I.P. Freley
I like people food
- Joined
- Dec 26, 2001
- Posts
- 2,038
Vic... You're getting mighty excited about this diesel thing, aren't ya??
Before you go blaming the government, the oil companies, the car companies, the Freemasons and whomever else you can think of for the lack of diesels in this country, keep in mind what the very real problems are for diesels here in the US:
1- Relative lack of fueling stations. Maybe not a big deal where YOU live, but not everyone has a wide choice of stations that sell the stinky stuff.
2- Perceptions of diesel cars tainted by those available over the last few decades. Smelly, rattly, clattery, and unreliable. Oh, and SLOW. This is largely GM's fault, as they sold a boatload of diesels in the late 70's that permanently turned people off the idea of diesel cars... Though every other manufacturer must take blame, as well, for the relative lack of user-friendliness in their diesels.
3- Lack of choices. I guess the One World Government Organization hasn't gotten their hands on the Germans! Mercedes offered diesels here for years, but I don't think they offer one anymore due to lack of demand. VW still offers diesel Jettas and possibly Golfs, and is supposed to bring a V10 turbodiesel Touareg this year. Aside from that, as far as CARS go, I can't think of another.
4- Emissions. Like it or not, the particulate emissions of diesels will not pass upcoming EPA tailpipe emissions standards, even if we ever make the switch to low-sulfur diesel here in the USA (which our friends across the pond have had for years). I don't believe any passenger cars with diesel engines can be sold in California (a huge market for the company you already brought up, Mercedes-Benz).
5- Cost. Every diesel-powered car costs more than its gasoline-powered equivalent. You'd have to drive a typical diesel something like 80-120k miles to have your fueling costs offset the higher purchase price of the vehicle to begin with. You use an example of a car that "starts" at over 21000 pounds sterling, which at current exchange rates amounts to *ahem* nearly $42,000. Not the best example of cheap transportation.
6- Did I say SLOW? In almost every case, the diesel cars aren't as fast as the gasoline equivalents. The diesels have great low-end torque compared to a gas engine of equivalent displacement, but no top end... They don't rev as quickly, either, so they're generally not as "fun". You helpfully post the numbers for a 2-liter Benz, and have you considered how SLOW 0-62 in 11.7secs is? In the stoplight drag races, the soccer mom in the Honda Pilot next to you will smoke your a** through the intersection.
Diesels are a good alternative to hybrids if certain technological hurdles can be overcome, if customer perceptions can be changed, if American diesel can be changed to the low-sulfur kind, if the EPA will back off, and if there are more choices to be had.
Too many "ifs" and not enough answers, unfortunately. Hybrids are an idea whose time has come, and hopefully there will be greater choices as the technology matures.
Before you go blaming the government, the oil companies, the car companies, the Freemasons and whomever else you can think of for the lack of diesels in this country, keep in mind what the very real problems are for diesels here in the US:
1- Relative lack of fueling stations. Maybe not a big deal where YOU live, but not everyone has a wide choice of stations that sell the stinky stuff.
2- Perceptions of diesel cars tainted by those available over the last few decades. Smelly, rattly, clattery, and unreliable. Oh, and SLOW. This is largely GM's fault, as they sold a boatload of diesels in the late 70's that permanently turned people off the idea of diesel cars... Though every other manufacturer must take blame, as well, for the relative lack of user-friendliness in their diesels.
3- Lack of choices. I guess the One World Government Organization hasn't gotten their hands on the Germans! Mercedes offered diesels here for years, but I don't think they offer one anymore due to lack of demand. VW still offers diesel Jettas and possibly Golfs, and is supposed to bring a V10 turbodiesel Touareg this year. Aside from that, as far as CARS go, I can't think of another.
4- Emissions. Like it or not, the particulate emissions of diesels will not pass upcoming EPA tailpipe emissions standards, even if we ever make the switch to low-sulfur diesel here in the USA (which our friends across the pond have had for years). I don't believe any passenger cars with diesel engines can be sold in California (a huge market for the company you already brought up, Mercedes-Benz).
5- Cost. Every diesel-powered car costs more than its gasoline-powered equivalent. You'd have to drive a typical diesel something like 80-120k miles to have your fueling costs offset the higher purchase price of the vehicle to begin with. You use an example of a car that "starts" at over 21000 pounds sterling, which at current exchange rates amounts to *ahem* nearly $42,000. Not the best example of cheap transportation.
6- Did I say SLOW? In almost every case, the diesel cars aren't as fast as the gasoline equivalents. The diesels have great low-end torque compared to a gas engine of equivalent displacement, but no top end... They don't rev as quickly, either, so they're generally not as "fun". You helpfully post the numbers for a 2-liter Benz, and have you considered how SLOW 0-62 in 11.7secs is? In the stoplight drag races, the soccer mom in the Honda Pilot next to you will smoke your a** through the intersection.
Diesels are a good alternative to hybrids if certain technological hurdles can be overcome, if customer perceptions can be changed, if American diesel can be changed to the low-sulfur kind, if the EPA will back off, and if there are more choices to be had.
Too many "ifs" and not enough answers, unfortunately. Hybrids are an idea whose time has come, and hopefully there will be greater choices as the technology matures.
