Almost all Regional Pilots are Seriously Fatigued.....article

[General Lee]

DATE:31/03/10
SOURCE:Flight International
Almost all regional pilots are seriously fatigued

By David Learmount

An extensive survey of regional airline pilots, mostly in the USA but also in many other countries, has revealed that more than 96% regularly fly in a fatigued state.
US company Alertness and Performance Management (APM) presented the findings at the recent Flight Safety Foundation European Aviation Safety Seminar in Lisbon.

APM summarises the general findings, gleaned from the 1,359 responses, as follows: "The lifestyle of the regional airline pilot is characterised by low pay, long duty days, early morning departures, late night arrivals, short layovers/overnights, multiple take-offs and landings per duty period...these pilots are generally younger than their major airline counterparts [see pie chart], and have young, growing families."
The company says there is a dire need for airlines to apply fatigue risk management, and most pilots say they want it, but the carriers' sole guideline is national flight time limitations regulation, and sometimes union agreements.

The survey found that more than 28% of the regional airline pilots reported they have another job, in addition to flying, to boost their earnings. Some 41% commute from home to their base for the start of duty periods, many by air. Duty days average 8-12h for 70.4% of respondents, but 25.1% report an average for the six months of more than 12h/duty day. Some 40% of them flew 400h or more in the last six months, and 73% of all reported flights are less than 2h flying time, which suggests a high proportion of multiple-sector days.
Among the respondents, 58% were co-pilots and 42% captains, 76% of respondent pilots fly jet aircraft, and 33% have 3,000h or fewer in their logbooks.

Lack of roster predictability is a major source of stress for pilots. Monthly rosters are presented to nearly half the pilots less than a week before the month begins, and 3.3% are not provided with a schedule. A significant proportion - 15% of respondents - are "required" to be "available" and contactable when off-duty. APM found that nearly half the companies (48%) called the pilots when off duty at least twice during the last six months, and some had been called as many as five times.
Overnight rest times vary. Some 73% report that they normally get 10h or more off between duties, but 26.5% said they get fewer than 10h. Pilots all report that, when overnighting away from base, their rest time is deemed to begin 30min after landing, but it would be more realistic for it to begin at hotel check-in.


More than half the pilots say it takes over 60min to get to sleep at the hotel, with 71.3% saying they use television to help them relax before sleep, with 14.2% taking sleep medication and 13.8% admitting they resort to alcohol. Most pilots report waking once at night, and a quarter twice. When they have an early start, 76.7% say they worry about sleeping through the wake-up call, and 38.4% say they have reported late for duty in the past six months because of sleeping through it. Discipline for late duty arrival affected 18.3% of reporting pilots.

Nearly 60% of pilots said they believed they would face discipline if they declared themselves too fatigued to report for duty, and 96.7% said they frequently feel fatigued on final approach at the end of a duty day.




DAM SAM. Looks like you guys need some new "regs" on your side to help out, which also has the side affect of limiting what your airline can do. Talk about being between a rock and a hard place. Regardless, everyones' regs need to be fixed.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[JumpersAway]

DATE:31/03/10
SOURCE:Flight International
Almost all regional pilots are seriously fatigued

By David Learmount

An extensive survey of regional airline pilots, mostly in the USA but also in many other countries, has revealed that more than 96% regularly fly in a fatigued state.
US company Alertness and Performance Management (APM) presented the findings at the recent Flight Safety Foundation European Aviation Safety Seminar in Lisbon.

APM summarises the general findings, gleaned from the 1,359 responses, as follows: "The lifestyle of the regional airline pilot is characterised by low pay, long duty days, early morning departures, late night arrivals, short layovers/overnights, multiple take-offs and landings per duty period...these pilots are generally younger than their major airline counterparts [see pie chart], and have young, growing families."
The company says there is a dire need for airlines to apply fatigue risk management, and most pilots say they want it, but the carriers' sole guideline is national flight time limitations regulation, and sometimes union agreements.

The survey found that more than 28% of the regional airline pilots reported they have another job, in addition to flying, to boost their earnings. Some 41% commute from home to their base for the start of duty periods, many by air. Duty days average 8-12h for 70.4% of respondents, but 25.1% report an average for the six months of more than 12h/duty day. Some 40% of them flew 400h or more in the last six months, and 73% of all reported flights are less than 2h flying time, which suggests a high proportion of multiple-sector days.
Among the respondents, 58% were co-pilots and 42% captains, 76% of respondent pilots fly jet aircraft, and 33% have 3,000h or fewer in their logbooks.

Lack of roster predictability is a major source of stress for pilots. Monthly rosters are presented to nearly half the pilots less than a week before the month begins, and 3.3% are not provided with a schedule. A significant proportion - 15% of respondents - are "required" to be "available" and contactable when off-duty. APM found that nearly half the companies (48%) called the pilots when off duty at least twice during the last six months, and some had been called as many as five times.
Overnight rest times vary. Some 73% report that they normally get 10h or more off between duties, but 26.5% said they get fewer than 10h. Pilots all report that, when overnighting away from base, their rest time is deemed to begin 30min after landing, but it would be more realistic for it to begin at hotel check-in.


More than half the pilots say it takes over 60min to get to sleep at the hotel, with 71.3% saying they use television to help them relax before sleep, with 14.2% taking sleep medication and 13.8% admitting they resort to alcohol. Most pilots report waking once at night, and a quarter twice. When they have an early start, 76.7% say they worry about sleeping through the wake-up call, and 38.4% say they have reported late for duty in the past six months because of sleeping through it. Discipline for late duty arrival affected 18.3% of reporting pilots.

Nearly 60% of pilots said they believed they would face discipline if they declared themselves too fatigued to report for duty, and 96.7% said they frequently feel fatigued on final approach at the end of a duty day.




DAM SAM. Looks like you guys need some new "regs" on your side to help out, which also has the side affect of limiting what your airline can do. Talk about being between a rock and a hard place. Regardless, everyones' regs need to be fixed.


Bye Bye---General Lee

Yes, everyone's regs need to be fixed- mainline and regional alike...........

 

[WSurf]

This has gone on for years! Its no surprise! It will take a few more accidents before anything is really done. Its all about the dollar bill.....

 

[GogglesPisano]

I've flown long-haul international for many years now, and I can say without a doubt the biggest fatigue problems I've ever had in my career were at a regional -- on reserve.

Red-eyes are a close second.

 

[pilotyip]

European rest rules would be place to start. However there are always unintended consquences; it will then take more pilots to do the same flying. If prices rise to cover additional employees, then their will be fewer pax, thus a need for fewer pilots. It will be good for senior guys and bad for everyone else.

 

[Kalifornia]

European rest rules would be place to start. However there are always unintended consquences; it will then take more pilots to do the same flying. If prices rise to cover additional employees, then their will be fewer pax, thus a need for fewer pilots. It will be good for senior guys and bad for everyone else.

Golly geeze dude, you on occasion develop a conscious and keep your Roger Cohen mind on standy for a while only to reappear on here to play the devil of the Colgan crash victims. WTF, roger, over?? If I was an FAA inspector, I'd violate you for being in a professional aviation training department while playing devil's advocate on such serious topics as rest rules and MELs, and as punishment require you visit every grave site of the Colgan crash victims. I dare to look at any of those family members in the eyes and try and restate your absolute market economic theories on pilot compensation and work rules.

 

[goahead]

Hello new regs, goodbye naps and three days.

 

[pilotyip]

How about discussion?

If we can have a reasonable discussion, then bring in all sides without insults, name calling and all the other FI stuff. Is the end of fatigue a goal? I agree then lets bring it on, but I ask what is the limit of ultimate crew rest? Is it everyone only works when they feel rested; they can call fatigue at any time during a trip, and refuse any assignment because they are not rested? How about a stopping a non-stop JFK-LAX at OMA, because they feel fatigued from that exhausting 10 hour jumpseat commute to pick that trip at JFK. How about no flying between 2200 and 0800, make it against the law? How about those 16 hour int'l flights? Will there now be stops and crew changes at BIRK? Followed by a RO2N to be fully rested for that last leg into Europe. There is no rest policy that will keep a crew fresh for all flights. Forced company rest at the crew base in bunk 25B will make it legal but not solve the problem. Whatever solution is offered it will be less flying and more time away from home in a hotel room. I have no dog in this flight, but "unintended consequences" could have devastating effects on the industry.

 

[pipejockey]

Whatever solution is offered it will be less flying and more time away from home in a hotel room. I have no dog in this flight, but "unintended consequences" could have devastating effects on the industry.

Really? Well thats if we allow that in future contracts. What about the airlines having to put together some 60 to 70 hour lines that may be below min. guarantee? Egads, we can't have that now can we? That would mean the airline isn't getting every drop of blood from us, and they need their blood don't they!

 

[pilotyip]

Who will pay for it.

Really? Well thats if we allow that in future contracts. What about the airlines having to put together some 60 to 70 hour lines that may be below min. guarantee? Egads, we can't have that now can we? That would mean the airline isn't getting every drop of blood from us, and they need their blood don't they!

They have to fly their airplanes so many hours per month to generate X dollars, if you do that with Y crews averaging 80 hours per month, you will have 80Y=x. If you do it at 70 hours you will need (80/70)Y=x or 1.14% more crews to do the same flying. Now is everyone going to take a 14% pay cut to fly fewer hours, or does the airline raise its tickets prices by an amount to cover more crews doing the same flying? If they raise prices there will be fewer passengers, fewer airplanes, less flying, good for senior guys not so good for everyone else. In the end the consumer determines what an airline can charge for a tickets, not management, for labour. BTW If you the answers it is your duty to come into management and make it a better place for pilots to work. bTW Happy Easter everyone

 

[LegacyDriver]

I am stupid to wade into this but.............

I remember as an F/O we were four minutes short of mandatory comp rest due to weather diversions... Captain called fatigued. Scheduling argued with her to the end of the Earth so I called. I managed to get threatened with discipline etc. for calling in tired. Got about 30 mins extra rest out of them (which wasn't enough). Told them to pull the tape and give it to the director of screw scheduling... He called and said he listened to the tape...

"When you said the word 'fatigue' that should have been the end of it. Still, I don't know what the big deal is. It was an empty repo leg."

It was a live leg with 40+ in back and we were flat out dangerous. Stupid mistakes we would never have made with rest got us left and right. Thank goodness we kept catching each other or it mighta' been bad.

I guess if we had drilled the airplane into the ground with just the crew nobody would have cared.

Needless to say I will never do something like that again.

Crew rest is the elephant in the room that nobody wants to talk about, ESPECIALLY at the Regionals.

 

[sniper]

I've flown long-haul international for many years now, and I can say without a doubt the biggest fatigue problems I've ever had in my career were at a regional -- on reserve.

Red-eyes are a close second.

I thought Atlantic Coast was the best Regional?

 

[AvroJockey]

The new EU-Ops rules that went into effect in '08 are the standard the FAA needs to go by. I'm all for good ol' American productivity, but we're gambling with lives.

 

[pilotyip]

Thank You

The new EU-Ops rules that went into effect in '08 are the standard the FAA needs to go by. I'm all for good ol' American productivity, but we're gambling with lives.

Thank you a reasonable response. I agree, it would be good place to start, I am not against addressing the fatigue issue. But there are no rules that will prevent all fatigue, look at the Colgan F/O she would have been rested by any standard, it is what she did during her rest time that caused the fatigue. However like I said above there will unintended consequences due to the need for more crews to do the same flying.

 

[CX880]

However like I said above there will unintended consequences due to the need for more crews to do the same flying.

who cares. last time I heard pulling the ladder underneath from you is the name of this game. major airline pilots have done it before me and so will I. if a few CFIs have to instruct a little longer for us to be treated like human beings by the company then so be it. Just about everything they do is good for the senior guy and bad for the rest us. That's the whole point of a seniority system. If you think it isn't fair then go to some place that doesn't have a seniority system and get your knee pads ready.

 

[GogglesPisano]

I thought Atlantic Coast was the best Regional?

Did I ever say it was? Or wasn't?

 

[pilotyip]

who cares. last time I heard pulling the ladder underneath from you is the name of this game. major airline pilots have done it before me and so will I. if a few CFIs have to instruct a little longer for us to be treated like human beings by the company then so be it. Just about everything they do is good for the senior guy and bad for the rest us. That's the whole point of a seniority system. If you think it isn't fair then go to some place that doesn't have a seniority system and get your knee pads ready.

Sounds like you and I agree, with any change things will most likely will not be better for everyone. So a lot of those cheer leaders leading the charge for change may go "Oh! I didn't think this would happen". Like Zantop, "Once we get a union we will treated as professional pilots" Right on, furloughed when they pretended to go out of business. Watch out what you ask for, you might get it in a way you did not anticipate, I could go on, with things like scope, but we all know that stuff.

 

[Kalifornia]

If we can have a reasonable discussion, then bring in all sides without insults, name calling and all the other FI stuff. Is the end of fatigue a goal? I agree then lets bring it on, but I ask what is the limit of ultimate crew rest? Is it everyone only works when they feel rested; they can call fatigue at any time during a trip, and refuse any assignment because they are not rested? How about a stopping a non-stop JFK-LAX at OMA, because they feel fatigued from that exhausting 10 hour jumpseat commute to pick that trip at JFK. How about no flying between 2200 and 0800, make it against the law? How about those 16 hour int'l flights? Will there now be stops and crew changes at BIRK? Followed by a RO2N to be fully rested for that last leg into Europe. There is no rest policy that will keep a crew fresh for all flights. Forced company rest at the crew base in bunk 25B will make it legal but not solve the problem. Whatever solution is offered it will be less flying and more time away from home in a hotel room. I have no dog in this flight, but "unintended consequences" could have devastating effects on the industry.

Yea right, any reasonable person realizes your last sentence "I have no dog in this flight" is on par with the lies of Tiger Woods. You would like to go down in flames in your pathetic karma deserved career for being such a prick to the chance of this career being better in the future. You are the dog, the little purse dog your management team just loves to string along to treat pilots like numbers versus valuables. You would just wither in front of real professionals like Sulley. And wither even more in the face of people deeply affected by trash conditions people like yourself have promoted. I find it impossible to have a logical discussion who has yet to retract or apologize for direct FAR violations in suggesting a PIC should never challenge a MEL among other idiotic suggestions on here.

 

[pilotyip]

Interesting article in thid months BCA on Fatigue. Says napping in the cockpit is becoming more accepted. Something we have practicing for years in the night cargo business. FAA did study in the late 80's early 90's and recommend controlled sleeping in the cockpit was the best way to combat fatigue. They studied the occurrence of micro naps, these are naps that you have no control over, and you nod off. On crews studied who did not have controlled sleeping in the cockpit there were 147 occurrences of micro nap, a number of them during the approach phase. On the crews at foreign airlines that allowed sleeping in the cockpit, there were no occurrences of micro naps during the approach phase. The FAA recommended that controlled napping in the cockpit be adopted as US policy, however Gov’t officials felt that official recognition of sleeping on the job was un-American. Story of a mirco-nap. When you fly shifting schedules, you have to plan sleeping otherwise it is uncontrollable. Having one guy rest his eyes for 20 minutes, when other one knows it is going on does wonders for your ability to make that tight approach at the end of the night. However when everyone in the cockpit is asleep, that is scary. We used to fly these night and day patrols around Vietnam, terrible schedule, 12 hr flights, fly a day flight 12 hours off fly a night flight, 24 hrs off fly a day flight. 10 days in a row. One night off the south end of the country, at 0300, nothing is going on, no contacts, no chatter on the intercom, I am fighting off sleep and loosing, a mirco-nap hits and I nod off. I wake up, you do not know if it has been 30 seconds or 30 minutes, we are on the autopilot' at 1,500’, #1 engine in the bag to save fuel, and all 10 of the crew is asleep. Talk about being wide-awake, Where the are we? Now how do you wake up the PPC without letting him know you nodded off also? The F/E was also in the bag. So I called for "Coffee around for my friends" The point is the worse thing about sleeping in the cockpit is letting it sneak up on you, You know it might happen, plan on when it is going to happen, control it.

 

[DC8Driver]

I believe the EU rules are a great start. On the same token, having commuted much of my career, I was more tired from commuting than from the schedules. ALPO never wants to talk about that.
I'll never commute again.