ATP and Dual Received

[maverick_fp00]

A friend of mine is getting his ATP in a few months. I know that when he receives his ATP, he can give dual given in the airplane he is trained in - but does this mean the airplane he does his ATP training in, or any plane he has training in? (such as, Navajo training or C-421 training from Simcom). Also, if he can give dual recieved in the Navajo or 421, can the person logging dual received also log actual instrument if he given that he does not hold an instrument ticket?

Thanks

 

[ClassG]

OK, I'm sure someone's gonna tear me up for this, but here's how I understand it:

An ATP may give dual flight instruction in an aircraft in which they are TYPE RATED, not just Rated. If the aircraft does not require a Type Rating to be operated PIC, the you may give dual flight instruction only if you are a certified flight instructor in that type aircraft : ie, MEI - Instrument.

Been wrong before, though.

 

[boxcar]

I'm not sure where you guys are coming from. But, on the odd chance you're serious, I'll bite!

An ATP not holding a CFI certificate can provide flight instruction to pilots in air transportation service. You can look it up, but air transportation service means a Part 121 or Part 135 airline that engages in interstate air commerce. The bottom line is that a properly rated ATP can instruct in a Part 121 or Part 135 air carrier training program without holding a CFI certificate.

An ATP not holding a CFI certificate cannot legally provide flight instruction in general aviation regardless of the type of aircraft.

 

[Flymach2]

Hi...

Here's a section of the FAR's that may be of interest.

§ 61.167 Privileges.

(a) A person who holds an airline transport pilot certificate is entitled to the same privileges as those afforded a person who holds a commercial pilot certificate with an instrument rating.

(b) An airline transport pilot may instruct --

(1) Other pilots in air transportation service in aircraft of the category, class, and type, as applicable, for which the airline transport pilot is rated and endorse the logbook or other training record of the person to whom training has been given;

(2) In flight simulators, and flight training devices representing the aircraft referenced in paragraph (b)(1) of this section, when instructing under the provisions of this section and endorse the logbook or other training record of the person to whom training has been given;

(3) Only as provided in this section, unless the airline transport pilot also holds a flight instructor certificate, in which case the holder may exercise the instructor privileges of subpart H of part 61 for which he or she is rated; and

(4) In an aircraft, only if the aircraft has functioning dual controls, when instructing under the provisions of this section.

(c) Excluding briefings and debriefings, an airline transport pilot may not instruct in aircraft, flight simulators, and flight training devices under this section --

(1) For more than 8 hours in any 24-consecutive-hour period; or

(2) For more than 36 hours in any 7-consecutive-day period.

(d) An airline transport pilot may not instruct in Category II or Category III operations unless he or she has been trained and successfully tested under Category II or Category III operations, as applicable.

Regards

 

[ClassG]

Yeah, See, Just like I said:

Exactly like it reads in 61.167.

I'll relinquish my gold seal now.

 

[501261]

I'll make it simple, an ATP can only instruct if s/he has been designated an instructor/or check airman for his 135 or 121 certificate and then he can only instruct for his operation.

Class G, type ratings have nothing to do with it. An ATP can give instruction in a C402 or BE200 under 121 or 135 without a CFI, however they can only give instruction if they have been designated as an instructor by their certificate holder, and are actually giving instruction for that certificate (i.e. he can't give instruction in a C402 that somebody rented from an FBO, s/he can only instuct if he's training a new hire, or something for the certificate!)

 

[skydiverdriver]

Actually, you don't have to be a designated check airman or sim instructor. All captains are considered to be training their FO's, while doing normal airline flying. In fact, the FAA used to renew airline captain's CFI certificates for this reason alone, although I don't believe they still do.

 

[bobbysamd]

ATP CFI renewals

Originally posted by skydiverdriver
In fact, the FAA used to renew airline captain's CFI certificates for this reason alone, although I don't believe they still do.

I think it depends on the individual fed and the circumstances. Have an 8710 complete and in your flight case. Let's say you're line checked. Assuming it went fine, I've understood that if you approach the fed respectfully that he/she will renew your CFI. Also if you go for your ATP and/or type with your company.

 

[boxcar]

Actually, you don't have to be a designated check airman or sim instructor. All captains are considered to be training their FO's, while doing normal airline flying. In fact, the FAA used to renew airline captain's CFI certificates for this reason alone, although I don't believe they still do.

Be very careful mentioning training and revenue flying in the same breath! Actually, pilot training isn't ever supposed to be conducted during revenue flights. Every pilot is supposed to be completely trained and checked before his/her first line flight. Even IOE isn't considered training, it's gaining "operating experience". Some of this is obviously a play on words, but it really could be a big deal in some circumstances.