Allegheny to be merged into Piedmont

[Dash8]

Wrap yourself tight in that blanket of hypocrisy, boys...looks to be a long, cold winter.

nice to see your such a great human being turtle
not surprisingly, no comment on my post

it is ironic for you to be accusing us of hypocrisy when you displayed the same ferver and disgust for the freedom guys that you accuse ALL of us of displaying towards you guys.
the irony being that, wsurf was right, MAG is everyone else's freedom, now tell me about hypocrisy turtle
no one forced you to agree to that contract of yours, or to agree to work at MAG in the first place.

 

[storminpilot]

http://www.pilots4fair.freeservers.com/

 

[Humphry]

With the merger of ALG & PDT, do you think this will open positions at PDT for pilots to be hired off the street? How is PDT set for pilots? I have several friends that fly for ALG and they told me (before the merger was announced) that ALG did not have enough pilots to fill their lines posted for February. Any insight or speculation?

 

[LearLove]

https://www.alleghenyairlines.com/cgi-bin/pdf.pl?file=kdh011404&session=4006a03e03d0cc5c

 

[LearLove]

https://www.alleghenyairlines.com/cgi-bin/pdf.pl?file=merger&session=4006a03e03d0cc5c

 

[LearLove]

Humphry,

41 aircraft at ALG and 41 at PDT

82 total

330 to 350 pilots at ALG
as of dec 2003 the PDT list shows 357

So we'll say 700 pilots all together. More than not by now its less due to people leaving.

At say 8.5 pilot per aircraft with 82 in the combined fleet that a requirement for 697 or 700 pilots. Everyone flys.

BUT!!!!!

Now PDT isn't going to loose any aircraft in 2004 and IF Alg goes to 18, that 41 plus 18 is 59 aircraft at 8.5 pilot/aircraft thats 501 pilots by the end of 2004/start of 2005.

 

[Whitestoneclimb]

"US Airways Group, Inc. announced today that it will consolidate the operations of two of its wholly owned subsidiaries, Allegheny a role in our network, but it is inefficient to have two wholly owned Dash-8 operators with duplicative overhead functions for a shrinking part of the company. We believe it provides the best outcome for our employees."


It's pretty pathetic that it took U management 15 years to figure this out. No wonder they're losing money.

 

[Whitestoneclimb]

Humphry,

41 aircraft at ALG and 41 at PDT

82 total

330 to 350 pilots at ALG
as of dec 2003 the PDT list shows 357

So we'll say 700 pilots all together. More than not by now its less due to people leaving.

At say 8.5 pilot per aircraft with 82 in the combined fleet that a requirement for 697 or 700 pilots. Everyone flys.

BUT!!!!!

Now PDT isn't going to loose any aircraft in 2004 and IF Alg goes to 18, that 41 plus 18 is 59 aircraft at 8.5 pilot/aircraft thats 501 pilots by the end of 2004/start of 2005.

As crappy as this whole situation is, the only fair way to integrate the seniority lists is straight date of hire. If the fleet plan reduction remains as previously stated, people are going to get furloughed. But would it be right for a 4 year F/O at ALG to get the axe over a 2 year F/O at PDT. I didn't think so either. Thats the nature of the business, like it or not. Please don't misconstrue this as ALG pilots deserve more/better. We don't. We deserve what is fair.

 

[B1900DFO]

so here's the big one....If Mesa buys alg/pdt does dat of hire apply? I think it should, but I'm sure there would be quite a bit of squaking from the mesa side....


---I'm sure this argument will raise more than a few peoples blood pressure...

 

[B1900DFO]

Does anybody know exactly what CCAir got in terms of seniority and benefits at Mesa. Turtle, weren't you ex-CCAir?

 

[Jetscream32]

First off let me say that I am hoping that everyone makes it out of this fiasco O.K.

My personal thoughts on why U is just now merging ALG and PDT is that they are preparing to sell of Express and that merger makes it easier to do. The Jan. 24th deadline may be in order to get buyers (i.e. JO) in line quick to make the payment to the government.

B1900DFO,

I was at CCair AFTER Mesa had already accquired us (April 1999 I think). The merged seniority list started from day one of the accquisition. Anyone hired after the takeover was merged by DOH and DOB is hire date is the same. Pilots at CCair prior to Mesa were merged at a 17:1 ratio, number 1 at CCair is now 17 on the combined list.

After talking to some union guys a buyout/merger/accquisition would open up contract talks for a new contract. JO is one stubborn SOB but the current Mesa contract could be improved with the new leverage. Merging lists would take place via ALPA merger policy which deals with career expectations and such. You would probably see something similar to the CCair merger IF a deal goes through. You have to remember also that JO loves his money and a new contract means less money for him. That being said, a merged contract could take a long time to be negotiated and who knows what JO would do in the mean time while he stalls to keep all pilot groups seperate.

I hate to see this happen to the WO pilots but please quit giving us the finger as you taxi by (true, I have had it three times in two months) and glaring looks in the crew room. I realize it is the minority but it makes a bunch look very unprofessional.

 

[91100 100 set]

Geez, I go away on a two day trip and all hell breaks loose. For a long time (since the 3 WO's got the same dog-and-pony show all at the same time about taking concessions and giving in to J4J), I just figured that whole mess was purely business (give the new planes to the cheapest operator, and we all know who got 'em). No longer. I'm sure some of you, but not all, are aware of the huge shift in the ALG's union leadership as a result of our contract. By a 5 to 3 margin, our group was being handled by what you could call hardliners running on anger and emotion, and some conspriracy theorists think that our negotiating chair (a non-voting member) was running the show with the MEC chairman (also, a non-voting member), and turning a deaf ear to the voting members who didn't agree with their "screw-em agenda". This attitude apparently made our MEC very difficult to work with and I think now we (ALG) have been given this ultimatum to thank us for all the hassle...

It remains to be seen whether our "union brothers" at PDT will see things from a standpoint of union solidarity and not "whats in it for me" (18 new planes transfered from ALG makes for alot of upgrades if they dont' take any pilots). Of course, all those MBA's at Airways probably have about a dozen ways to merge the two without making it a true merger, making any ALPA merger policy null and void. I'll just say that whatever happens between the two, I want to remind to everybody that what goes around comes around.

In any event, I'm sure we'll all be flying for Mesa by years end anyway. The golden children at PSA too. Then we'll all see firsthand why they are despised industry wide...

 

[FR8mastr]

91-100 maybe you can explain to the group how non voting members can actually control an MEC. Because I know that all actions taken in the last 9 months have all been unanimous in vote. (all 8) While your at it please explain how one becomes a "hardliner" just because one actually expects the company to follow the contract that they signed.

 

[LearLove]

I may be wrong but by my research looking at the sen. list of both PDT and ALG that there will NOT be a windfall of upgrades for the ALG group. At PDT there are 220 or so guys w/ a DOH sen. to me. Thats about the same here at ALG. So by merging DOH I'd remain about the same, correct? Just another downgraded guy that will remain downgraded if the lists go DOH.

 

[FranktheTank]

Turtle,

Ha ha ha, you no talent a$$ clown. Seriosly man, you have the nerve to say now we know what its like to walk in your shoes. Hey dumba$$, you went to the store and bought the shoes yourself. Is someone forcing you to work for Mesa? Do you not have a union and can't get a better contract? Oh wait, my bad, you wore$ voted in that contract yourself, and now your whining like like a grade schooler who pi$$ed their pants. Well, sit in your pee. Its been previously said that not everyone that works for Mesa is a pole smoker, and they're not. Check out the crewroom more often, there are quite a few Mesa guys who are friends with PDT and ALG guys, but its especially the clowns like you we don't like. Go sit on your thumb and whipe JO's chowder off your face, and keep you badge turned around. If I were you I'd do the same thing. You brought this upon your self. Career suicide.

 

[the turtle]

Wow. Must have hit a nerve....the purple ooze is comming your way, whether you like it or not.

As far as consessions, which Mesa didn't take, I might add, why did you guys agree to concessions? Save your job, right? Mighty hypocritical, your venom directed our way.

 

[westy1]

I am a junior captain at Piedmont. From our side of the fence we are all a little worried about this as well. None of us wants to see any WO pilot lose their jobs due to the mismanagement of Airways. We have been hearing that the whole merger thing is being driven by Airways needing a new certificate for Mid-Atlantic or something. I believe that Airways management would love nothing more than to see ALG liquidated so they have a solution to the certificate problems. As for the merger stuff we really don't have much of an opinion because we are too busy working every waking minute of the day. Everyone at ALG got a taste of the conditions here when we hired some of the ALG pilots. Let me tell you all that the conditions here are terrible. I have been here for five years and have watched what was once a great regional airline become a shell of its former self. I know it would be a job for the ALG pilots but if you have another option TAKE IT.