Alternatives to flight Instruction...????

[VW Pilot]

Hi All

Just would like to know, what are some alternatives to flight instruction?
Just incase I cannot land a CFI (when I get my CFI) Job somewhere to build time. Thought about Civil Air Patrol..but I don't think you get any pay for that.....
if there are some places you can earn some money while building time...
Any suggestions or websites welcome, Thanx and Happy Holidays.

 

[gsrcrsx68]

In my opinion, the best shots at making any money and not instructing, without having to move and without having to kiss much a$$:
1. Aerial photography.
2. Ferrying Aircraft.

Both of these are fairly easy to set up as an independent service. I think there are more opportunities in aerial photography and a higher hourly wage (at least for low timers flying small A/C), coupled with the fact that there is a lot of competition for ferrying jobs.

I have an aerial photography website if you (or anyone else) want to look at it pm me.

 

[pilotyip]

Look into the 135 on demand that operate airplanes needing SIC's, like the Merlin or Shorts 360. They will hire with Comm./MEL/Inst and min time. The work is ruff, the pay terrible, and QOL is non-existent. But is build MEL time, most likely turbine and that is the resume fluff of champions.

 

[Metro752]

hOW can you not land a CFI job

do you smell bad
do u have like an open face wound
do you have ab geezus?

 

[unreal]

hOW can you not land a CFI job

do you smell bad
do u have like an open face wound
do you have ab geezus?

Haha, I've got to agree. CFI jobs are a dime a dozen. Someone will hire you.

 

[plunger]

Hi All

Just would like to know, what are some alternatives to flight instruction?
Just incase I cannot land a CFI (when I get my CFI) Job somewhere to build time. Thought about Civil Air Patrol..but I don't think you get any pay for that.....
if there are some places you can earn some money while building time...
Any suggestions or websites welcome, Thanx and Happy Holidays.

You should have no problem getting a CFI job. Especially right now. If you have the ticket your all but hired. The regionals are picking up guys with as little as 500hrs. I know of a few places deserate for CFI's here in Florida. Embry Riddle being one. Pay is ok but the benefits are good. Health insurance and FREE TUITION! Delta Connection Academy is also looking for instructors. You just have to be willing to go where the jobs are.

 

[VW Pilot]

RE METRO....Nah...non of the abouve.....or anything else.

 

[siucavflight]

Pipeline patrol
banner towing
flying jumpers

 

[unreal]

To the OP: Just get your ratings and you shouldn't have a problem getting a CFI job. They're VERY plentiful right now, and I would know. I landed my current job even having not flown regularly for 2 years prior to my start date. A lot of places are hurting, evidenced by the fact that someone hired a non-current sap like me.

By the way, I'm sure most of those other jobs are good ones and would get you the hours you need, but being an instructor is a good gig. Not just for hours, but for your own experience level and knowledge. I learn new things everyday, and I simply teach instruments in a C172. It amazes me how little I knew about instrument flying when I was a student, and it sometimes amazes me right now how little I still know about instrument flying as an active instructor. One thing is for certain though: the things you learn are things that you can't learn through flight training. They can only be learned through experience. Go be a CFI. It's good for ya!

 

[avbug]

Unreal,

Hopefully you're learnng new things all the time. I got playing with some avionics simulator software last night, and found about half a dozen things with a particular avionics package I didn't know about...includng some surprisingly basic things. I've been flying this particular nav unit for nearly three months, almost exclusively in IMC all the time, approaches all the time...and I just found this out. I'm guessing tomorrow I'll find something else out.

No matter what you do, if you're determined to keep learning something, you will. Knowledge, like skills in this business, is perishable. If you're not learning, you're "unlearning."

When I first started spraying, I thought I had the tiger by the tail. I was in a turn one day, and my boss was on my case on the radio, telling me to tighten up the turn. If you haven't seen an ag turn, it's a steep turn with a reversal at 75'or so, often lower, and often tight enough that you an milk it in and out of the buffet as you turn. I was pulling as tight as I dared, and he was trying to get me to pull it tighter. I didn't think it could be done. I was holding a steep bank, pulling and I could feel the airplane barking and buffeting...I thought if I pulled harder I'd be a stall-spin accident.

I looked up through my overhead eyebrow indows to see the belly of my bosses airplane passing me inside the turn. Just a few feet from my canopy, he was showing me it could be done, and I knew he was carrying more chemical than me, and therefore heavier. But how?

Back on the ground he asked me what I was doing to make a turn, and told me to explain a turn to him. I felt a little insulted...after all, do you ask someone how they make a turn in a car, or on a bicycle? He said humor him. So I did. When I finished, he asked why I wasn't holding top rudder. I didn't want to spin out of the turn when I stalled, of course. Try it next time.

So I did. I held a steep bank and some top rudder, lettng the fuselage take over with some lift as I sliced back through the turn, and I immediately felt the drag go away. I'd been using bottom rudder, horsing the airplane around. Suddenly I could feel the change, and the airplane quit buffeting like it did before. I could pull it around tighter before reaching that point, and I was a lot more comfortable in the turns.

Now I was eighteen at time. I'd spent six months training to fly ag airplanes, and I thought I had a handle on things. I'd been reading books on flying since junior high school, been active at the airport working and flying and bummng rides for five years before that...and here I was relearning the most basic parts of flying, as though I'd just started.

That theme has continued through my career thus far...each time I learn something, I realize how much it is I don't know, and often have to ask myself how much that I "know" I know incorrectly. For every thing I learn, I realize there were two things I didn't know...and this goes on and on. No matter what you do, you'll forever be learning new things. This applies regardless of the assignment, so long as you are open to learning them. For those who aren't, no job will be more than a job, and such will never gain experience. Only hours. For those who are open, every job will be a school, and every flight an opportunity.

Sounds like you have a great opportunity.

 

[FlySacto]

Unreal,

Hopefully you're learnng new things all the time. <snip>

That theme has continued through my career thus far...each time I learn something, I realize how much it is I don't know, and often have to ask myself how much that I "know" I know incorrectly. For every thing I learn, I realize there were two things I didn't know...and this goes on and on. No matter what you do, you'll forever be learning new things. This applies regardless of the assignment, so long as you are open to learning them. For those who aren't, no job will be more than a job, and such will never gain experience. Only hours. For those who are open, every job will be a school, and every flight an opportunity.

Sounds like you have a great opportunity.

Great post Avbug. Thank you for sharing your perspective and expertise over the years on the various forums.


Merry Christmas!

 

[unreal]

That theme has continued through my career thus far...each time I learn something, I realize how much it is I don't know, and often have to ask myself how much that I "know" I know incorrectly. For every thing I learn, I realize there were two things I didn't know...and this goes on and on. No matter what you do, you'll forever be learning new things. This applies regardless of the assignment, so long as you are open to learning them. For those who aren't, no job will be more than a job, and such will never gain experience. Only hours. For those who are open, every job will be a school, and every flight an opportunity.

Sounds like you have a great opportunity.

First off, thanks for the great post avbug.

Your line of "...and often have to ask myself how much that I "know" I know incorrectly" really hit home. When I first started, most of what I taught was basically what I knew (or in reality, thought I knew) from what my old instructors taught me. I was basically just relaying information from my old instructors to my new students. After a little while, as I gained experience myself, I realized that what I was teaching often differed from what my instructors had taught me before. Not that what they had taught me was necessarily completely wrong (though that has happened), but sometimes the procedures were inefficient and didn't really make any sense to begin with. I have to say, being an instructor has been a very humbling experience, simply because I've been forced to look back at my own training and realize that a good bit of it was incorrect and/or was taken for granted unquestioningly.

Another funny thing about being an instructor is that I get to see what I was like when I was a 100 hour private pilot. I notice that none of these guys have any fear of anything. I'm not sure why, but none of them have even the slightest qualm about flying single engine airplanes over rough terrain at night. They're also the ones that will completely ignore engine instruments, leaning procedures, etc. throughout the flight. They just don't care, or maybe they don't quite know enough to care. As I've gained experience (and I still don't have much myself), I've personally gotten a lot more conservative and careful about how and where I fly. Funny how that works.

Anyway, hopefully this discussion will get the OP to think twice about not instructing.

 

[minitour]

Just incase I cannot land a CFI (when I get my CFI) Job somewhere to build time.

Please don't go after a CFI job to build time. You should be there to teach, learn and enhance your knowledge, skill and experience. If you're just there to build time, well I could put an MP3 player on a student's headset that says "right rudder" for an hour at a time. You "building time" as a CFI and the MP3 player are both worth about the same to a student.

I learned more in my first 100 hours of dual given than I did in my first 250 hours of flight training and I know most CFIs say the same thing. Now, I've got a feeling you didn't mean you wanted to get a CFI job to "build time" in the way that I've displayed above, but my point is that if you want to be a CFI, be a good CFI. If you just want to build your time, stop by WalMart, buy some Bics and a six pack and have fun over a weekend.

Avbug - fantastic post.

-mini

 

[unreal]

I learned more in my first 100 hours of dual given than I did in my first 250 hours of flight training and I know most CFIs say the same thing.

Definitely. I'm surprised I survived my first 300 hours at the knowledge level I was at!

 

[minitour]

Definitely. I'm surprised I survived my first 300 hours at the knowledge level I was at!

To be honest, I'd say I'm surprised I survived my first 2,000 hours...in another 3, I'll probably be surprised I survived my first 5. It's amazing how much I learn every time I go up...

-mini

 

[VW Pilot]

great info...thanks

 

[VW Pilot]

Well now that I think about it, I think I'd like to become an Instructor
instead of just getting the privilage. The other day my brother became curious about learning to fly and I said to my self....I know i'm no instructor...but let me see just how much I know and how it will sound
telling someone else...So I Imagined him being a student and told him what I could about what he asked....felt like I had passed something good, in the form of knowlege on to someone else....Since he understood, made me feel even better....So I guess had low confidence of being an Instructor...Afraid I'd mess up...So I think I could do it....And have some fun too. Besides alot of Pilots at the FBO says it makes a better Pilot out of ya....as one so eloquently said it.....I read that on here numerous times also....So I'll try it.
when I get there of course....

 

[unreal]

Well now that I think about it, I think I'd like to become an Instructor
instead of just getting the privilage. The other day my brother became curious about learning to fly and I said to my self....I know i'm no instructor...but let me see just how much I know and how it will sound
telling someone else...So I Imagined him being a student and told him what I could about what he asked....felt like I had passed something good, in the form of knowlege on to someone else....Since he understood, made me feel even better....So I guess had low confidence of being an Instructor...Afraid I'd mess up...So I think I could do it....And have some fun too. Besides alot of Pilots at the FBO says it makes a better Pilot out of ya....as one so eloquently said it.....I read that on here numerous times also....So I'll try it.
when I get there of course....

Trust me, don't be at all concerned about your teaching ability when you're a student pilot. You should be concerning yourself with flying the airplane, and that's it. CFI applicants go through a lot of training to hone their ability to teach, and even then, most of us sucked at it when we first started.

Only getting out there and actually being a CFI with real students is going to get your teaching ability to a good level. Not only do you learn new things about flying, but you're constantly figuring out new ways to convey that knowledge as well. It won't happen overnight, and even though I teach the same courses day after day after day, I still have lessons where I feel as though I didn't teach as well as I could have. It happens.

As far as messing up, well, you might mess up a bit when you first start. When I first started, I told my students up front that I was brand new, and they were just fine with that. After a couple months, one of my instrument students even gave me a good compliment: "Hey, you're getting really good at explaining things!" Do the best you can and be professional about it, but don't be afraid to admit that you're wrong. Getting something wrong and then attempting to cover it up is a much worse crime than simply getting something wrong and fessing up. If you mess up, make it a learning experience for both you and your student.

If you're afraid of messing your students up, don't worry about it. The fact that you care about the instruction you're giving to them speaks a great deal about how you'll be as an instructor. As long as you care about their progress and do whatever you can to give them the best and most accurate information possible, you won't screw them up. And keep in mind that if you forget to cover something in a ground lesson, it'll become readily apparent what it was you forgot the moment they try it in the airplane. No harm, no foul.

Good luck.

 

[time builder]

Has anyone mentioned traffic watch? I know some that will hire at 500 hours, mine took 750 hours for insurance requirements. I logged 92 hours my first solid month. On the other hand, like flying the canyon (I did that too), its way too easy flying the same route every day, and I needed to challenge myself, so I got a job instructing.

Seriously though, I was in the same situation, couldn't find a CFI job despite graduating the school with a 3.98 GPA, they wanted to hire me, but didn't have enough students. What can I say, it payed to relocate to Las Vegas.

Before I moved, however, I did an FO program with Ameriflight to get over 600 hours. I know its typically flamebait to post stuff about PFT, but really, I didn't take anyone's job by doing it, and I learned so many things from that which I never could have through instructing (turbine engines, icing, radar/thunderstorms, hard IFR, flows, etc.). Also, the Captains were challenging me, many to the point of flying ATP standards and beyond.

Don't get me wrong, there are those who don't get the experience, they just pass the checkride and coast from there *sigh* , hence the reputation many of these programs get.

At any rate, there's no easy way to the airlines. Many who try to skip the challenges find themselves unprepared for their interviews and or part 121/135 training, or even worse, the challenges they face in real life.

I can empathize with someone who can't find a job as a CFI (the first job is always the hardest to get), but don't sell yourself short of getting the experience you need.

 

[unreal]

At any rate, there's no easy way to the airlines. Many who try to skip the challenges find themselves unprepared for their interviews and or part 121/135 training, or even worse, the challenges they face in real life.

That's just the thing. I couldn't imagine going into a 121/135 interview without the IFR knowledge I've gained being a (primarily) instrument instructor. I'm sure people do it and do just fine from such jobs as traffic watch, but it's nice to have experience instead of rote memorization of the facts. No offense meant to anyone.