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General Lee

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Joined
Aug 24, 2002
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Ted drops by for a visit
United's new low-fare carrier landed its flagship plane in Orlando on Friday as part of a promotional tour.
By Todd Pack
Sentinel Staff Writer

February 7, 2004

Before flying United to New York, Angela Struffolino got to meet Ted.

"This is beautiful," she said, boarding the flagship plane in Ted's fleet, parked at Gate 40 at Orlando International Airport on Friday as part of a cross-country tour to introduce the brand to employees and passengers.

Ted's Airbus A320 was roomy and bright, and 9-inch flat-panel televisions spaced throughout the cabin played a VH1 show about the pop singer Mandy Moore.

"I love the TVs," Struffolino said.

She asked the plane's captain, "Is this going to be more expensive?"

Just the opposite, he told her.

Ted will be United's low-fare brand, its latest attempt to win back travelers from the likes of Southwest and Orlando-based AirTran, which are gaining market share even as United and other big airlines struggle to pull out of a nearly three-year slump in air travel.

Service will begin Thursday.

Ted's first flights will be between Denver and Fort Lauderdale, Denver and Las Vegas and San Francisco and Las Vegas. It will add service from Orlando to Denver on March 11 and Orlando to Washington Dulles on May 8.

Major airlines such as United often try to match the low fares of the discounters, but their higher costs make it hard for them to make money on those routes.

Ted's lower operating costs should help the brand make money despite its cheaper fares, airline officials said.

United and other full-price airlines have tried that strategy before.

But defunct brands such as United's own Shuttle couldn't fly as cheaply as their low-cost competitors and were among the first business lines cut when air travel fell after the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks.

Ted's vice president said the airline had learned valuable lessons from Shuttle's failure.

"The reason Shuttle ultimately did not work is our costs became too high," Sean Donohue said.

"So, the very first thing we started with when we were building our low-fare operation was a foundation of cost competitiveness," he said.

UAL, which expects to emerge from bankruptcy in mid-2004, has reduced its operating costs $5 billion a year in part by negotiating new contracts with its unions.

It removed the first-class cabins from Ted's A320s so it could put in 18 more economy-class seats, allowing the planes to carry more passengers without significantly increasing operating costs.

And it will change how crews tidy up the planes to reduce time spent at the gate.

Ordinarily, cleaning crews board through the same door as passengers, meaning they can't get on until the last passenger has gotten off. Ted will let crews enter through the rear of the plane so they can start cleaning as the plane empties.

"Once the customer deplanes, we're about done with cleaning the airplane," Donohue said.

"That can save us four, five, six minutes," he said.

Ted's rollout comes nearly a year after Delta introduced Song, a high-style, low-fare airline that flies primarily between cities in the Northeast and vacation spots such as Orlando and Las Vegas.

Earlier this week, Delta chief executive Gerald Grinstein said Song's expansion plans were on hold while the company continues to seek wage concessions in its ongoing talks with its pilots union.

Delta spokeswoman Peggy Estes said the decision would not affect Song's service in Orlando. It flies between Orlando and seven markets, including New York and San Juan, Puerto Rico.

"But understand that Song's not the only thing that's under strategic review," Estes said. Grinstein "will look at all of Delta's business units . . . and there are no sacred cows. He's looking at everything."

Airline consultant Robert Mann said on Friday that low-fare airlines such as Ted and Song "don't make sense."

It's good the airlines are looking for ways to save money, said Mann, president of R.W. Mann & Co., based in Port Washington, N.Y. But they should try them first on their mainline routes, "with little fanfare and lots of attention to results."



Bye Bye--General Lee

;)
 
Think About the Cleaning

[/i]

. . . . . Ted's vice president said the airline had learned valuable lessons from Shuttle's failure.

"The reason Shuttle ultimately did not work is our costs became too high," Sean Donohue said.

"So, the very first thing we started with when we were building our low-fare operation was a foundation of cost competitiveness," he said.

And it will change how crews tidy up the planes to reduce time spent at the gate.

Ordinarily, cleaning crews board through the same door as passengers, meaning they can't get on until the last passenger has gotten off. Ted will let crews enter through the rear of the plane so they can start cleaning as the plane empties.

"Once the customer deplanes, we're about done with cleaning the airplane," Donohue said.

"That can save us four, five, six minutes," he said.
;) [/B]



I think it is awesome United is trying to turn their aircraft more quickly. Last time I checked, planes don't make money sitting on the ground. Donohue's comments regarding the cleaning crews actually cracked me up.

Let's think about the logistics of deplaning an aircraft. Customers exit from the front of the jet. The last folks to leave the aircraft are from the aft section where the "cleaning crews" are entering. Customers block the aisles making it impossible to clean anything forward of the aft galley. How are they going to significantly decrease turn times?

Comments like these make me wonder if Donohue has ever sat on an aircraft and observed the boarding / deplaning / boarding process. I wish the employees at United the best, I hope their management helps TED make money.
 
Why are they trying to re-invent the wheel?? Look at all the money and resources they are wasting. You think they would try to improve what they have, work on rebuilding their network, not start another airline.

May UNI-TED meet a slow painful demise!!
 
Flythere,

What? I guess they should allow the LCCs to take all of the Low Cost market? After the economy nosedived, more and more people wanted cheaper tickets, and the Majors had to do something to pick up the slack in the business market. As the economy gets better, more and more people will not care as much, but there is still a large chunk that want low fares and more frills. United still has a premium product, and a large INTL operation, but they also have to deal with competitiors at their hubs--like Frontier and Independance. TED will do that, and we will see how it does. Song has done well (especially to Florida during this cold Winter up North), but our CEO doesn't like the two seperate brands. Atleast Delta and United have addressed their competitors and fought to keep marketshare. Your quote:

"work on rebuilding their network" ----What do you mean? Should they not try to keep their marketshare? They should just abandon their routes when a LCC comes on them? Wrong. They need to get their costs down and fight---and hopefully all of the majors will do just that.


Bye Bye--General Lee:rolleyes:
 
Last edited:
Boyd is a genius. I agree with all his takes. Why would United want to try something that has failed in the past? It's like those idiot Wright brothers - why bother trying something that has failed for hundreds of years. Fools. Oh yeah, they got a few of the little details right. Its a good thing Boyd is paying attention - Like the over 5 billion a year in UAL cost savings realized by 2005. If you do the math, that's only a little over 13 million a day. What good will that do for Ted and UAL's bottom line? Silly. But the thing I keep coming back to, and what validates Boyd and all the other Ted critics, is why would you ever want to change your product? I think United should go back to DC-8s - or maybe the prop mail carriers they flew 78 years ago - all change is bad. That guy who wrote "Thriving on Chaos" and revolutionized business a while back by saying you must always be changing - is an idiot. Yep, Ted wont be any different than when ALPA and the IAM ran UAL a short time ago - pay no attention to the insignificant current events of the past year. One more thing for Boyd - the revisiting of retirees health care is not a sign of despiration - but the promise Tilton made 13 months ago to leave no stone unturned and not a single penny on the table. Keep paying attention Boyd - you have been dead on accurate so far!
 
Sorry, the article I was discussing is new in Boyd's aviationplanning.com - should have given the source.
 
I dunno. He makes a bunch of sense to me

And he's the only pundit so far who has come out and said that UAL is going to make it for sure. Maybe he is an idiot, but I think he makes some valid points.

All of these cuts, and CASM is still higher than RASM on domestic markets exclusive of one time charge offs. Hard to ignore.

Plus the labor strife that "the promise Tilton made 13 months ago to leave no stone unturned and not a single penny on the table." is bringing to Ted can't help matters.

Good luck folks.

http://www.unitedafa.org/committees/retirement/rrc/news/20040209_lvs.asp

Ted Facing Labor Problems Before it Even Takes Off
Las Vegas Sun
February 9, 2004

..."United has spent millions marketing Ted as a new, innovative, happy airline, but it's not," said United AFA Master Executive Council President Greg Davidowitch in a statement. "These contract violations and double-cross tactics show that there is nothing new at United. Labor management relations are back to historical lows and the promise of a new United is gone. Through this attack on retirees, management has proven that what Ted really stands for is cheated."...

..."United has spent millions reconfiguring and re-equipping planes and because of the (passenger) loads on these flights, they'll fly with four flight attendants instead of three," Houser said. "They (United) are so far out to lunch on this that they have no idea what they're doing. For them to attempt to hide this under the umbrella of bankruptcy is inexcusable." ...

..."They're right," Mike Boyd of the Boyd Group, Evergreen, said of the flight attendants.

"They (United) spent millions starting this silly sub-brand called Ted, which doesn't reduce fares and makes the airline less efficient to operate," Boyd said. "They they had the nerve to ask the flight attendants to take a cut in their health care benefits. They (flight attendants) are absolutely right about United squandering money. The only way to solve this may be for senior management to be removed." ...
 
The only way to solve this may be for senior management to be removed." ...

- That is perhaps the dumbest thing I've heard this Boyd guy say yet, and that is saying a lot. You have an article there with propaganda from a union president, and Boyd calling for the removal of a new mgt team that has accomplished things almost no one thought possible. Ted wont reduce fares and is less efficient to operate? Absolutely not true - and the labor "strife" card is being overplayed here. I don't think Boyd is stupid or lazy, I just think he has an agenda. F9 Driver, I guess some people just thought costs would drop to the projected levels overnight. What has happened is they have dropped by double digit percents every qtr. That will slow of course, but CASM will be a lot lower by next year.
 

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