Average IOE times at Mesaba

[mrflier]

Quick question about Avro IOE for new-hires: Do most people get the sign-off in the 25 hours or does it usually take longer? If so, what's the max time usually allowed? Thanks in advance.

 

[Workin'Stiff]

I haven't heard of too many getting extended much longer... However, I couldn't tell ya what the average time is either...

 

[IHaveAPension]

Definately does NOT sound like UAL back in the good ole days. I've heard from some of their pilots of the "minority" newhires getting upwards of 50-100 hrs of IOE!!!

 

[tk855]

I personally know of a few situations where Horizon has given people 65+ hours of ioe on the CR7, and not all of them were "minority" new hires, just most of them!

 

[keith]

Average IOE times

I believe most people are signed off at appx. 25 hrs. Some, however, complete IOE with more time due to maintenance delays,etc. They end up flying another trip to get the hours. At least thats what happened to me and a few others from my class.

-Keith

 

[Dodge]

25 hours is about the average. We had one about a year ago that had 70+ and they still wouldn't sign her off or can her. She eventually was let go, and then promptly sued. It is extremely rare for a male to have more than 30 hours of IOE at Mesaba.

 

[flap operator]

25-ish sounds about right... I had to do a 4 day follwed by a day trip and was signed of with 25:02. It was all out of DTW, except for the last leg, operating out of the old terminal with lots of ground delays. Ahhh... memories... anybody else miss hte golfcourse? Ha! Didn't think so.

FO

 

[Jimdandy]

thats a BS story Dodge

What was her name - let me guess you heard that from your buddy in the training dept.

 

[fly4ever]

Dodge,

You are full of it.

On those occasions when more time is needed it has been given to far more men than women because there are still far more men employed at Mesaba. The percentage argument doesn't hold water here either so don't even bother.

The problems mostly surface with those that have come out of ab intio accelerated programs where the pilot candidate has little or no experience with IMC flying and very little experience at the actual controls of a twin as opposed to having been an instructor or a ride along. The man/woman excuse doesn't enter into the picture.

Mesaba is a good company to work for and they give everyone a fair shot when it comes to training. Don't start making an issue out of something that isn't an issue.

 

[Whoop Whoop]

It also comes down to what kind of flying you do during IOE (what kind of trip your IOE Captain was scheduled for- and you end up flying)...

It has been fairly true, that if you have your "stuff" together, regardless of the type of IOE trip(s), you would get signed off very close to the 25 hour minimum.

That being said, it is very possible to get paired with a senior IOE Captain who is only scheduled for long legs throughout the trip, i.e. MSP-HPN, MSP-SLC, etc., in which case you don't get a lot of experience with tons of approaches and landings if you only do 2-3 of them a day for however many days.

The best possible is that you get a fairly productive trip- 4-6 legs a day. It's a lot of work, but you sure get lots of experience and it shows when you begin your green line.

Whatever kind of flying you end up with, don't sweat it. Take as much IOE as you feel necessary (if you need to go past the 25 hours). Mesaba is a great company (just experiencing a few growing pains right now), and wants you to succeed.

Good Luck!

Whoop Whoop

 

[Dodge]

thats a BS story Dodge

What was her name - let me guess you heard that from your buddy in the training dept.

I was pulled from a 4 day trip as I was flying with an OE instructor last May. He told me he had already done a 4 day with this student and did not sign her off. She flew with more instructors and they didn't sign her off either. I was put back on the trip the next day. When asked if he signed her off this time, he just shook his head.

Don't tell me what I know or don't know. I am now calling you a liar because you weren't in the cockpit with us. I don't know her name, but I'll do some research and see if I can't find it to post on here, since you want to know.

 

[Workin'Stiff]

Nah, lets keep it professional fellas... We all don't need names to prove anything. Give the guy, Dodge in this case, the benefit of the doubt. He's correct in saying that maybe he was the cockpit when the conversation occured... So, lets leave it at that... And let's grab the beer!?!?!

 

[Dodge]

Got my beer and I found the name but better judgment and being a decent person prevents me from posting it.

 

[Workin'Stiff]

Good man.... And I crack open another....

 

[Jimdandy]

Yea lets grab a beer.

But dodge still needs a talking to......

As a captain with over 5000 hours PIC I have flow with my fair share of men and women pilots and do not see any direct correlation to performance and sex.

Dodge you better hope I don't find out who you are or you'll find a foot up your rear. Mesaba is a classy operation and we are on a higher plane than the comments you made.

 

[Workin'Stiff]

Yeah... We all have our "open mouth, insert foot moments." Just didn't wanna see someones name on a public forum. Bad pilot or not, they don't deserve that... And yes, we do have a classy operation at XJ. So let's keep it that way...

 

[Towelie]

Dodge is correct... too a point.

That story is mostly true. However, don't make it a female vs. male thing. We have canned far more men in training then women. We also have some very strong female pilots who can out fly most men any day of the week.

The story you said had extenuating circumstances and let's just leave it at that.

Average time on IOE is about 25 hours, the way it is suppossed to be.

 

[Dodge]

Yea lets grab a beer.

But dodge still needs a talking to......

As a captain with over 5000 hours PIC I have flow with my fair share of men and women pilots and do not see any direct correlation to performance and sex.

Dodge you better hope I don't find out who you are or you'll find a foot up your rear. Mesaba is a classy operation and we are on a higher plane than the comments you made.

I have flown with good and weak pilots of both sexes, in both seats. Thanks for calling me a liar, Mr. Class. And I'll be looking for ya. Come on down to MEM sometime.

 

[Regional4life]

Got my beer and I found the name but better judgment and being a decent person prevents me from posting it.

Apparantly, having better judgement and being a decent person allows you to be a sexist asshole with no basis for your opinion. True, there are stories of excess OE, but there are valid reasons behind all those, none of which has anything to do with male vs. female. All those guys in the training department bust their tails to make this a safe operation and I trust each one of them for their judgement. Mesaba is a great place to work with quality people and pilots, of both sexes. And I'm sure you were friends enough with her to let her tell you all about her lawsuit, or wait, maybe you also got a buddy in legal telling you all about it. Curious, do you walk around jingling change in your pocket all day too?

 

[SouthTex]

Please don't confuse him with me. My liver can't take it.

 

[Dodge]

Everyone is right. I should have worded things differently. Doesn't matter if it was a male or female, just a pilot same as the next. Anyone can need 50 hours of OE if the circumastances are correct. My apologies to all Mesaba pilots

 

[flap operator]

Whoop Whoop - how are we experiencing growing pains when we haven't started growing yet? We have infastructure in place in all departments with good technology and seem to be hiring in the right areas to help facilitate our coming growth. Hopefully we don't end up with growing pains... again.


FO

 

[fly4ever]

Dodge,

With your acknowledgement above you have shown why Mesaba is a good place to work. Our pilot list is made up of good people (99%) who own up to the fact that we make mistakes or "put our foot in it" from time to time. We are all entitled to our opinions but some are better left unsaid for the good of the pilot group.

Thanks,

Fly

 

[Regional4life]

Everyone is right. I should have worded things differently. Doesn't matter if it was a male or female, just a pilot same as the next. Anyone can need 50 hours of OE if the circumastances are correct. My apologies to all Mesaba pilots

This right here shows that you do have better judgement and are a decent person. Thanks for stepping up to the plate.

 

[Rekks Inbound]

I would be willing to bet that the percentage of female or minority pilots that require 'remedial' or additional training is NO different than that of white male pilots. Flown with all types, can tell you ther are some that were awesome to fly with, and some that made you think you were single pilot. Most were guys, some were others, but again, the percentage is exactly the same.

Rekks