ATA or USAir--Which one would you rather work for?

[TWA Dude]

Correct me if I am wrong, I heard the AWA pool no longer exists ...

Two weeks ago the AWA MEC chairman stated that the pool was no more. Nobody asked him his source. If I had to guess I'd say the best the poolies could hope for when the time comes is for a preferntial interview. Sorry.

 

[aroundtheblock]

I thought of waiting til AAA got things running right, but with the MEC message last night, I think I'm amking the right decision.

 

[Formula1]

What did the MEC have to say in his message last night?

 

[bestpilot]

ATA has some cool cats.. USAWAIRWAYS has some cool cats.

Duude, SWA/FO be right!! Both them dudes always done treated me REEELL Good!

It's just like if we coulds like get a company and like be havvin all da cool pilots there, dat would be freaking awesome!

Who could do that??????

Maybe dem Flightinfo Moderators?

Naw, I got it, ole Einstein is like da smartest cat on Flightinfo. After all, dude invented da lightbulb or somethin like dat, so he could like be gettin all da cool pilots together. Einstein for SUUUUPER MODERATOR!!!!!


AWWWWW YEAAAAAHHH!!!!

 

[joevollers]

Not trying to put down America West. But I've got all kinds of questions about the America West/USAir merger. There seems to be a lot of issues to resolve with the merger and some I'm sure I am not even aware of.



I still can't believe ATA continues to shrink. Word from some ATA folks that they would leave if given the opportunity tells me the light is not yet shining down the tunnel like I thought it was.

OK I'll bite

I work for for AWA/ usair... I could tell you the positives and why I think my airline is better... yada yada yada.. But, to be fair.. I am not all that familiar with ATA. So, I can only compare what I do KNOW equally about both of them. That is one is recalling and the other is furloughing...no brainer.

 

[Swaayze]

I'm an early 99 Airways Hire. Been doing a lot of different things since my 2002 furlough. I'll probably go back if things seem to be heading in the right direction. I have a decent position right now, but it's not a long term gig....

Ditto, barring the invitation to work at a good local corporate gig.


BTW, I'm 7/5/99, MetroJet too...do I know you aroundtheblock?

 

[Crzipilot]

Was hired 6/21/99 going back, maybe, someday.....

 

[FlyBoeingJets]

What a turn around we have seen at USAir. After another round of BK and financing the ship seems to finally have turned around.

I see the same at ATA. But with SWA codeshare, going private and a smaller size I see a much more robust capacity for growth and Captain upgrades. Unfortunately, the time from here to there may be unbearably long. The value of new hiring now at USAir makes that job look better.


3 years ago we thought USAir wouldn't get to the present. 3 years from now we may see ATA an aggressive international carrier, maybe sooner.

 

[Green]

I see the same at ATA. But with SWA codeshare, going private and a smaller size I see a much more robust capacity for growth and Captain upgrades. Unfortunately, the time from here to there may be unbearably long.

Well Us Airways has 57 E190's on order with options for 50 more as well as 20 or so A-350's on order. Although many of these are replacement aircraft, when you consider the fact that the majority of the company will retire in the next ten years I think your assumption that ATA has a much more robust capacity for Captain upgrades is wrong. my .02.

 

[Pickle]

What are you smoking, FlyBoeingJets?? Because I would like some too!!

I managed to get about 7 months in the left seat at ATA before the bottom fell out, and I will either be furloughed or bottom bit*h by summer, with the time frame back to the left seat, oh, about the time my 18 month old graduates from college.

These most recently announced furloughs at ATA will hit displaced captains, so we are now in the same position as USAirways, that is to say, an "all captains" airline.

 

[ABOVE ME]

Yeah all the retriements everywhere, especially at CAL sound great until they approve the age 65. Then things come to a screetching halt. You can bet your bottom dollar there aint too many 58/59 year olds that want to leave now. Interesting year as far as that one goes.

 

[HalinTexas]

ATA has no plans for growth or expansion. We are privately held by Mattlin-Patterson. They are only interested in flipping us.

If the military contract gets smaller we could lose many more pilots, since it's 50+% of our business.

I haven't a clue why we're still in business.

 

[FlyBoeingJets]

These most recently announced furloughs at ATA will hit displaced captains, so we are now in the same position as USAirways, that is to say, an "all captains" airline.

Is that because of the Flight Engineers who made FO?

How many retirements coming up at ATA?


I guess I am smoking something. The retirements alone at USAir make a huge impact that is better than growth at similar sized companies.

 

[FlyBoeingJets]

ATA has no plans for growth or expansion. We are privately held by Mattlin-Patterson. They are only interested in flipping us.

If the military contract gets smaller we could lose many more pilots, since it's 50+% of our business.

I haven't a clue why we're still in business.

I can't believe the military flying may be in trouble. I guess the 767s are no longer "around the corner".

 

[Pickle]

Is that because of the Flight Engineers who made FO?

How many retirements coming up at ATA?

FlyBoeingJets, I believe you mean to say "CAPTAIN" instead of "FO". FEFOs were upgrading to captain while other captains were being bumped back to the right seat and FOs were being furloughed.

I think that only about 50 or so FEs made the move to the right seat, and there are about 13 I think who went to the left seat while the downgrades were occuring.

So to some extent, yes, FEs going to FO did result in about 50 FOs being furloughed, but it is kinda messed up here in that all (captains, FOs, and FEs) are on the same seniority list, but there really should be 2 lists, "pilots" and "FEs". That is a whole different issue that will never be fixed though.

There are not all that many retirements coming up here, after a quick look at the seniority list I come up with a rought guess of 16 in 2006, with similar numbers for 2007 and 2008.

 

[RGPilot]

From what I understand, the E190's at USAirways is additional aircraft and not replacements, per Doug Parker

 

[Green]

yeah but couldn't that all change two years from now if Doug decides the 737's are no longer needed? I don't remember if the transition agreement addresses that issue or not. Hopefully the 190's will remain a growth aircraft.

 

[vetrider]

If I had a nickel for every numbnut cluelessly making the blanket statement that 190s are going to replace the 37 I could retire wealthy.

 

[capt. megadeth]

Are guys hired in 95 still capts?

Also, do you guy have pilots that went straight from FE to Capt?????

What are you smoking, FlyBoeingJets?? Because I would like some too!!

I managed to get about 7 months in the left seat at ATA before the bottom fell out, and I will either be furloughed or bottom bit*h by summer, with the time frame back to the left seat, oh, about the time my 18 month old graduates from college.

These most recently announced furloughs at ATA will hit displaced captains, so we are now in the same position as USAirways, that is to say, an "all captains" airline.

 

[TWA Dude]

yeah but couldn't that all change two years from now if Doug decides the 737's are no longer needed? I don't remember if the transition agreement addresses that issue or not. Hopefully the 190's will remain a growth aircraft.

The Transistion Agreement will be replaced by a new CBA by Spring 2007 or sooner (when the arbitrator issues the combined seniority list). The E190 is a growth aircraft whether 737s stay or not.

 

[Green]

If I had a nickel for every numbnut cluelessly making the blanket statement that 190s are going to replace the 37 I could retire wealthy.

who has made a blanket statement to that effect??? Certainly not I. I did however bring up the possiblility of Doug retiring more aircraft than originally thought. I think we have seen this happen several times at both AWA and Us Airways. If he does decide to park a few more airframes and reduce domestic capacity I would bet the majority of them would be 737's.

So we are getting 57 190's but depending on what happens to the rest of the fleet that might not equate to as many jobs as anticipated. I was relating to the original intent of the thread which was to determine where there would be more future growth/upgrades, ATA or US Airways.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe Doug has stated that the A-350's are intended to be replacement aircraft.


If I had a nickel for every time some idiot mis-represented a post on this board then I certainly wouldn't be wasting time on this board....lol

 

[apache]

Are guys hired in 95 still capts?

Also, do you guy have pilots that went straight from FE to Capt?????

Let me jump in on some of your action here Death.

What is the DOH of the last active pilot after the latest furlough? I need to know who to screen out on my caller ID of those looking for a job after blowing me off for the last few years.

 

[vetrider]

who has made a blanket statement to that effect??? Certainly not I. I did however bring up the possiblility of Doug retiring more aircraft than originally thought. I think we have seen this happen several times at both AWA and Us Airways. If he does decide to park a few more airframes and reduce domestic capacity I would bet the majority of them would be 737's.

So we are getting 57 190's but depending on what happens to the rest of the fleet that might not equate to as many jobs as anticipated. I was relating to the original intent of the thread which was to determine where there would be more future growth/upgrades, ATA or US Airways.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe Doug has stated that the A-350's are intended to be replacement aircraft.


If I had a nickel for every time some idiot mis-represented a post on this board then I certainly wouldn't be wasting time on this board....lol

Thats a problem with these webboards, its all to easy for idiots like me to call people numbnuts. Numbnuts is a general term I use in casual conversations which doesn't mean anything really, half the time I consider myself a numbnut, but personality quirks don't always come through on the webboards.

I do hear all the time that the 190s are going to replace the 737s. I heard it at a party the other night. And when I said the 190s weren't going to replace the 37 he wouldn't have any of it, he acted as though I was the numbnut burying my head in the sand fooling myself. Who knows, maybe I am fooling myslelf, but I doubt it.

Actually I agree with about everything you just posted. It is true that the 4 extra 37 leases that aren't being renewed will lessen the benefit of the 190 growth aircraft as you say, but that is not the same as wholesale replacement of the fleet. Many people out on the line and so forth don't quiet get that, but you obviously do.

 

[JetMonkey]

The 73's need to go under a very expensive AD in order to be painted with the new livery. Our fearless leader (Dougie) was apprehensive at first (usualy happens here when it comes to money) but now he has decided to go foward with the AD's, point being I don't believe he'd throw all that money down just to keep the 73 fleet for a couple of years.

 

[Pickle]

Are guys hired in 95 still capts?

Also, do you guy have pilots that went straight from FE to Capt?????

capt. megadeth:

95 hires are still captains, for now anyway. The last captain after the most recent downgrades is an early 96 hire. But not to worry, there will be more downgrades coming.

Nobody went straight from FE to captain. They went to the right seat first.

 

[capt. megadeth]

Thanks for the reply pickle. I must have read a post wrong.