ASA ATR drivers whats up???

[JoeMerchant]

JB, I'm sorry but it becomes ever more clear that you are a man with an agenda. Some might say, a personal vendetta. This is not an attack on you, but simply an observation. At least for this observer, the statements and opinions of those bearing an agenda have no relevance whatsoever.

I feel I'm not alone in my belief that this fight is not about ALPA. No, not at all. It is about US, THE PILOTS.

It is about US, THE PILOTS..... unfortunately, we "the pilots" are negotiating separately with management....

While ASA ALPA pilots are negotiating industry leading 700 rates, fellow ALPA carriers are negotiating 700 rates that are lower than our current rates.... this includes our mainline "brothers".....

Your absolutely right that I have an agenda..... as does every other ALPA pilot.... that is looking out for themselves.... it isn't personal as you have indicated, rather it is business.....

 

[JoeMerchant]

John, I'm really dissapointed in you. This has nothing to do with supporting alpa. EVERYONE knows I'm no fan of alpa. This has EVERYTHING to do with supporting you, me and every other pilot and flight attendant at ASA. If alpa isn't going to step up and get this contract done and stop the loss of benefits and oppotunity for us, we MUST. I've been patient (vocal but patient) and have waited for alpa to finish this and they have proven time and time again that they are either unwilling or unable to get it done. Unable is my guess. Its time we, the ASA pilots and flight attendants use whatever we can to force this nonsense to come to an end. You need to get off your f'ed up little high pony and get with the program. da_mn man!

Alan,

Aren't you moving on? There are many issues here and many viewpoints..... all valid.....

I agree that what is currently happening will have an affect.... but at what cost? Currently every seat at ASA is the highest in the DCI system except for 50 seat captain....

Our cnx pay is better than everyone, even the majors....UAL doesn't have CNX pay or duty rigs anymore.....

Should we make more? YES! However we are now faced with competing for flying.... We are competing with Mesa, CHQ, and now even mainline...... Should we be competing? NO......

On a local level, we have made numerous tactical errors from the beginning..... There have been numerous resignments and turnover on the CNC since negotiations began......

I was a leader in the '98 WOE campaign.... I tried to start one in 2001 during the CMR strike but nobody was interested..... The CMR strike was a HUGE loss......

If you or anyone else wants to hear "the other side of the story"..... give me a call...

404-219-4731...... ALPA has put us in this position, and this isn't the answer at this time.....

 

[ohplease!]

yes I am moving on but that doesn't mean I can't smell sh!t when its dropped. Look Jonh, wrong is wrong. period. Alpa can't close the deal and ASA obviously isn't going to do the right thing without pressure.

I may not be here to see this thing trough but I have friends that will. I'm tickled to death that something finally happened to spur enough people into doing something to change the outcome of these f'd up negotiations. Now all we have to do is keep enough people sufficiently pissed off to carry this through to an end.

 

[JoeMerchant]

yes I am moving on but that doesn't mean I can't smell sh!t when its dropped. Look Jonh, wrong is wrong. period. Alpa can't close the deal and ASA obviously isn't going to do the right thing without pressure.

I may not be here to see this thing trough but I have friends that will. I'm tickled to death that something finally happened to spur enough people into doing something to change the outcome of these f'd up negotiations. Now all we have to do is keep enough people sufficiently pissed off to carry this through to an end.

So you don't really care if ASA is around in 5 or 10 years? What if we are replaced by Mesa, CHQ, Pinnacle, Skywest, or mainline? That won't affect you, but it will affect me.... Different perspective don't you think?

ALPA could put a stop to the BS of competing within a brand for flying, but it refuses to even attempt it..... Therefor we are forced to compete..... I don't like it, but it is the result of a failed union...

On a local level, this contract could have been settled years ago, but your local leadership was controlled by BA and he is still on the ALPA payroll.....he too has an agenda....we ALL do......

 

[rumrnr78]

Joe- your job has been moved to the lowest bidder. Sad but true. If you are one of the aged 40 plus with 12+ years seniority and still hanging on you are committing career/earning suicide.
Forget ASA of the past and get out!! The scumbags that are running the company deserve what they get!
Move on and forward my ASA brothers and sisters!!

Cheers- Rum

 

[ohplease!]

So you don't really care if ASA is around in 5 or 10 years? What if we are replaced by Mesa, CHQ, Pinnacle, Skywest, or mainline? That won't affect you, but it will affect me.... Different perspective don't you think?

ALPA could put a stop to the BS of competing within a brand for flying, but it refuses to even attempt it..... Therefor we are forced to compete..... I don't like it, but it is the result of a failed union...

On a local level, this contract could have been settled years ago, but your local leadership was controlled by BA and he is still on the ALPA payroll.....he too has an agenda....we ALL do......

valid points but heres some reality for ya': CHQ, Messa, SKyW already are in ATL and soon to include Pinnacle and ExpJet in ATL! And the mainline alpa undercutting us (and everyone else) just for spite as well as pushing for an errosion of our pass benefits (most probably due to Bobs and others trying to p!ss in their face over the list merger by demanding DOH placement (dumbest thing ever!)).

alpa will never consider regional pilots to be equals to mainline and will never stop the competition within. But its too late in the game for us to change that now. This contract needs to get finished and then alpa needs to be replaced with some entity that will look out for ASA pilots.

The best thing we can do for ourselves at this point in time is get this thing done, get something reasonable and begin to attract new, better, more qualified crews. Everyone is having trouble getting qualified pilots (a couple of airlines have had recruiters outside FSI trying to attract our newhires). There are not enough to go around as it is. I don't know how PNCL is going to come to ATL with 900's (they can't even do all their NWA flying). If this thing was settled and our upgrade dropped to 2 years or less ( its almost there now) along with all the things ALREADY TA'D people (actual qualified people) would tripping over themselves to get to ASA. Which would put another kink in the other regionals "invading" "our turf".

 

[ohplease!]

this has all been a really fun time but My pen and I have to go get some sleep. We have much to do tomorrow. good night, I'll be looking for yo tomorrow.

 

[Long Time Gone]

I don't drink the koolaid from either side.....

BS Joe. You and your blond thing both have an agenda and everyone knows it. Hence the Jackson-5 crap and huge loss. Like I said in another post, if your group weren't on the ballot, it wouldn't have made much of a difference.

Your blond thing sure does like to pow wow with Scott an awful lot for someone else without an agenda.

None of this has anything to do with you, her, ALPA, etc. It's all about the pilots, FAs and mechanics of this company that have been nothing but screwed by management for a long time. Your best friend in the GO wants to advance higher than he is already, and he's willing to screw anyone on the way. 'Ole BL already has. You want unity???? Don't give me or anyone else anymore ALPA speaches until you get off your lazy @ss and showing some support to us.

We're willing to show our support to the rest of our company, and most of the FAs and Mechs are behind us 100%, while you whine more about ALPA. The more you whine, and the less you show your support of us, the more of a GO tool you've become. Your group lost for many reasons. Your blond thing was recalled for a reason. The pilot group has lost respect in you as a former MEC officer, and as a member of the pilot group as it is now, all due to your lack of support for us and more support for the GO.

The unfortunate outcome to this is simple......
Whatever contract does get approved, you'll have a right to it. If it were up to me and many others, you don't deserve it.

 

[pipejockey]

I don't work for ASA but feel the need to encourage you all to continue your very "safety conscious" efforts over there. And who in the blue blazes is this joemerchant wussy? I have read this whole thread and S(He) sounds like a total puss! Y'all need to give this sorry sack of you know what, a blanket party that will make her cry to her mommy and be afraid to show up for work again. It shouldn't be hard from what I've heard.

 

[atrdriver]

Our cnx pay is better than everyone, even the majors....UAL doesn't have CNX pay or duty rigs anymore.....

Well, it isn't better than CAL's. And UAL is working under a concessionary contract, you aren't. They will get their work rules back. Does the fact that they don't have it right now mean that you shouldn't? All the majors are going to fight hard to recover all their concessions. You don't have to agree to a sub standard contract, whether ASA pilots negotiate separate from other DCI carriers or not. The simple fact is, you don't work for DAL, you work for ASA. It doesn't matter who is pulling the strings, ASA signs your check. Unless the law is changed to prevent competing carriers under one umbrella, it isn't going to change, and if you think ALPA is responsible for that you are mistaken.

 

[Tomct]

ATR, Joey argues just to argue. He is the type of schmuck that would argue with you when you told him the sky is blue.

 

[atrdriver]

So you don't really care if ASA is around in 5 or 10 years? What if we are replaced by Mesa, CHQ, Pinnacle, Skywest, or mainline? That won't affect you, but it will affect me.... Different perspective don't you think?

ALPA could put a stop to the BS of competing within a brand for flying, but it refuses to even attempt it..... Therefor we are forced to compete..... I don't like it, but it is the result of a failed union...

Yes Joe, I do care if ASA is around in 5 or 10 years. I still have friends there, including you. But regardless of what type of contract you get, there is no guarantee that the company will be there in 5 to 10 years. And no, ALPA can't put a stop to the BS of competing within a brand. There is no incentive to the companies to end it, so it will not end. Failing an illegal work action by all pilots within the brand at least. A law could change it, but as long as it is legal for the mainline partner to keep several competing carriers for their feed, they will, because it makes good business sense. Yes it sucks to be one of the companies competing, but there's your reason to look elsewhere.

 

[Long Time Gone]

And who in the blue blazes is this joemerchant wussy? I have read this whole thread and S(He) sounds like a total puss!

The explaination to your question comes from previous post of mine......

Actually, what's worse is that this individual is a former MEC officer with us, and so is his live-in (she was recalled). They (she actively, he silently) made a push to become LEC status reps, promising an end to the contract negotiations within 90 days or they would all resign. Our CP unofficially exhibited his approval for this group, and they became known as the "Fab-4". Knowing that he ("Joe") was a "silent partner", the pilot group unofficially renamed them the "Jackson-5", with the belief that they would only sell us out to management for their own benefit, which has always been denied by all of them, including "Joe". Needless to say, they lost BAD. It wouldn't have made much of a difference if they weren't on the ballot, if you get my drift.!

 

[hmmurdock]

It is about US, THE PILOTS..... unfortunately, we "the pilots" are negotiating separately with management....

While ASA ALPA pilots are negotiating industry leading 700 rates, fellow ALPA carriers are negotiating 700 rates that are lower than our current rates.... this includes our mainline "brothers".....

Your absolutely right that I have an agenda..... as does every other ALPA pilot.... that is looking out for themselves.... it isn't personal as you have indicated, rather it is business.....

Greetings..Since regionals fly just over 50% of all domestic flying, what are the odds of others joining in on the HAVOC throughout the industry. This would be true unity and would send a strong message that enough is enough. I think these days it is more about corporate greed and people are sick of it. It must stop and now.

Take care

 

[ASARJMan]

Your blond thing sure does like to pow wow with Scott an awful lot for someone else without an agenda.

Lobbying for a CP position? It's known that SH intends to replace all the current CPs with his posse, and has already started with BS.