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ATA rejects changes in airline training....

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Rez O. Lewshun

Save the Profession
Jan 19, 2004
ATA Says FAA Crew Training Proposal Unworkable

Recommends Immediate Creation of ARC to Address Inconsistencies
WASHINGTON, Aug. 11, 2009 – The Air Transport Association of America (ATA), the industry trade organization for the leading U.S. airlines, yesterday filed comments expressing serious and broad concerns about a Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) proposed regulation that would rewrite pilot, flight attendant, flight engineer and dispatcher training requirements. In particular, ATA believes that the proposal could adversely impact current ‘best practice’ training programs – a result neither the FAA nor the industry want to see.​

Instead of proceeding directly to a final rule, ATA recommends that the FAA suspend this rulemaking and immediately convene an Aviation Rulemaking Committee (ARC) to address the many conflicts and inconsistencies identified in the ATA comments.

While the preamble of the notice of proposed rulemaking (NPRM) states laudable goals that ATA fully supports, a careful examination of the details of the proposed regulation reveals numerous unworkable aspects, internal conflicts, conflicts with current advisory material and inaccurate assessments of current industry standard practices.

ATA member airlines take training extremely seriously and believe that any rule changes in this area must yield an improvement over existing regulatory requirements. After spending thousands of hours analyzing the proposed rule, training experts from ATA member airlines unanimously concluded that the proposed rule contains substantial and material inconsistencies that make it logistically impossible to implement. Furthermore, the proposal seems to abandon the advancements in pilot training programs that have been instrumental in improving airline safety.

While we appreciate the FAA’s desire to quickly adopt new training rules, we believe that the rule as proposed could set the safety clock back by more than a decade,” said ATA President and CEO James C. May.

For example, the Advanced Qualification Program (AQP) enables operators to customize their crew training programs based on real-world operating environments. ATA believes that the FAA proposal fails to recognize the value in this and other innovative, data-driven approaches.
ATA airline members and their affiliates transport more than 90 percent of all U.S. passenger and cargo traffic. For additional industry information, visit www.airlines.org.

Here are the ATA member airlines... (the company's that use the money we generate to lobby congress, who at times work against us...)

ATA Airline Members

ABX Air, Inc. (GB) Federal Express Corporation (FX) AirTran Airways (FL)Hawaiian Airlines (HA) Alaska Airlines, Inc. (AS)JetBlue Airways Corp. (B6) American Airlines, Inc. (AA) Midwest Airlines (YX) ASTAR Air Cargo, Inc. (ER) Southwest Airlines Co. (WN) Atlas Air, Inc. (5Y) United Airlines, Inc. (UA)Continental Airlines, Inc. (CO)UPS Airlines (5X) Delta Air Lines, Inc. (DL)US Airways, Inc. (US)Evergreen International Airlines, Inc. (EZ)
Associate Airline Members

Air Canada (AC)Mexicana (MX)Air Jamaica Ltd. (JM)

New training must be costing them more money. That's all that matters to them. I hate fcking politicians.
New training must be costing them more money. That's all that matters to them. I hate fcking politicians.

Politics is how the methods of democracy gets done... why hate it? The problem with our politics is we leave a small group to do the work of so many....

The ATA is lobbying the politicans.... the intent of posting the article was to show who doesn't have pilots interests..... that would be our airlines...

At times, the ATA and ALPA are in agreement... at times they are not...
Most govt. mandated training is a waste of time...I've had 4 days of recurrent training that had very little value. Half of it was FAA mandated training that did nothing for safety...

I just had to do FAA mandated stall training as a result of the recent incidents...It included stalling the airplane at 370 to duplicate the PCL crash, and stalling the airplane on approach, but not recovering until the pusher activated. The latter was to duplicate Colgan....How about we just don't get ourselves in those situations...

Sorry...not a big fan of more govt. mandated training....let's just make the requirements tougher to start with...
Here is an example of ALPA working with the ATA... it si not black and white... allies on one issue can be adversaries on another...

U.S. Department of Transportation Reverses Bush-Era Decision on Cabotage
ALPA scores advocacy hat trick, protects your flyingAugust 12, 2009 After months of ALPA’s efforts in lobbying and educating U.S. regulators about the negative effect of cabotage, the Department of Transportation on Monday reversed a decision made last year by the Bush administration that allowed a series of charter flights by Air Canada to provide transportation for the National Hockey League’s Boston Bruins during the 2008–2009 season. That decision opened the door to additional contracts the carrier has secured since with the Milwaukee Bucks and the St. Louis Blues.
“When it comes to fighting cabotage, ALPA scored a hat trick with this DOT decision,” said Capt. Paul Rice, ALPA’s first vice president. “After basically getting stonewalled by the Bush administration, we kept in the game by engaging the new administration on this issue, and working with the AFL-CIO and the TTD, as well as the major U.S. airline trade associations—ATA and NACA—to put a stop to this blatant violation of the U.S. code.”
The department’s investigation into this matter found that Air Canada carried cabotage traffic on these charter operations, concluding that in light of “the inherently variable nature of a sports team’s personnel during a season, there appears to be no practical means to ensure that there would not be carriage of U.S. domestic-only traffic during any season-long contract.” The letter, which DOT sent to Air Canada’s regulatory lawyer on Monday, went on to state: “We do not see any way in which Air Canada can continue to market and operate season-long charter contracts in the future for sports teams,” and advises the carrier “to take steps to cancel any such current contracts.”
ALPA began to work on overturning DOT’s decision to permit Air Canada to carry the Bruins immediately after the department issued it last year. ALPA then teamed up with industry partners to build the argument for the DOT that the charter flights—which at one point included 18 consecutive segments between U.S. cities over a two month period—directly violated U.S. Code Title 49. The Association also engaged congressmen, including Rep. James Oberstar (D-Minn.), who urged the DOT to revisit its decision on this matter.
“ALPA brought it to the Obama administration’s attention, and the DOT started an investigation,” Rice said. “While the investigation is still under way, this letter proves that we were right. It shows how your union protects your flying and works to reverse bad decisions that could set devastating precedents for undermining laws that every country and every airline should adhere to and respect.”

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