ATI/Cappy Customer loss

[shooter]

I'm sorry to hear this. I know many of you have just went through this from KILN.

Any word if DB S will use DHL as their sort/uplift provider and deploy you guys in the DHL system?



http://www.aircargoworld.com/Air-Ca...ker-halts-dedicated-service-to-americas/22792



I'm hoping the best for you all.

.

 

[DA10]

Sadly, there are a number of ex-Astar and ABX guys that went to ATI after the DHL fiasco. Now they may be looking at round 2.

 

[WYOMINGPILOT]

At one time DBS (Schenker) was evaluating using another shared partner like DHL but I think the statement now reads a complete withdrawal from the contracted air delivery services and moving to expedited ground services. I think about 75% of the ATI business is dedicated to DBS so obviously not good news to flight crews. Capital Air Cargo (Cappy)has all of their 727s dedicated to the DBS network but Capital also has some 757s flying DHL freight. Sad news, Best of Luck to all those impacted.

 

[Fly Astar Jets]

... I think about 75% of the ATI business is dedicated to DBS so obviously not good news to flight crews.

While the BAX side of the house looks pretty big, I've been told it's less than half of our total biz. Between the Combi, ad hoc, and 767 ops., I believe it. Doesn't mean there won't be any pain though. And unfortunately I'll be collecting another furlough number. At least this one will mean something.

On the bright side, my resume bull$hit skills up to snuff.

Good luck to all.


FAJ

 

[shooter]

While the BAX side of the house looks pretty big, I've been told it's less than half of our total biz. Between the Combi, ad hoc, and 767 ops., I believe it. Doesn't mean there won't be any pain though. And unfortunately I'll be collecting another furlough number. At least this one will mean something.

On the bright side, my resume bull$hit skills up to snuff.

Good luck to all.


FAJ

Don't rule out Hete pulling a rabbit out of the hat yet, FAJ. You may be on the better end of that this time if he does. You may not like him, but he is a really smart guy and knows how to make money unlike a certain guy that thought making french fries by squeezing goo out of a tube is what the customers want.

 

[NJdispatcher]

Hang in there folks , Best of luck to all of you !!! As for Hete pulling a rabbit out of his hat.. yep... suspect the fun has just begun.. so to speak. Gonna get interesting and look forward to Cappy/ATI moving forward.

 

[Jurasicpilot]

Oh this is going to be good..

I bet we'll see four airlines start fighting over KCVG. Welcome to the ATSG whipsaw! Uncle Joe will sit the kids down and say "Ok, How low can you go"

Did ATI ever get a contract, heard they voted a TA down. I figured they would have had a second come pretty quick. Whats it been 8yrs in negotiations?

 

[shooter]

Oh this is going to be good..

I bet we'll see four airlines start fighting over KCVG. Welcome to the ATSG whipsaw! Uncle Joe will sit the kids down and say "Ok, How low can you go"

Did ATI ever get a contract, heard they voted a TA down. I figured they would have had a second come pretty quick. Whats it been 8yrs in negotiations?

Honestly, it is more than four. Since DHL has a lease on the aircraft, I doubt they care who flys them as long as they do fly them. So DHL can peddle the 767's to any 767/757 operator out there. What DHL does like is the service ABX pilots have provided. So as long as everyone does their job well there should be no reason to risk putting that into some unknown. If they want to start pinching pennies is another thing however. Quality has a price and I think most would agree they would rather the sports car sit unused in the garage than sell it for the price of a pinto. Finding that happy medium is the usual challenge.

EDIT: That is an ABX/ATI/Cappy/Astar issue and not DHL's. If throwing each other under the bus is the norm in the profession, maybe a change in profession is not such a bad thing. Just my personal opinion.

 

[Whistlin' Dan]

Since DHL has a lease on the aircraft, I doubt they care who flys them as long as they do fly them. So DHL can peddle the 767's to any 767/757 operator out there.

Or they can create one, as they did with DHL Airways in the 80's. A fresh-start company brings no union problems, no contracts, no superannuated pilots, no anything. You come in, you work how, when, and where they tell you to work or you're out the door and in steps the next guy. Everybody is at first-year pay and happy to be. Their QOL is entirely dependent upon the quality of their relationship with their employer, and since they don't really "work" for DHL, there is no relationship. Thus, no "quality" in their QOL. Welcome to the new economy!

What DHL does like is the service ABX pilots have provided. So as long as everyone does their job well there should be no reason to risk putting that into some unknown. If they want to start pinching pennies is another thing however. Quality has a price and I think most would agree they would rather the sports car sit unused in the garage than sell it for the price of a pinto.

You're suggesting that "time" is a fixed asset, like a car. But it is not. In the context of this discussion, time is more like a perishable commodity. It differs in that while a sports car may sit indefinitely in a garage with little diminuition to it's intrinsic value, a person who does not work on a given day loses forever his ability to earn money on that given day. There is a threshold (which varies with personal circumstance, but which is often surprisingly low), above which "working at any price" is better than "not working at all" There are ample numbers of high-time, heavy airplane drivers out there who can, and will, man any sort of start-up operation DHL wants to get into.

EDIT: That is an ABX/ATI/Cappy/Astar issue and not DHL's. If throwing each other under the bus is the norm in the profession, maybe a change in profession is not such a bad thing. Just my personal opinion.

I can't speak to ABX/ATI or Cappy, but "throwing people under the bus" at Astar wasn't just the norm, it was a way of life for many, and a chance at promotion for some. And it cost them. Most have already undergone the "change of profession" you speak of. A few thought they'd dodged the bullet, only to find that "the ball was still in play," at least as far as their careers (and carriers) are concerned. So many mistakes being made...so many opportunities to "do the right thing" overlooked, or rejected outright. You're right...maybe a "change of profession" for some of those people isn't such a bad thing for them or for the business.

 

[shooter]

WDan, each will view their personal impact as their own. I was just saying that having a viable backup plan for ones career is the best position to be in since DHL is just a customer to those involved. There is no operation to negotiate with, no assets, nothing but yourself and work ethic and while that defines ones character, it does nothing for DHL. Do the best you can and hope the casualties are as minimum as possible and work is plentiful.

I don't know if you were working in KILN during the Astar negotiations. If you were, I could get up and see an aircraft turning on Charlie taxiway, go drop a deuce, come back and the same aircraft would still be on Charlie. That was pretty much the last straw for DHL and no carrier can put them in that position again but I don't know if that created the model they now want and have.

It is what it is, best wishes to those involved.

 

[Mach88]

Another German Company withdrawing air service from the US leaving hundreds of people out of work and in Ohio no less. Brings back some old memories and maybe even reopens an wound or two. But no need to sling mud on the old ABX/ Astar story. Too many good guys lost their jobs. And I only blame DHL and DPWN.

Good luck to Cappy and ATI pilots.

 

[shooter]

I'm sorry if it sounded like was ripping open an old wound, that was never my intention Mach. I was just pointing out that negotiation tactics used in the past are no longer viable against DHL. They would just look for another. I was saying it could be argued that is just what they have done, even with 49% ownership.