ALPA Strike

[AVoiceOfReason]

Does anyone have any information or a link to whether the ALPA employees strike is over? The ALPA site doesn't have anything.

 

[WSurf]

No Link, but its over!

 

[AVoiceOfReason]

No Link, but its over!

Thanks, but why no info from ALPA. They put out an email telling us about the strike, why not telling us it was over? Who won?

 

[FmrFreightDog]

Scott, you're really hung up on this Unit 2 strike thing. Still looking an excuse for why the company broke off negotiations?

 

[cwebster2]

Thanks, but why no info from ALPA. They put out an email telling us about the strike, why not telling us it was over? Who won?

I got an ALPA fastread when the TA came out and they went back to work (5/17) and another when when they accepted the TA (5/19).

 

[pipejockey]

So can anyone post the particulars of what they got? From what I remember on some other thread, some of the outrageous things they got hopefully have been taken away. For instance I hope they now are required to work at least a 40 hour work week. I know it will be quite a hardship for them and some will not be able to endure working in their offices that many hours a week, but we live in a different world now, at least thats what we pilots have been told while having 50% paycuts forced down our throats.

Also, I am sure ALPA requires their employees who earn under $50,000 a year to pay their own taxes now like the rest the rest of working class America. I can't imagine this perq can still be allowed to continue, with the "different" world we live in now. I mean this "different" world still exists right? It must, or else all the pilots who have had those 50% pay cuts rammed down their throats would be earning what they did in 2001 right?

Oh, and lest I forget medical coverage. ALPA certainly would require it's employees to pay a larger share of their coverage now right? I mean the people ALPA represents have had to. Whats good for the goose is good for the gander they say right?

ALPA wouldn't dare have the hypocrisy needed to not require everything I have just mentioned, from their workforce could they? It would be blasphemy to say otherwise right?

 

[atrdriver]

So can anyone post the particulars of what they got? From what I remember on some other thread, some of the outrageous things they got hopefully have been taken away. For instance I hope they now are required to work at least a 40 hour work week. I know it will be quite a hardship for them and some will not be able to endure working in their offices that many hours a week, but we live in a different world now, at least thats what we pilots have been told while having 50% paycuts forced down our throats.

Also, I am sure ALPA requires their employees who earn under $50,000 a year to pay their own taxes now like the rest the rest of working class America. I can't imagine this perq can still be allowed to continue, with the "different" world we live in now. I mean this "different" world still exists right? It must, or else all the pilots who have had those 50% pay cuts rammed down their throats would be earning what they did in 2001 right?

Oh, and lest I forget medical coverage. ALPA certainly would require it's employees to pay a larger share of their coverage now right? I mean the people ALPA represents have had to. Whats good for the goose is good for the gander they say right?

ALPA wouldn't dare have the hypocrisy needed to not require everything I have just mentioned, from their workforce could they? It would be blasphemy to say otherwise right?

Sorry, but I don't see why you should care what they are able to negotiate, except maybe jealousy. It's not their fault that they can negotiate a sweet deal, it's our fault that we can't. Ever heard the saying "You don't get paid what you're worth, you get paid what you negotiate"?

 

[j41driver]

Sorry, but I don't see why you should care what they are able to negotiate

Maybe because his dues money (and yours) goes to pay them. You feel OK paying their taxes?

 

[AVoiceOfReason]

Sorry, but I don't see why you should care what they are able to negotiate, except maybe jealousy. It's not their fault that they can negotiate a sweet deal, it's our fault that we can't. Ever heard the saying "You don't get paid what you're worth, you get paid what you negotiate"?

I care because I am tired of ALPA employees making more than I am while they fail time after time to actually hold the line of the people they work for. Pay their payroll taxes out of my pay - YGTBSM!!!

 

[ASARJMan]

I care because I am tired of ALPA employees making more than I am while they fail time after time to actually hold the line of the people they work for. Pay their payroll taxes out of my pay - YGTBSM!!!

Then recall them Scotty boy! Oh, that's right, you're not ALPA, but mgt huh? jerk.

 

[AVoiceOfReason]

Then recall them Scotty boy! Oh, that's right, you're not ALPA, but mgt huh? jerk.

You can't "recall" employees of ALPA. They are on the payroll.

 

[atrdriver]

Maybe because his dues money (and yours) goes to pay them. You feel OK paying their taxes?

Number one, it's not "their taxes", it's the employee portion of the SS tax that is paid for them. And yes, I am perfectly comfortable paying them whatever they are able to negotiate for themselves. Like you would complain if you were able to negotiate that for yourself.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

I care because I am tired of ALPA employees making more than I am while they fail time after time to actually hold the line of the people they work for. Pay their payroll taxes out of my pay - YGTBSM!!!

Holding the line of the people they work for??? WTF does that mean? Your babble doesn't even make sense half the time.

 

[PCL_128]

So can anyone post the particulars of what they got? From what I remember on some other thread, some of the outrageous things they got hopefully have been taken away. For instance I hope they now are required to work at least a 40 hour work week. I know it will be quite a hardship for them and some will not be able to endure working in their offices that many hours a week, but we live in a different world now, at least thats what we pilots have been told while having 50% paycuts forced down our throats.

Also, I am sure ALPA requires their employees who earn under $50,000 a year to pay their own taxes now like the rest the rest of working class America. I can't imagine this perq can still be allowed to continue, with the "different" world we live in now. I mean this "different" world still exists right? It must, or else all the pilots who have had those 50% pay cuts rammed down their throats would be earning what they did in 2001 right?

Oh, and lest I forget medical coverage. ALPA certainly would require it's employees to pay a larger share of their coverage now right? I mean the people ALPA represents have had to. Whats good for the goose is good for the gander they say right?

ALPA wouldn't dare have the hypocrisy needed to not require everything I have just mentioned, from their workforce could they? It would be blasphemy to say otherwise right?

The agreement that was reached had essentially the same total economic package that the last ALPA offer had before the strike began. The only real difference was where the money was allocated. Money was shifted to areas that were more important to the Unit 2 employees. Through fair and good-faith negotiations (imagine that), both sides were able to find an agreement that met the needs of both the employees and ALPA. You should be proud that your Association acted in an honorable way and treated these employees as all of us would like to be treated by our employers.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

The agreement that was reached had essentially the same total economic package that the last ALPA offer had before the strike began. The only real difference was where the money was allocated. Money was shifted to areas that were more important to the Unit 2 employees. Through fair and good-faith negotiations (imagine that), both sides were able to find an agreement that met the needs of both the employees and ALPA. You should be proud that your Association acted in an honorable way and treated these employees as all of us would like to be treated by our employers.

And yet pilots choose to direct thier energy and anger and hate to ALPA, all while thier company management has them bent over.... Fight is out there not in ALPA

 

[pipejockey]

You should be proud that your Association acted in an honorable way and treated these employees as all of us would like to be treated by our employers.

WHAT?? Let me get this right. We as pilots have taken unconscionable pay cuts, due in part because our companies are not taking in the revenue thay once did, and in part because we have a sorry excuse for representation from Woerthless and his ALPO cronies. Now correct me if I am wrong, but isn't ALPO's revenue source from the pilots? Well we are not earning nearly as much as we did while 8000 are furloghed. So shouldn't the ALPO lackies take some cuts to help us out? So much for sharing the pain, imagine that. Some human decency from the ALPO workers to sympathize with us. Oh wait, they all think we are STILL overpaid and actually enjoy seeing us raked over th coals. And they are employees of our union? I can start to see why we have such poor representation.

By the way, I am shocked there is not more outrage from my fellow pilots. This tacit approval of their shananigans will only encourage it further.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

WHAT?? Let me get this right. We as pilots have taken unconscionable pay cuts, due in part because our companies are not taking in the revenue thay once did, and in part because we have a sorry excuse for representation from Woerthless and his ALPO cronies.

Sorry excuse for representation that YOU elected. That is IF you participated in the elections. You did particpate didn't you? Either way look in the mirror and read my signature line. If you don't like the pilots YOU elected then maybe there is a problem with YOUR decision making.

As long as it is ALPA's fault that means it isn't your fault. Blaming ALPA makes you the victim. Feel better?

Now correct me if I am wrong,but isn't ALPO's revenue source from the pilots? Well we are not earning nearly as much as we did while 8000 are furloghed. .

And what does that have to do with negotiations? Again, it is the same ol blah blah. You are miserable and the only way you are going to be (temporarily) happy is if others are miserable.

So shouldn't the ALPO lackies take some cuts to help us out? So much for sharing the pain, imagine that. Some human decency from the ALPO workers to sympathize with us. Oh wait, they all think we are STILL overpaid and actually enjoy seeing us raked over th coals. And they are employees of our union? I can start to see why we have such poor representation..

Calling the hard working dedicated union loyalist employees at ALPA lackies only shows your ignorance. It says everything about you and nothing about them.

By the way, I am shocked there is not more outrage from my fellow pilots. This tacit approval of their shananigans will only encourage it further.

There is no more outrage becuase most of the Air Line Pilots are true professionals and not guys like you: uneducated, emotional, non-pragmatic, misinformed and self centered.

Do your self a favor (and the rest of us):

(703) 689-2270

Let us know what you find out.

 

[pipejockey]

Rez, you and people like you just amaze me. Have you even taken any cuts? Have you sacrificed at all for your company to survive? All I am saying is how dare the people that are paid with a pilots dues not only refuse to share in hardships this industry has imposed on us, but actually walk off the job because they were not given enough? Do they not see what is happening to their "employers", the pilot members of ALPO? While we take huge paycuts and QOL setbacks on the job, those people continue with their perqs and get raises. Shameful!

I am mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore!! And it's that kind of attitude we need to all start to have. It's been 5 years of this crap, while all the while load factors are at record levels, passenger volume is set to break records this summer and our careers continue to slide backwards amidst all of this...WTF??
It is they who are greedy, self-centered, unappreciative people.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Rez, you and people like you just amaze me.

I have no doubt that you are amazed. I do believe that you are.

.Have you even taken any cuts? Have you sacrificed at all for your company to survive?

We have all taken hits. Since before 9/11 every Air Line Pilot has struggled, including the ones applying to airlines for the first time tomorrow.

But I refuse to make myself a victim. I have commited to this Profession and I will continue to control what I can and not concern myself with what I cannot control. And I'll address the issues at the front lines instead in-fighting amongst my peers and support staff....

I don't expect ALPA to be something it is not. And I am certianly not naive enough to actually try......

All I am saying is how dare the people that are paid with a pilots dues not only refuse to share in hardships this industry has imposed on us, but actually walk off the job because they were not given enough? Do they not see what is happening to their "employers", the pilot members of ALPO? While we take huge paycuts and QOL setbacks on the job, those people continue with their perqs and get raises. Shameful!.

As a professional and pilot leader (we all are if we choose to be) I am glad that the employees (non pilots) can continue to function as normal. They work for ALPA not the airline industry. If you ever walk the hallways of ALPA the employees there treat pilots with the most respect. And I would guess that they would do so even more so now that we continue to repsect thier right to negotiate.

They have only done what we do. Negotiate fairly. Besides, if they did decide to "share the pain" how much pain is enough? There still would be pilots (like you?) that would cry out that the "sharing of the pain" wasn't enough.

It is like the quasi-professionals who say "I'll do my Jepps revisions and wear my uniform better when they pay me better". But in three months they find a new reason to complain and slack off.

If the ALPA employees did take a pay cut or concessions, what would you have ALPA do with the money? Give pilots rebate checks? Fact is ALPA has done a fair and responsible job managing the Association with the loss of members IOW dues money). Can you find repsect in that? Do you even know that?

I am mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore!! And it's that kind of attitude we need to all start to have. It's been 5 years of this crap, while all the while load factors are at record levels, passenger volume is set to break records this summer and our careers continue to slide backwards amidst all of this...WTF??.

Sure you are mad as hell. But what do load factors have to do with a dedicated communications specialists at ALPA? How is a secretaries pay cut going to make things right for 5 years of the Perfect Storm? Five years of poor management, five years of over capacity, five years of W., five years terrorism, five years of CEO pillage and five years of member apathy and cynicism? Is Doris taking a paycut going make all that better? Will it fix it?

But I like they way you are thinking. I am a big proponent of change.

What are you going to do about it? Tell us how you "aren't going to take it any more" Dee Snider?

It is they who are greedy, self-centered, unappreciative people.

No, it is you who doesn't realize where the fight is and you are so pissed off that you are ready to fight anybody, anywhere, anytime. Including the people who are trying to help you....

Consider this your Morgan to Denzel wake up call....


Speaking of calls, did you? And if so, what did they say?

 

[pylut]

Once again it's rez to alpos rescue.
Same old drivel... new day.

I'm glad you're happy with your performance and your other ineffective beauracratic weenies at alpo. But it is obvious to nearly everyone else (including airline management) that alpo is the sad punchline to a tragic joke.

So go ahead Nero play your fiddle while the shop burns down around you. Pretend things are grand at your club. Everyone else but you get's the joke you and alpo have become.

I will celebrate alpos demise. Sounds harsh?? Well the way I see it alpo has little to no usefulness left in the tank. It is no longer made up of leaders, but has become a sanctuary for ineffectual beauracrats. alpo is good at spending dues, but little else. Time for a new dog to enter the fray
So yes, I will celebrate its demise, the way I see it, it's been dead for several years anyway.

Cheers,

 

[pipejockey]

Rez, you make some fine points, and you obviously are not the hothead I am, but as far as what to do with the money saved if concessions were taken, how about extending or increasing strike pay, or helping out any new furloughed guys which are sure to come in the future. Polar, Mesaba, Expressjet.

And you say you only concern yourself with the things you can control or change. Well you do have the power to influence what occurs when they begin bargaining again.

I will end my several post rant by saying that ALPA needs some serious changes. The least of which is the main man, Woerth. I truly would like to see ALPA have the power and prestige it once did, but I doubt it will ever happen.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Rez, you make some fine points, and you obviously are not the hothead I am, but as far as what to do with the money saved if concessions were taken, how about extending or increasing strike pay, or helping out any new furloughed guys which are sure to come in the future. Polar, Mesaba, Expressjet..

That is not the point, concessions by ALPA staff Unit I and II and not needed. The polices for strike funds or furloughs are fine. But if you feel they need change then get involved! Invoke change!

And you say you only concern yourself with the things you can control or change. Well you do have the power to influence what occurs when they begin bargaining again..

No I don't have the power. For two reasons. One it is not my concern (I don't believe it to be an issue) and two and most importantly I am not part of any organizational struture other than the general membership.

I will end my several post rant by saying that ALPA needs some serious changes. The least of which is the main man, Woerth. I truly would like to see ALPA have the power and prestige it once did, but I doubt it will ever happen.

ALPA does need changes. We need to grow and innovate. Woerth isn't the best either, however, keep in mind that ALPA elections are coming up this fall for a new Prez and Woerth looks like a contender.

Now what would it say or mean if he gets elected again? Does it mean he is actually a good President? Or the only choice? Or does it mean that the membership is the one who is Worthless? A membership who complians but can't get anything done.

ALPA prestige and power? I believe we have the ability to be better than ALPA ever was. However, as long as we, as members, are claiming victim status and enragining ourselves over ALPA Unit I & II, how are we ever going to achieve power and prestige?

All the players in the Air Line Industry are chuckling at us cause guys like you (and me) are arguing on FI about BULLSH*T!

The issues are out there... not within....

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Once again it's rez to alpos rescue.
Same old drivel... new day.

I'm glad you're happy with your performance and your other ineffective beauracratic weenies at alpo. But it is obvious to nearly everyone else (including airline management) that alpo is the sad punchline to a tragic joke.

So go ahead Nero play your fiddle while the shop burns down around you. Pretend things are grand at your club. Everyone else but you get's the joke you and alpo have become.

I will celebrate alpos demise. Sounds harsh?? Well the way I see it alpo has little to no usefulness left in the tank. It is no longer made up of leaders, but has become a sanctuary for ineffectual beauracrats. alpo is good at spending dues, but little else. Time for a new dog to enter the fray
So yes, I will celebrate its demise, the way I see it, it's been dead for several years anyway.

Cheers,

Quitter.

Another cynical member of the Quitters Klub, claiming victim status.

 

[pylut]

fiddle on Nero!
I have no use for you or alpo. That's not quitting. It's choosing not to associate with the loser (that being you).

 

[pylut]

ALPA does need changes. We need to grow and innovate

The only thing alpa needs to do is to finish dying.

That or get a backbone, however that doesn't seem likely. Even the NW flight attendants have more backbone.