American Eagle internal Pilot Mins.

[Flyer1015]

I know certain carriers like XJT reduce their requirements to 500 TT / 100 ME for internal pilot applicants.

Does anyone know if Eagle reduces their requirements of 1000 TT / 100 ME down to 500 TT / 100 ME ?

On their website, the 1000TT/100ME are listed with an asterick: Flight time requirements are commensurate with experience

So does anyone know?

Thanks.

 

[bart]

Why do they even bother with minimums. Why not just hire anyone with a valid drivers license and a passing interest in aviation?

 

[Flyer1015]

?????

 

[UPF-7]

it works because upgrade is longer then most peoples natural life span.

 

[Pilot1625]

When I was hired last year it was 500TT/100Multi for former interns or certain colleges with bridge programs.

 

[Bandit60]

No offense but 500tt/100hrs multi. Remind me to fly on another airline. This is just scary.

 

[Yank McCobb]

Even more so, I pity the Captains. Po' bastyds.

 

[Bandit60]

Even more so, I pity the Captains. Po' bastyds.

I have to agree. I have been there myself.

 

[Flyer1015]

When I was hired last year it was 500TT/100Multi for former interns or certain colleges with bridge programs.

Thanks, I see. I know previous interns and bridge programs lower it to 500TT/100ME. I'm still curious if they lower the mins. for internal, current employees (like a ramp agent or a cust. service agent).

*****************************

500TT/100 ME... you think that's bad ? ASA lets interns on with as little as something like 300 TT / 50 ME.

No offense but 500tt/100hrs multi. Remind me to fly on another airline. This is just scary.

Sure, just dont fly on: American Eagle, ASA, Great Lakes, Mesa, ExpressJet, BigSky, Era, Trans States, Colgan. Because these have all hired people with 500TT / 100 ME. Some even lower (i.e. ASA's previous interns... while some do have above 500/100, some were hired with times lower than that).

Hell, I hope you didn't fly United in the early/mid ninety's when they hired quite a few 400 TT hour pilots.

ANYWAY,


I don't want this thread to go in the wrong direction.

Back to the original question:

Does Eagle lower mins. to 500TT/100ME for current employees?

 

[flyAA]

When I showed up for interview last May, I was told that they lower it to 1000TT 100ME for current employees, bridge program, and interns. (1500TT or 1200TT, 200 ME was published mins) I was a current employee then but already had more than published mins.

 

[73belair]

No matter what, this post will turn into people bashing other people. It's just how flightinfo works.

 

[Flyer1015]

FlyAA,

I've been watching Eagle's min hiring requirements, and the first time they started to hire after 9/11, the mins. were 1500TT/500ME.

Then later, they were dropped to 1200 TT / 200 ME (this is during your time).

Then again, they were dropped to 1000TT/100ME.

Since they lowered to 1000/100 for current employees back when the mins. were 1200/200,

I wonder if they're currently 800TT/100 ME or 500 TT / 100 ME (reduction from the 1000 TT / 100 ME for external applicants).

 

[MarineGrunt]

The college I went to has a program with AE in which you can get hired with 500/100. I assume they would do internal hiring with the same mins. I know they are taking applications, but I don't think they are interviewing yet.

 

[BoilerUP]

AE minimums for graduates of Purdue, UND, ERAU, Southern Illinois, Western Michigan, and most other well-known aviation universities is 500/100. Same goes for AA/AE interns, and I *believe* internal candidates like bag handlers and CSRs.

Source: American Eagle handout, 2004 NIFA national competition

 

[V2plus25]

Why Eagle? Why, oh why?


After 4 years I was still asking myself that question.

 

[Flightdawg]

Apply only to flying jobs that are either a career position or helps you attain one by giving you an upgrade to Captain in a year or two.

 

[BoilerUP]

Apply only to flying jobs that are either a career position or helps you attain one by giving you an upgrade to Captain in a year or two.

What would you suggest?

 

[Flyer1015]

Apply only to flying jobs that are either a career position or helps you attain one by giving you an upgrade to Captain in a year or two.

Can you honestly look at an airline, and KNOW FOR SURE that you will make Captain in " a year or two ? " Absolutely not! This might have been true pre 9/11, but not anymore. There are FAR TOOOOO MANY factors beyond your control for you to judge that.

I've always maintained that when applying to regionals, go where you think you can stick it out for at least 5 years, if not more in case sh*t hits the fan. Do you like the bases, will you commute, QOL issues, etc ?

Do NOT look at upgrade times as your main 'deciding factor.'

 

[Pilot1625]

Bandit60

No offense but 500tt/100hrs multi. Remind me to fly on another airline. This is just scary.

I was an intern but had around 1700TT, sheesh. The battle will always continue of those who had a bazillion hours before they were hired versus those who had low time. I've flown with some high time captains who didn't know #$%@ about the airplane nor could fly it well. Then again, I know of many low time new hires who had difficulty in training.

What would you think of a new hire who had 3000TT but 99% of it was VFR flying or a 500TT pilot who had vast IFR experience? There are gripes to both sides of this issue. The fact remains that most regional pay/benefits/upgrade times are slow right now so when you can't attract many pilots with high mins, you lower them! Supply and demand...

Furthermore, at Eagle, sure everyone agrees that the flowback/upgrade times are terrible...7+ years. However, I also know many Eagle pilots who said Eagle used to be the place to go for upgrade time. All airlines go through growth/non growth modes. Eagle is currently in a bad rut, but the grass isn't always greener on the other side (as mentioned every other thread, it seems).

I remember that after choosing Eagle, I really liked ExpressJet. In fact I still love the product that ExpressJet offers....great interiors for a small jet, boarding music, etc. Friends kept saying "Come over!! We have all the flowbacks gone, 113 going up to CAL, and then hiring off the street; many are pref. interviews from XJT." Yet I read the 10K that CAL filed this week and realize that if they dont' get the concessions from CAL, airplanes cancelled and perhaps a furlough down the road... As a former intern for AA, I was right in the middle when Carty wanted 1B in concessions from the company. It will take many months before anything is resolved at any place that demands such conessions.

So in short, sorry for making this simple thread on hiring times so long and detailed, but there are some real whiners out there, myself included. But at the end of the day, with times as bad as they are for all airlines, at least I didn't have to fly around frieght in bad weather for a couple years till things turned around. At Eagle, my upgrade will be indefinte until the next major swing comes around, and for now I'm gonna deal with it.

 

[SkyBoy1981]

Can you honestly look at an airline, and KNOW FOR SURE that you will make Captain in " a year or two ? " Absolutely not! This might have been true pre 9/11, but not anymore. There are FAR TOOOOO MANY factors beyond your control for you to judge that.

I've always maintained that when applying to regionals, go where you think you can stick it out for at least 5 years, if not more in case sh*t hits the fan. Do you like the bases, will you commute, QOL issues, etc ?

Do NOT look at upgrade times as your main 'deciding factor.'

I would agree with this, but just be aware that AE currently has one of, if not the longest upgrade time of any regional airline. Also be prepared to move down to SJU and sit right seat in an ATR for a while. Nothing against AE, but these were factors that I had to take into consideration during my job search as well, and I decided AE wasn't for me. Thats not to say it wouldn't be a good choice for you though. Best of luck.

 

[Flyer1015]

I would agree with this, but just be aware that AE currently has one of, if not the longest upgrade time of any regional airline. Also be prepared to move down to SJU and sit right seat in an ATR for a while. Nothing against AE, but these were factors that I had to take into consideration during my job search as well, and I decided AE wasn't for me. Thats not to say it wouldn't be a good choice for you though. Best of luck.

I've got a while to go until I can apply to Eagle. But are you kidding ?!?!? SJU would be my FIRST CHOICE ! I've had it with the northeast winters. One day, 65 degrees. The next day 20 degrees. Then, 60 degrees. Day after, 25 degrees. My nuts can't take it anymore.

 

[labbats]

I would agree with this, but just be aware that AE currently has one of, if not the longest upgrade time of any regional airline. Also be prepared to move down to SJU and sit right seat in an ATR for a while. Nothing against AE, but these were factors that I had to take into consideration during my job search as well, and I decided AE wasn't for me. Thats not to say it wouldn't be a good choice for you though. Best of luck.

Only 2 of 17 in my class got SJU. None in the next class did.

Although, I hear that a lot of the guys that first went to SJU are now bidding up to jet, making vacancies down there. I'd say it's a good possibility of SJU or Miami in the ATR or Chicago in the CRJ.

I chose Eagle, because a long captain upgrade is what is happening in 2005. In 2010 I want to be certain I have a job, and QOL was higher for me here. I'd say that the next 5 years have a lot of changes coming, and if you think you can outsmart the trends, more power to you.

 

[Red Baron]

Something to ponder

I was at Eagle for 7 years, and upgraded at a year and 10 months. I was very fortunate. Though it looks bleak for Eagle now, you never know what will happen in the future. This industry is in constant change.

 

[EMB170Pilot]

Bandit60

I was an intern but had around 1700TT, sheesh. The battle will always continue of those who had a bazillion hours before they were hired versus those who had low time. I've flown with some high time captains who didn't know #$%@ about the airplane nor could fly it well. Then again, I know of many low time new hires who had difficulty in training.

What would you think of a new hire who had 3000TT but 99% of it was VFR flying or a 500TT pilot who had vast IFR experience? There are gripes to both sides of this issue. The fact remains that most regional pay/benefits/upgrade times are slow right now so when you can't attract many pilots with high mins, you lower them! Supply and demand...

Furthermore, at Eagle, sure everyone agrees that the flowback/upgrade times are terrible...7+ years. However, I also know many Eagle pilots who said Eagle used to be the place to go for upgrade time. All airlines go through growth/non growth modes. Eagle is currently in a bad rut, but the grass isn't always greener on the other side (as mentioned every other thread, it seems).

I remember that after choosing Eagle, I really liked ExpressJet. In fact I still love the product that ExpressJet offers....great interiors for a small jet, boarding music, etc. Friends kept saying "Come over!! We have all the flowbacks gone, 113 going up to CAL, and then hiring off the street; many are pref. interviews from XJT." Yet I read the 10K that CAL filed this week and realize that if they dont' get the concessions from CAL, airplanes cancelled and perhaps a furlough down the road... As a former intern for AA, I was right in the middle when Carty wanted 1B in concessions from the company. It will take many months before anything is resolved at any place that demands such conessions.

So in short, sorry for making this simple thread on hiring times so long and detailed, but there are some real whiners out there, myself included. But at the end of the day, with times as bad as they are for all airlines, at least I didn't have to fly around frieght in bad weather for a couple years till things turned around. At Eagle, my upgrade will be indefinte until the next major swing comes around, and for now I'm gonna deal with it.

Then quit your bitchin

 

[Pilot1625]

EMB170Pilot

Then quit your bitchin

Indeed.

 

[elcid]

Bandit60,

Have no fear. The kid in the right seat may be a young'n, but the Captain has been there for at least 15 years. The average pilot is eligible for social security (plus or minus a couple of years) before he can upgrade.

 

[Flyingdude]

Several things to keep in mind!

What would you think of a new hire who had 3000TT but 99% of it was VFR flying or a 500TT pilot who had vast IFR experience?

1) This is a very unrealistic example. A 500 hr pilot can't have extensive IFR experience simply because they don't have enough TT. CFII work is great experience and I learned alot doing it, yet it does not in any way constitute great IFR experience. My CFII time pails in comparison to what I learned latter on flying in real IMC day after day in ice, snow, and all weather. I have seen very few 3000tt instructors, meaning most of the 3000tt pilots probably do have atleast fair IFR experience. The reason is that many of these people have instructed and then moved on to some type of 135 outfit flying lots of IMC. I do agree that their are some great 500 hr pilots and some equally bad 3000 hr pilots. The debate is not your ability to just fly the plane at 500tt. Someone who has spent 6 times that much time in the air has flown in all conditions many times over. I am simply saying that they have delt with ice, thunderstorms, etc. many more times giving more experience. This does not make them skykings, only experienced pilots. Know one is calling a 500tt pilot a bad pilot only less experienced.
2) I was in the first class hired at EGL when they started hiring in 2004. The first 2 class were about 50% turboprop, yet since then about 95% of the classes have been jet. Usually the people who say you are going to SJU if you come to EGL are the ones who never worked here and only repeat rumors that they hear. Lesson? Just cause someone says it does not make it true.
3) To the guy who said he wanted to come to SJU. You have no idea what this place is like. I have been in SJU for over a year and fortunatly have only 1 week left. Operations in SJU is a joke at best, Most of the commutable lines are only worth min. gaurantee, non-rev fees are outrageous, and don't even get me started on the public tranportation to get to and from the extremely overpriced crashpad.

 

[Flightdawg]

Can you honestly look at an airline, and KNOW FOR SURE that you will make Captain in " a year or two ? " Absolutely not!

I concur, but won't you concur that anyone applying to Eagle will not upgrade for over 5 years? Probably 10?

Every airline can change for the worse, but very few will suddenly change for the better. Especially American Eagle upgrade opportunities.

 

[Flyer1015]

I concur, but won't you concur that anyone applying to Eagle will not upgrade for over 5 years? Probably 10?

Every airline can change for the worse, but very few will suddenly change for the better. Especially American Eagle upgrade opportunities.

I don't think anyone can tell. There are faaaaar too many factors. What if the flowbacks start to leave at a rate of 100/year starting next year ? It would take 5 years for them to get out, and them leaving alone would create almost 500 captain slots available. There could be more flowbacks, pushing the upgrade time up. There might be future aircraft orders, pushing the upgrade time down. There might be no aircraft, pushing the upgrade time up.

Cliche, maybe, but the ONLY thing you know for sure is that you know NOTHING for sure.


Right now, XJT upgrades are running at about 4 years. If you get hired with them NOW, you should be prepared to sit as a F/O for much longer than 4 years (maybe 6-7+ years) depending on what happens in 2007 and 2010 in terms of CAL's decisions. I would question anyone getting hired now into XJT, and can say FOR SURE that he/she will make captain in 4 years. But then again, CAL might choose to stick with only XJT in 2007, and extend contract further past 2010, and excercise options... we might get 2-3 year upgrades then. But who knows.

Too many 'sh*t' factors out there to predict stuff like that!