sounds like a union would come from the 190.

Umm....ok...sure

 

[8vATE]

Good for you guys. Just remember what happened to United when they started branching out and being distracted from their core business of running an airline.

Oh please..

this is nothing on UAL's scale..
we are not buying a hotel chain or a car rental company.

this is an investment in the company.
There will be a dedicated need for lodging for years and years for crewmember training.

JB is building the hotel.. contractor's will manage it.
Logistics (transportation, food etc) will be greatly simplified.
yes hotels are plentiful in the MCO airport area.. but you are competing with a LOT of tourists and people have had to be spread among several places...

this is nothing more than a rational, logical investment.

 

[JP4user]

this is nothing more than a rational, logical investment.

Time will tell.

 

[JBPA]

Umm....ok...sure

FWIW, I flew with a dude recently (320) who said that several of the guys he had flown with had said they were interested in/applied to Virgin America.

Blue Brigaders, please don't take this as the sky is falling. It is naive to think that folks aren't looking for other opportunities, especially since we have a young pilot group and a lot of us have been racking up 800+ PIC/year for several years now.

The -190 folks knew what they were getting into paywise (I think), but that fact alone probably doesn't dull the pain of making $35-40K (less/more?). I hope the pay is adjusted (for the -320 too..we're overdue) ASAP once we get back on track or coogebeachhotel's union speculation could become reality.

 

[Bavarian Chef]

A wee bit sensitive are we? But you're right, the friggin thing will run all by itself. Honestly, I am happy to see you guys burn the cash.

Not sensitive at all. Just think it's hilarious that a crew lodge is taken so seriously.

What's up with all the n/a's in your profile? Sensitive about something?

 

[Bavarian Chef]

FWIW, I flew with a dude recently (320) who said that several of the guys he had flown with had said they were interested in/applied to Virgin America.

Blue Brigaders, please don't take this as the sky is falling. It is naive to think that folks aren't looking for other opportunities, especially since we have a young pilot group and a lot of us have been racking up 800+ PIC/year for several years now.

The -190 folks knew what they were getting into paywise (I think), but that fact alone probably doesn't dull the pain of making $35-40K (less/more?). I hope the pay is adjusted (for the -320 too..we're overdue) ASAP once we get back on track or coogebeachhotel's union speculation could become reality.

Virgin America? Seriously? Well, whatever. Maybe they want to be asstronauts. If I move up in seniority, so be it.

BTW, didn't Virgin just get put off for another year?

 

[JP4user]

Not sensitive at all. Just think it's hilarious that a crew lodge is taken so seriously.

What's up with all the n/a's in your profile? Sensitive about something?

I don't take it seriously at all. I just find it funny JB trying to reinvent the wheel. Braniff tried this once and it was a fiscal and operational disaster.
As I said before though go ahead and burn the cash.

Sensitive? Not in the least, just lazy. But to make you happy as it seems you need to grasp about things, I filled them in.

 

[Lake Alice]

FWIW, I flew with a dude recently (320) who said that several of the guys he had flown with had said they were interested in/applied to Virgin America.

Blue Brigaders, please don't take this as the sky is falling. It is naive to think that folks aren't looking for other opportunities, especially since we have a young pilot group and a lot of us have been racking up 800+ PIC/year for several years now.

The -190 folks knew what they were getting into paywise (I think), but that fact alone probably doesn't dull the pain of making $35-40K (less/more?). I hope the pay is adjusted (for the -320 too..we're overdue) ASAP once we get back on track or coogebeachhotel's union speculation could become reality.

The comment that folks are applying elsewhere is certainly plausible. People want different things out of a job and many are willing to take a risk on Virgin considering that some did quite well with JB.

As for the union comment I believe that one to be more of flame bait than anything. Do guys want a raise...certainly. Do they deserve a raise...certainly. Does the company realize we need to pay those guys more...I believe so since they were giving some guys an extra 5 hours a month pay.

The remarks "you knew what the pay was when you got here" are true and asinine, however, pilots who went to the 190 program were also lead to believe that once the airplane and the program were stable and "proved" itself the raises would come. This, of course, was prior to the over inflated fuel prices.

I suspect those guys will get the raise sooner than later considering Airways is getting their 190's soon and their pay rates start around $20 more than ours not considering premium pay. With premium pay our rates are still quite lower.

 

[JBPA]

Virgin America? Seriously? Well, whatever. Maybe they want to be asstronauts. If I move up in seniority, so be it.

BTW, didn't Virgin just get put off for another year?

Just relaying what the man said. I didn't necessarily say they were looking into good options. On the other hand, when folks started here in '99-'00 they were likely lambasted for coming here (over DAL,AA,UAL,etc - who'd have thunk). Look at them now (split-adjusted price of $0.33). Admittedly, it's a different landscape now but should VA succeed (if they get off the ground) the risk could payoff for the inital cadre folks who are probably middle/bottom feeders here. Personally, FEX would be the only place that I'd leave for (my app is in, not called on sponsor yet and probably won't anytime soon). However, besides the M&G/Interview hurdles, it sounds like things aren't all rosy there either. Something about the grass is always greener.....My own personal agenda is to cover my ass and keep an eye out for other opportunities. To not do that nowadays in this business is foolish.

The remarks "you knew what the pay was when you got here" are true and asinine, however, pilots who went to the 190 program were also lead to believe that once the airplane and the program were stable and "proved" itself the raises would come. This, of course, was prior to the over inflated fuel prices.

As usual, the wrong tone is inferred from my post. I wasn't pontificating about the -190 folks and their pay. The -190 folks that I know seem to get defensive when asked about how things are and say 'I knew what I was getting myself into'. I guess it's human nature when trying to justify a difficult personal decison that hasn't panned out exactly as planned. I never went to any of those 'propaganda' sessions prior to the -190 bid, but if I had I would've been VERY careful about considering supposed future pay increases. There's an interesting thread on bp.com that talks about 320 FO pay vs. 190 CA pay. Interesting indeed.

Oh yeah, that hotel is going to be sweet! Perhaps the -190 FO's can sign up for RA duty to make a little extra coinage. I keeeeed, I keeeeed.

 

[Bavarian Chef]

I don't take it seriously at all. I just find it funny JB trying to reinvent the wheel. Braniff tried this once and it was a fiscal and operational disaster.
As I said before though go ahead and burn the cash.

Sensitive? Not in the least, just lazy. But to make you happy as it seems you need to grasp about things, I filled them in.

You are such a giver. And as for reinventing the wheel, you are wrong sir. While we may have received millions of dollars of free advertising for "reinventing the sideways-turned nosewheel" -- as far as I know we were not the first airline to think that one up.

Ha. I say.

(still trying to understand your english in that last sentence)

 

[Bavarian Chef]

Just relaying what the man said. I didn't necessarily say they were looking into good options. On the other hand, when folks started here in '99-'00 they were likely lambasted for coming here (over DAL,AA,UAL,etc - who'd have thunk). Look at them now (split-adjusted price of $0.33). Admittedly, it's a different landscape now but should VA succeed (if they get off the ground) the risk could payoff for the inital cadre folks who are probably middle/bottom feeders here. Personally, FEX would be the only place that I'd leave for (my app is in, not called on sponsor yet and probably won't anytime soon). However, besides the M&G/Interview hurdles, it sounds like things aren't all rosy there either. Something about the grass is always greener.....My own personal agenda is to cover my ass and keep an eye out for other opportunities. To not do that nowadays in this business is foolish.



As usual, the wrong tone is inferred from my post. I wasn't pontificating about the -190 folks and their pay. The -190 folks that I know seem to get defensive when asked about how things are and say 'I knew what I was getting myself into'. I guess it's human nature when trying to justify a difficult personal decison that hasn't panned out exactly as planned. I never went to any of those 'propaganda' sessions prior to the -190 bid, but if I had I would've been VERY careful about considering supposed future pay increases. There's an interesting thread on bp.com that talks about 320 FO pay vs. 190 CA pay. Interesting indeed.

Oh yeah, that hotel is going to be sweet! Perhaps the -190 FO's can sign up for RA duty to make a little extra coinage. I keeeeed, I keeeeed.

"The man"? "They"? Was it one or many? The risk vs reward at Virgin? Come on. The risk and reward at jb may be considerable, but at least the risk at jb is backed by 6 years of ACTUAL FLYING.

I have heard of most UA guys bypassing recall btw, with the only takers being those that are senior enuff to hold a plane and base in their home. Others are waiting to see if the "reward" gets better. Hopefully it will.

Edit: I forgot to take a potshot at bluepilots.com. That site sucks. Actually, it BLOWS. The administrator is not a fan of free speech. I lasted a week.

An interesting thread on bp.com? Is it about the leg shaving booth at Tailhook? No ... then I'll pass.

 

[JP4user]

You are such a giver. And as for reinventing the wheel, you are wrong sir. While we may have received millions of dollars of free advertising for "reinventing the sideways-turned nosewheel" -- as far as I know we were not the first airline to think that one up.

Ha. I say.

(still trying to understand your english in that last sentence)

What does your questionable maintenance and the idiotic crew hotel have in common with this discussion? Sparky, the reinventing the wheel comment was about regurgitating an idea that Braniff tried once and failed miserably at.

Boy you blue boys sure get uptight easy. Like I have said before.....I am thrilled to see you blowing cash on this hotel.

 

[IB6 UB9]

What does your questionable maintenance and the idiotic crew hotel have in common with this discussion? Sparky, the reinventing the wheel comment was about regurgitating an idea that Braniff tried once and failed miserably at.

Boy you blue boys sure get uptight easy. Like I have said before.....I am thrilled to see you blowing cash on this hotel.

I'm about the last person to get uptight, but I am curious as to why you are so thrilled. Can you elaborate?

 

[Ifly101]

.....I am thrilled to see you blowing

Hey,

we have something incommon--I'm thrilled to see you blowing too.

 

[Bavarian Chef]

What does your questionable maintenance and the idiotic crew hotel have in common with this discussion? Sparky, the reinventing the wheel comment was about regurgitating an idea that Braniff tried once and failed miserably at.

Boy you blue boys sure get uptight easy. Like I have said before.....I am thrilled to see you blowing cash on this hotel.

Okay, it's obvious you don't see my humor. I'll give you that. As for our questionable maintenance ... any examples? BTW, who do you work for? Can't tell from your illustrious profile.

As for burning through cash, I GOT IT THE FIRST TIME.

Sparky? Here Sparky? Anyone seen my Sparky?

 

[JP4user]

Hey,

we have something incommon--I'm thrilled to see you blowing too.

Such maturity. Alas though you'll have to satisfy your homosexual cravings elsewhere as you have mistaken my choice of genders.

 

[JP4user]

Okay, it's obvious you don't see my humor. I'll give you that. As for our questionable maintenance ... any examples? BTW, who do you work for? Can't tell from your illustrious profile.

As for burning through cash, I GOT IT THE FIRST TIME.

Sparky? Here Sparky? Anyone seen my Sparky?

If you weren't so defensive on this thread, I wonder from your illustrious profile if someone could guess your employer?

Maintenance.....Yes or no...did JB comply with the Airbus service bulletins about the seal in the airbus nose gear? It was not the first time this event happened to you correct? But the first time did not get you the "millions in free advertising.

But back to your crew hotel. Are you not concerned you that this was tried in the past and was a huge financial failure and the crews absolutely hated the place?

 

[JP4user]

I'm about the last person to get uptight, but I am curious as to why you are so thrilled. Can you elaborate?

Pushing for new far duty and flight time limits and 190 pay rates come to the top of my head. But you won't see me get as beligerent as some on here. I am convinced that the whole blue thing is going to collapse in time.

Is it true your belf is now up to 93%?

 

[JBPA]

"The man"? "They"? Was it one or many? The risk vs reward at Virgin? Come on. The risk and reward at jb may be considerable, but at least the risk at jb is backed by 6 years of ACTUAL FLYING.

I have heard of most UA guys bypassing recall btw, with the only takers being those that are senior enuff to hold a plane and base in their home. Others are waiting to see if the "reward" gets better. Hopefully it will.

Edit: I forgot to take a potshot at bluepilots.com. That site sucks. Actually, it BLOWS. The administrator is not a fan of free speech. I lasted a week.

An interesting thread on bp.com? Is it about the leg shaving booth at Tailhook? No ... then I'll pass.

"The man" = the dude I was flying with who told me about dudes interested in VA.

"They" = said dudes interested in VA. According to "The Man" it was many. Like I've already stated, that's what "The Man" told me (I was kinda dumbfounded myself).

Did JB have 6 years of flying experience when the first classes started? If I remember correctly, they (we) didn't even have a jet yet. I thought my post clearly referenced the assumed risk of the folks whom started here '99-'00 when everyone else was hiring like gangbusters (granted some of 'em are freakish and might not have done well at a major interview - sorry, it's true). Likewise, if someone left a job here for VA they would likely be accepting the increased risk of a new LCC for the potential rewards of lucrative stock options and rock-star bidding status. C'mon man, you're smarter than that.

I didn't think that the rules of free speech applied to a private internet forum which certain terms and conditions are agreed to in exchange for access/participation. Didn't read them? Too many big words? I guess it would be okay to say, log in to BP an post racist comments? Free speech and all right?. Maybe you should complain to the ACLU.

I'll admit there's some foolish threads on BP.com. I personally haven't seen any examples of someone's 'right to free internet speech/writings on a private internet forum' impinged. But I'm just a lurker there. I told someone a while back who was too chicken sheeyat to log in that wasting your time here trying to convert naysayers into bluebots is futile. I'd much rather read the rantings of my peers without having to sort through the chaff and flame on this site. Plus, it's nice to not air our dirty laundry to the world. But you keep doing your schtick.

edit: Lasted a week? Were you the dude with the bonny-loves-you-know-what screename? Perhaps we need an age verification too so as not to upset the 5th grade posters who left in tizzies.

 

[Bavarian Chef]

If you weren't so defensive on this thread, I wonder from your illustrious profile if someone could guess your employer?

Maintenance.....Yes or no...did JB comply with the Airbus service bulletins about the seal in the airbus nose gear? It was not the first time this event happened to you correct? But the first time did not get you the "millions in free advertising.

But back to your crew hotel. Are you not concerned you that this was tried in the past and was a huge financial failure and the crews absolutely hated the place?

My profile is what it is. I work for jb. I post about jb. I make it clear in my posts I work for jb. Who do you work for?

Airbus seals? Don't know. Will find out.

Hotel? No I am not concerned.

 

[Bavarian Chef]

Pushing for new far duty and flight time limits and 190 pay rates come to the top of my head. But you won't see me get as beligerent as some on here. I am convinced that the whole blue thing is going to collapse in time.

Is it true your belf is now up to 93%?

FAR duty limit? I am against the change.
Flight time limit? I am against the change.
190 pay rates? Too low.

You can't assume all jb pilots are behind any of these ideas/decisions.

When you are losing money I think the belf is 110%.

 

[Bavarian Chef]

"The man" = the dude I was flying with who told me about dudes interested in VA.

"They" = said dudes interested in VA. According to "The Man" it was many. Like I've already stated, that's what "The Man" told me (I was kinda dumbfounded myself).

Did JB have 6 years of flying experience when the first classes started? If I remember correctly, they (we) didn't even have a jet yet. I thought my post clearly referenced the assumed risk of the folks whom started here '99-'00 when everyone else was hiring like gangbusters (granted some of 'em are freakish and might not have done well at a major interview - sorry, it's true). Likewise, if someone left a job here for VA they would likely be accepting the increased risk of a new LCC for the potential rewards of lucrative stock options and rock-star bidding status. C'mon man, you're smarter than that.

I didn't think that the rules of free speech applied to a private internet forum which certain terms and conditions are agreed to in exchange for access/participation. Didn't read them? Too many big words? I guess it would be okay to say, log in to BP an post racist comments? Free speech and all right?. Maybe you should complain to the ACLU.

I'll admit there's some foolish threads on BP.com. I personally haven't seen any examples of someone's 'right to free internet speech/writings on a private internet forum' impinged. But I'm just a lurker there. I told someone a while back who was too chicken sheeyat to log in that wasting your time here trying to convert naysayers into bluebots is futile. I'd much rather read the rantings of my peers without having to sort through the chaff and flame on this site. Plus, it's nice to not air our dirty laundry to the world. But you keep doing your schtick.

edit: Lasted a week? Were you the dude with the bonny-loves-you-know-what screename? Perhaps we need an age verification too so as not to upset the 5th grade posters who left in tizzies.

I'll give you the point about jb in its first year, but times are different and Virgin is starting an admittedly tough road during times of high fuel prices, uncertainty in Iran/Iraq and leaner/meaner legacies with lower cost structures. Add to that a SFO base and barely profitable transcon routes (don't we know that) and I think Virgin is a huge risk compared to us. BUT -- to be a rock star bidder? Sign me up.

As for bp.com, no ain't me. But I know that pilot. Still on, no time to lurk. Too much schtick to ply on this board.

 

[JBPA]

I'll give you the point about jb in its first year, but times are different and Virgin is starting an admittedly tough road during times of high fuel prices, uncertainty in Iran/Iraq and leaner/meaner legacies with lower cost structures. Add to that a SFO base and barely profitable transcon routes (don't we know that) and I think Virgin is a huge risk compared to us. BUT -- to be a rock star bidder? Sign me up.

Valid points. As we all know, NOTHING is certain in this f'd up industry anymore. VA + huge hurdles/huge risk = (maybe possibly) big rewards. That's all I was saying. And if folks decide to leave I hope they're senior to me.

Back to the thread. Perhaps we can convince the brewers of Blue Moon Belgian Ale to be the official beer of the all-inclusive crew hotel. Or are you more of a 'Blue Crush' wine cooler dude(ette).

 

[Bavarian Chef]

Valid points. As we all know, NOTHING is certain in this f'd up industry anymore. VA + huge hurdles/huge risk = (maybe possibly) big rewards. That's all I was saying. And if folks decide to leave I hope they're senior to me.

Back to the thread. Perhaps we can convince the brewers of Blue Moon Belgian Ale to be the official beer of the all-inclusive crew hotel. Or are you more of a 'Blue Crush' wine cooler dude(ette).

It's funny you say that. After I posted my last one, I had to look up what this thread was about. Someone could start a thread about munchies mix and it would deteriorate into "I am convinced that the whole blue thing is going to collapse in time."

I am thinking a Maker's Mark sponsorship. Or Jack Daniels. Beer don't cut it anymore.

 

[Blue Dude]

Maintenance.....Yes or no...did JB comply with the Airbus service bulletins about the seal in the airbus nose gear? It was not the first time this event happened to you correct? But the first time did not get you the "millions in free advertising.

But back to your crew hotel. Are you not concerned you that this was tried in the past and was a huge financial failure and the crews absolutely hated the place?

Yes, the seal SB was complied with. The JB 292 failure was an unrelated problem.

No, not concerned. I don't know any of the specifics of how Braniff was running or financing their crew hotel 25+ years ago, and I suspect you don't either. Almost all of JB's training is concentrated in one place and it makes sense to arrange for a long term solution rather than rely on short term contracts.

 

[B6Driver]

Why do you even answer this obvious basher of JB?